Essential The Official Comic Book Discussion Thread [Support @Neuromancer’s book!]

[Jmare007]

THat shyt has taken forever. I always have to go back and read the previous issue just to make sure I am fully up to speed when a new issue comes out.

It's taking so long that #10 felt like a summary issue that you would need to read to understand the story.

I really liked it by itself and it sure as hell makes the next 2 issues can't miss imo. But when I look back at the other 9 issues, it makes NO SENSE this book was so long, like half of what has been told by Johns seems to be meaningless or just filler. Spending so much time with the new Rorschach seems completely unnecessary in hindsight

Then again, I have to wonder if Johns had to tweak the story once the plan of lining up Doomsday Clock with every main line book and make it a huge part of continuity was dropped. We spent like 7 issues with the superhuman conspiracy story and at the end of the day this whole thing is about Dr. Manhattan being with the DCU and trolling the fukk out of it to see what might happen.

 

[Woodrow]

So basically the entire point of Heroes in Crisis was to make Wally West into a mass murderer? Because I am trying to figure out any other reason for it's existence and I am coming up short.

that wasn't the point at all.

as one of the few people (i guess) who really enjoyed heroes in crisis, it's really disappointing to see so many fans paint broad strokes over the narrative because a writer did something to a character that they dont approve of.

the irony there, is that king speaks DIRECTLY to this issue as part of the narrative within the book.

so many heroes were so hung up on what wally's return meant to them, no one really bothered to question what he was dealing with losing his most cherished loved ones in the process. wally was hope. rebirth. that's all he was to them, because of how he made THEM feel. but how many asked him how it felt to lose his wife and his kids?

how many writers (save for the buildup to HiC in Flash) before king actually tried to tackle what that might do to a person's pysche?

conversely, so many fans are so stuck on what wally means to them as a character, what he "stands for". they refuse to acknowledge that all of us have the potential to have everything we aspire to be undone by a bad decision, or in this case a mistake tied to mental health issues. any single person, faced with issues they can't deal with on their own, has the potential to become someone unrecognizable to those who care about them. that's why mental health is such a serious issue! in wally's case, it doesn't make him a monster. it just means he needs help.

it also means the true mark of his character will shine through in whatever way he bounces back from this.

look at all the people he's surrounded by at the end. each of them has made horrible decisions (some without repent) in their own right, and each has found redemption. shyt, booster gold damn-near wrote batman out of continuity less than a year ago, and he's one of the biggest heroes in this book. wally will bounce back, because that's what heroes do. hopefully, it will come as a result of a writer willing to help him heal from what happened in HiC, as opposed to just retconning his mistakes away.

is the series perfect? fukk no. in hindsight i think framing it as a murder mystery was disingenuous. i dont think clay mann was the right artist for a series with such serious tones (too much beefcake). and i also think this would have functioned much better in a graphic novel format; one of the biggest issues imo is that we kept waiting for cliffhangers to be un-hangered each month, and it just wasnt that kind of story.

there are other execution issues as well. that said, i really appreciate what king did here. as someone who hated when marvel wrote out spidey's marriage, who can still pick apart 100 things wrong with how they did it, i know in hindsight it was justified by three words: superior spider-man.

if someone is willing to tackle and continue the conversation king has started here, i think this can be further justified in the long run too,

 

[AquaCityBoy]

Last week when Tom King was announced to be leaving Batman, I thought that was sad. Even though I wasn't a fan, I thought he at least should have been able to finish his run (I know he's getting the Batman/Catwoman book, but that'll still be short of his planned 100-issue epic).

After Heroes in Crisis #9, I don't blame them. Tom King needs to go. If this is how he ends one controversial book, I don't even want to know bad he botches the end of his Batman run.

fukk everybody at DC Comics for this bullshyt. fukk Tom King for being a one-trick pony who can't write about anything but PTSD even when it makes no sense, fukk Dan DiDio and Bob Haras for approving and mandating this shyt, fukk Geoff Johns for leaving and allowing DiDio to go full retard, fukk Gary Frank for taking 20 years to finish Doomsday Clock which necessitated this bullshyt, and fukk Jim Lee too, just because.

This is the worst comic book of 2019. Unless the rest of the year is full of garbage, you cannot tell me otherwise.

 

[Mr. Negative]

The polarization of the last two posts

 

[Bigbigguy]

Last week when Tom King was announced to be leaving Batman, I thought that was sad. Even though I wasn't a fan, I thought he at least should have been able to finish his run (I know he's getting the Batman/Catwoman book, but that'll still be short of his planned 100-issue epic).

