⚽ The Official Euro 2024 Thread | 🇪🇦 reyes de Europa thanks to 2 🇨🇵 players | 🏴 lose a Euro final for the 2nd time in a row :wow:
The axe murderer
For I am death and I ride on a pale horse
yeah the turkish economic crisis 2018 increased this. they got the vast majority of syrian refugees. And we all know how it goesthey're Turkish supreme nationalists, patriots
Turks are very nationalistic as is.
Now given the big Turkish populations in Austria/Germany it complicates things.
Watch their fans flash that sign in unison against the Netherlands, oh and Erdogan is going to the game
But there are shades of grey with them no pun. They are anti-Kurd, anti-Syrian given the refugees and their economy going through it, and have a distrust if not outright disdain towards Arabs. And its not a one size fits all, not all secular or all islamic. its a cross section.
My brother is more learned about this stuff so ill ask him. But i think what i provided is a decent poor man's description of things.
The axe murderer
For I am death and I ride on a pale horse
Ronaldo right now
Omerta
All Star
they're Turkish supreme nationalists, patriots
Turks are very nationalistic as is.
Now given the big Turkish populations in Austria/Germany it complicates things.
Watch their fans flash that sign in unison against the Netherlands, oh and Erdogan is going to the game
But there are shades of grey with them no pun. They are anti-Kurd, anti-Syrian given the refugees and their economy going through it, and have a distrust if not outright disdain towards Arabs. And its not a one size fits all, not all secular or all islamic. its a cross section.
My brother is more learned about this stuff so ill ask him. But i think what i provided is a decent poor man's description of things.
I remember you called me a clown on a recent Drake thread when all I literally said was that my job professionally has been studying and writing about the far right. Irrelevant, but funny since I didn’t respond to you then and quoting you here to maybe add to what you wrote.
The Grey Wolf shyt is complicated and make no mistake, this is all because of Germany pressuring UEFA because of their feelings on Turks and them trying to suppress Turkish fans right now re: P*lestine.
That hand sign is mostly associated to Nationalism and Anti-Arab sentiment, but some of it is warranted. I’m not talking about the recent shyt with Syrians and Kurds, that is dumb and hateful. But the historical connotation is fully justified, in association to Khaleejis. The Arabs were under the Ottoman Empire, and then during the Arab Revolt, they sold out and betrayed the Ottomans by siding with the British and French. The Brit’s had promised Arab (Khaleeji) leader Sharif Hussein an Arab state for him to run. Halfway during the war and betrayal, the Brit’s plans was “leaked” - these plans were that it wasn’t going to one singular Arab state, but rather a bunch of small ones. The Balfour Declaration was also leaked, where P*lestine would become a z1onist state…despite finding this out, the Arabs (Khaleejis) STILL fought on the side of the Brits against the Ottomans (Turks). Arabs/Brits won, and the Brits betrayed them and did as the leaks had implied- and partitioned off the Arab lands to a bunch of different families which is now modern day Jordan, Saudi Arabia, UAE etc (Khaleejis). So the Turks have every right to have resentment toward Arabs.
Over time, that movement has been infiltrated and taken over by dumb and un-educated Turks (secular pro Ataturk groups) who also dislike Syrians, Kurds etc. when they had nothing to do with the fall of the Ottomans, that was just the Khaleejis. Irony is that Ataturk groups don’t even like the Ottomans or religion.
But again, understand this suspension is all about Germany. This week, they passed a law that any refugee who LIKES a social media post that is Pro-P*lestine, they will be deported. Germany is having real issue trying to control Turks in Germany protesting about P*lestine. It’s also a move to make Erdogan look bad, as he’s having issues in Türkiye right now trying to control this anti-Syrian attacks that are occurring and fuelled by his opposition.
Just in case anyone cares.
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Fukk UEFA, let Demiral play.
When they started picking sides with what political messages are allowed that’s when I lost it with them.