After Heroes in Crisis #9, I don't blame them. Tom King needs to go. If this is how he ends one controversial book, I don't even want to know bad he botches the end of his Batman run.

fukk everybody at DC Comics for this bullshyt. fukk Tom King for being a one-trick pony who can't write about anything but PTSD even when it makes no sense, fukk Dan DiDio and Bob Haras for approving and mandating this shyt, fukk Geoff Johns for leaving and allowing DiDio to go full retard, fukk Gary Frank for taking 20 years to finish Doomsday Clock which necessitated this bullshyt, and fukk Jim Lee too, just because.

This is the worst comic book of 2019. Unless the rest of the year is full of garbage, you cannot tell me otherwise.

 

[BXKingPin82]

Just ordered these joints from ToyWiz.

 

[nightwing2016]

I'm currently enjoying Uncanny X Men, The Immortal Hulk and Captain America right now. The Writing by Coates and Ewing is unfukkwitable.

Ewing is doing Us Hulk Fans Justice, surprised fukk Boys ain't crying like when Greg Pak Gaves us Green Scar and The World Breaker.

Hulk is once again the Monster of Marvel, I enjoyed when he nearly killed Iron Man and had him pleading for his life and cracked Thor shyt with one punch that fractured his skull and called Hulk a God and also smacked the shyt out Black Panther so hard that his Vibranium Suit overload (which is nearly impossible) and almost killed him

These are Hulk Most Powerful Incarnation's Savage Hulk, Mastero, The Green Scar, The World Breaker, The Immortal Hulk aka Devil Hulk

Yo, i’m Enjoying the hell out of immortal hulk to. This latest issue where Bruce wants to name this incarnation of the hulk Mastero had me like . That new abomination form next three issues are about to be

 

[nightwing2016]

Not even gonna bother getting caught up on Uncanny and Age of X-Man now that they're getting immediately thrown out when Hickman takes over.

Same reason I stopped copping them despite being an x-men stan

 

[parallax]

Yo, i’m Enjoying the hell out of immortal hulk to. This latest issue where Bruce wants to name this incarnation of the hulk Mastero had me like . That new abomination form next three issues are about to be

It's always crazy just how more fukked up these organizations chasing Bruce end up being. I knew abomination was gonna be a trip but I wasn't expecting.....that

 

[John Reena]

Last week when Tom King was announced to be leaving Batman, I thought that was sad. Even though I wasn't a fan, I thought he at least should have been able to finish his run (I know he's getting the Batman/Catwoman book, but that'll still be short of his planned 100-issue epic).

After Heroes in Crisis #9, I don't blame them. Tom King needs to go. If this is how he ends one controversial book, I don't even want to know bad he botches the end of his Batman run.

fukk everybody at DC Comics for this bullshyt. fukk Tom King for being a one-trick pony who can't write about anything but PTSD even when it makes no sense, fukk Dan DiDio and Bob Haras for approving and mandating this shyt, fukk Geoff Johns for leaving and allowing DiDio to go full retard, fukk Gary Frank for taking 20 years to finish Doomsday Clock which necessitated this bullshyt, and fukk Jim Lee too, just because.

This is the worst comic book of 2019. Unless the rest of the year is full of garbage, you cannot tell me otherwise.

Dayum!

 

[Jello Biafra]

Well, it was rumored before HiC started that Wally was gonna join the Suicide Squad. It's looking about 90% right now

If the awfulness of Heroes in Crisis gets James Gunn to do an audible and include Wally West in the new Suicide Squad movie I will forgive and forget everything.

 

[Jello Biafra]

that wasn't the point at all.

as one of the few people (i guess) who really enjoyed heroes in crisis, it's really disappointing to see so many fans paint broad strokes over the narrative because a writer did something to a character that they dont approve of.

the irony there, is that king speaks DIRECTLY to this issue as part of the narrative within the book.

so many heroes were so hung up on what wally's return meant to them, no one really bothered to question what he was dealing with losing his most cherished loved ones in the process. wally was hope. rebirth. that's all he was to them, because of how he made THEM feel. but how many asked him how it felt to lose his wife and his kids?

how many writers (save for the buildup to HiC in Flash) before king actually tried to tackle what that might do to a person's pysche?

conversely, so many fans are so stuck on what wally means to them as a character, what he "stands for". they refuse to acknowledge that all of us have the potential to have everything we aspire to be undone by a bad decision, or in this case a mistake tied to mental health issues. any single person, faced with issues they can't deal with on their own, has the potential to become someone unrecognizable to those who care about them. that's why mental health is such a serious issue! in wally's case, it doesn't make him a monster. it just means he needs help.

it also means the true mark of his character will shine through in whatever way he bounces back from this.

look at all the people he's surrounded by at the end. each of them has made horrible decisions (some without repent) in their own right, and each has found redemption. shyt, booster gold damn-near wrote batman out of continuity less than a year ago, and he's one of the biggest heroes in this book. wally will bounce back, because that's what heroes do. hopefully, it will come as a result of a writer willing to help him heal from what happened in HiC, as opposed to just retconning his mistakes away.

is the series perfect? fukk no. in hindsight i think framing it as a murder mystery was disingenuous. i dont think clay mann was the right artist for a series with such serious tones (too much beefcake). and i also think this would have functioned much better in a graphic novel format; one of the biggest issues imo is that we kept waiting for cliffhangers to be un-hangered each month, and it just wasnt that kind of story.

there are other execution issues as well. that said, i really appreciate what king did here. as someone who hated when marvel wrote out spidey's marriage, who can still pick apart 100 things wrong with how they did it, i know in hindsight it was justified by three words: superior spider-man.

if someone is willing to tackle and continue the conversation king has started here, i think this can be further justified in the long run too,

A deep dive into Wally West fragile psyche would have been a welcome story but to use a very shallow view of the psychosis of grief as part of a shytty murder mystery plot gave us the failure that was HiC.

This all feels familiar to the pushback I saw to people who didn't like the handling of Daenerys on the final season of Game of Thrones.
My issue was never with Daenerys going crazy, it was always with how poorly her journey to madness was handled.
Similarly I am not bothered by where Wally ended up in HiC, my problem was with how terribly Tom King handled the journey of Walky going crazy.

 

[Legal]

Last week when Tom King was announced to be leaving Batman, I thought that was sad. Even though I wasn't a fan, I thought he at least should have been able to finish his run (I know he's getting the Batman/Catwoman book, but that'll still be short of his planned 100-issue epic).

After Heroes in Crisis #9, I don't blame them. Tom King needs to go. If this is how he ends one controversial book, I don't even want to know bad he botches the end of his Batman run.

fukk everybody at DC Comics for this bullshyt. fukk Tom King for being a one-trick pony who can't write about anything but PTSD even when it makes no sense, fukk Dan DiDio and Bob Haras for approving and mandating this shyt, fukk Geoff Johns for leaving and allowing DiDio to go full retard, fukk Gary Frank for taking 20 years to finish Doomsday Clock which necessitated this bullshyt, and fukk Jim Lee too, just because.

This is the worst comic book of 2019. Unless the rest of the year is full of garbage, you cannot tell me otherwise.

I think my main problem is that while all the stuff in the post above this one is true, it all feels pretty boilerplate.

This isn't anything new, so it feels cheap to a lot of people to see something like this happen to a character that so many people loved, and whose return signalled a supposed return of hopefulness to DC.

I get it. Heroes are fukked up mentally just like everyone else, maybe even moreso.

But they half-assed making Wally a murderer by not actually having him really carry out the act, but by accidentally losing control for a moment, and having the Speed Force do it. It's like they couldn't decide to go all the way with it, and then decided to settle on what was basically a hamfisted metaphor for what it feels like for some people when PTSD drives them to physical violence.

But having the end be him forgiving himself so that he learns that he's not alone, but still end up in custody is wild too. It's like it doesn't know if it's trying to say that those who suffer from PTSD are unfortunate souls who sometimes have no control due to their trauma, or if they should be held fully accountable for all their actions, and does both.

So in the end, it doesn't say or do anything truly unique on the mental health front, actually villifies someone suffering from mental trauma, and then kind of sits back says "Man, shyt is deep"

So, basically it's the Mal from Joe Budden Podcast talking about mental health of comic books.

 

[Waterproof]

Yo, i’m Enjoying the hell out of immortal hulk to. This latest issue where Bruce wants to name this incarnation of the hulk Mastero had me like . That new abomination form next three issues are about to be

The New Issue is Out

You jivin me

 

[OmegaK2099]

The ending to the last issue of spider man, what a kick in the dikk