When they started picking sides with what political messages are allowed that’s when I lost it with them.
"under the Ottoman Empire" does a lot of heavy lifting
They were ruled by the Ottomans point blank. The Arabs had several wars against Ottomans during their rule and several times, the states they tried to established were squashed by Ottomans.
Arabs didn't betray them or sell them out, they simply played the geopolitical game and sided with the French and British because the latter were fighting the Ottoman Empire in WWI as it had sided with Germany.
And the Arabs were right (for themselves) because the Ottoman rule ended. Now it didn't end up in some super Arab state because the British betrayed the Arabs, that you're right.
I figured this is all what is was about. Some BS. Europe isn’t the liberal bastion its purported.
I see why @null stay on the Fukk Germany P.
Omerta
All Star
"under the Ottoman Empire" does a lot of heavy lifting
They were ruled by the Ottomans point blank. The Arabs had several wars against Ottomans during their rule and several times, the states they tried to established were squashed by Ottomans.
Arabs didn't betray them or sell them out, they simply played the geopolitical game and sided with the French and British because the latter were fighting the Ottoman Empire in WWI as it had sided with Germany.
And the Arabs were right (for themselves) because the Ottoman rule ended. Now it didn't end up in some super Arab state because the British betrayed the Arabs, that you're right.
Disagree with you bro. You are right that me saying “Arabs were just under the Ottomans” was not fair though, but I was trying to keep my post shorter.
Arab nationalism toward the latter the stages of the Ottoman Empire was not organic and was driven by British/French interference and propaganda, this was confirmed by two of their primary agents in TE Lawrence and Gertrude Bell.
When the Arab revolt began, most of the Arab population didn’t side with the revolt. The Brits original plan of staying in the background and letting the Arabs do the heavy lifting changed because of it, and they had to get involved directly, and b*mbing places like the Hejaz railway which most consider as the turning point was them.
If we were to even pretend ALL the Arabs were pro revolt, it still doesn’t change they were played like dummies. They were promised deal A, during the war deal B was revealed and the Arabs STILL went forward and at the end it was deal B that they were given which they had never agreed to. And Deal B was selling off the entire area to a handful of powerful families because they were “descendants of the prophet” (Saud, Hashemites etc).
Ask Arabs how they feel about each one of those families that run those countries now, especially Saudi Arabia, Jordan, UAE who are Western puppets and openly work with and support Isra*l. I find it funny the West says “ohh there’s no democracy in the Middle East”…mf YOU put these governments together the way it is.
Look at Iraq, kicked the Hashemites out the first chance they had.
null
...
and that ain't the half of what they do ...
with the far right cooking up ideas for T - "remigration"
I wasn't disagreeing with the finer details, you know better than me there.
My point was just about how you presented the Ottoman rule as some some sort of agreement between Arabs and Ottomans ("sell out", "betray").
LeaveMyHairLineAlone
Superstar
LeaveMyHairLineAlone
Superstar
its not banned in germany, though there have been attempts to ban it.
it is banned in austria though
i think saying arab nationalism was completely inorganic leading up to world war i is taking it a bit far. it was certainly elite-driven though and not something the majority of arabs in the ottoman empire were personally invested in, but i think the same is generally true of nationalist movements in general. especially in empires that are breaking down, they are usually political expressions of the elite segment of an ethnic group.
i think a very important detail was that after the CUP came to power (technically it started before then but that greatly accelerated it) the Ottoman Empire began transitioning more toward the model of a turkish nation-state that eventually led to the turkish republic. as a result being a muslim in the empire was becoming much less important and being ethnically turkish (or more a accurately turkish-speaking muslim because turkish ethnic identity wasn’t fully established yet) was becoming much more important. for arab muslims this meant they would eventually become more politically marginalized in the empire. so this probably made them less invested in the ottoman state and more willing to collaborate with allied powers to try to achieve their own state as the international environment was moving from empires to nation-states