Essential The Official Boxing Random Thoughts Thread...All boxing heads ENTER.
- Thread starter Jesus Is Lord
- Start date
Knicksman20
Superstar
I had it 116-112 for Canelo
I can definitely see it that way or a little closer depending on how your scored a few rounds that were closer.
Leo Santa Cruz Wants Lomachenko, Russell, Selby, Cuellar
By Miguel Rivera
WBA featherweight champion Leo Santa Cruz (31-0-1, 17KOs) is looking for the big names at 126-pounds and wants to unify the division. Santa Cruz had one of his biggest wins in August when he won a twelve round unanimous decision over Abner Mares in a long anticipated bout in Southern California.
Santa Cruz spoke to his manager, Al Haymon,who told his boxer that a date in late January or mid-February was likely for his next fight.
"I started training, I still have no exact date....just that I might come back in late January or mid-February. I spoke to my manager and he told me that, and I started today to train. Obviously the first day is always difficult, you get tired fast, and I had a little bit of a bad flu, but I'll be okay," Santa Cruz said to ESPN Deportes.
Santa Cruz is looking for all of the big names at 126, at or outside of the featherweight division.
"The truth is I asked my manager for the best fights. I think my best is yet to come in 2016, I want to unify with Lee Selby (IBF), Jesus Cuellar (WBA), Vasyl Lomachenko (WBO), Gary Russell (WBC ), including a rematch with Abner Mares," Santa Cruz said.
"At 126 pounds I feel pretty good, pretty strong. I want to make a few more fights at 126 pounds, and when the body starts asking me to go to super featherweight I'll go, but I really do not see that happening in 2016."
- See more at: Leo Santa Cruz Wants Lomachenko, Russell, Selby, Cuellar -Boxing News
GREENandYELLOW
2x...and defending
And if I remember correctly, Gonzalez deserved the decision in that fight too.cant believe pascal struggled with Yunieski Gonzalez..dudes just a limited sloppy slugger
TheLukieBaby
Pro
ChocolateGiddyUp
Superstar
Edwin Rodriguez got 1 million to fight Andre Ward on HBO
Why tf would Barrera accept 300k
Why tf would Barrera accept 300k
Edwin Rodriguez got 1 million to fight Andre Ward on HBO
Why tf would Barrera accept 300k
Edwin Rodriguez was also 24-0, a Top 10 RING ranked opponent, fighting against Ward in a Championship fight at a time when Ward was doing good rating numbers on HBO, and had his purse negotiated by his advisor....Al Haymon
Barrera is only 17-0, unranked by RING, attempting to face Ward in a non-title bout in which Ward's ratings are still a TBD at this point on HBO
Not the same
TheLukieBaby
Pro
Andre Ward being a real person attending amateur fight in Bay Area
Julian Williams: The PBC Boogeyman
by Steve Kim | Dec 22, 2015
Photo Credit: Stephanie Trapp/TrappFotos/SHOWTIME®
As it stands now, young junior middleweight contender Julian “J Rock” Williams is still searching for a dance partner to kick off his 2016. Currently, he is in the process of getting involved in an IBF title eliminator, which means he must face the highest available – and willing – contender in the organization’s 154-pound rankings.
It was hoped that third ranked Michel Soro would take the assignment but, for whatever reason, that never came to fruition. Recently the focus turned to the seventh ranked Vanes Martirosyan, who would perhaps face the sixth ranked boxer-puncher from Philadelphia. It was, at least in theory, an easy fight to make, given both are advised by Al Haymon and under the Premier Boxing Champions umbrella.
Judging by the comments of Williams’ trainer/manager, Stephen Edwards, it seems like Martirosyan was not happy with the money being offered.
But here’s the real issue: Williams is simply too much risk for the reward being offered. And as it relates to his PBC colleagues who are paid well to blow out carefully hand-picked cannon fodder on various platforms, Williams is a boogeyman. Hey, there’s a reason why some/many of them flocked to Haymon – he provides vast exposure and, just as important, hefty paydays for relatively low risk bouts.
With this comes a certain sense of entitlement that is bound to seep into a fighter’s psyche. Yeah, Haymon can take his horses to water but he can’t make them drink – or fight tough. By consistently over-paying (which I know is a relative term and difficult to define) and undermatching his clients, has softened these guys to a point where they are much more like accountants than gladiators. Yeah, it may seem like a rather harsh statement but as Bill Belichick would say, it is what it is. With Waddell & Reed’s backing, they have fostered this environment.
Williams and his trainer are Philadelphia throwbacks in many ways. As you see them work, there is a respect and dedication to the craft and there is a real substance to Williams as a fighter, a certain well-rounded nature to his game. The 25-year old is a historian of the sport, who is constantly and currently studying the greats. Matchmakers will tell you privately that Williams will be a tough out for years to come because of his overall skill set.
His current record stands at 21-0-1 (13) and this past year, he handily defeated the trio of Joey Hernandez (UD 10), Arman Ovsepyan (TKO 6) and Luciano Cuello (TKO 1). No, this isn’t a formidable lot but 2015 was supposed to be another developmental year for Williams, who has yearned for meaningful fights versus those higher up on the food chain.
He has wanted Austin Trout since the beginning of this year and Trout was even shipped in to be a part of the PBC broadcast crew for the show on which Williams blasted out Cuello in one round back in September. They shared an exchange after this fight in which Trout argued for “high risk, gotta get the high reward,” something Joey Hernandez, Luis Galarza and Luis Grajeda certainly aren’t as Trout racks up one six-figure payday after another.
Several months back, Williams got into a rather memorable Twitter sparring match with Ishe Smith – who just recently fought off-TV against Tommy Rainone last Friday night – who stated, with his exalted position in boxing and his past seven-figure paydays this young buck was beneath him.
Both Charlo brothers (Jermall holds the IBF 154-pound title and Jermell holds the No. 2 position) have made it clear that they really have no interest – even after Williams had offered to face them in Houston like he did in this tweet (@JRockboxing):
“I respect @FutureOfBoxing an we cool but this is the kinda fights boxing needs its for legacy money an braggin rights YES ILL GO 2 HOUSTON?”
He added the following:
“The fact that I hav to fight an eliminator just to fight @FutureOfBoxing should tell the boxin world exactly what’s happening open ya eyes”
Williams, who normally isn’t the boisterous type, then tweeted this a few weeks ago:
“PPL say he ain’t fightin nobody well how tf can I fight somebody if the whole stable is saying why I gotta fight jrock cuz I’m 21-0 DATWHY”
And then Williams delivered this message to Martirosyan as the latter turned down the fight:
“@VanesBoxing you can bullshyt Twitter but u can’t bullshyt me I’m not gonna argue wit u but don’t make me expose the truth”
Just the same, Edwards (@BreadmanBoxing) was in no mood to coddle either:
“@VanesBoxing best of luck vanes. You’re a nice kid but we have moved on. I don’t let jrock wait around. Your numbers were insane.”
Yeah, he’s getting a bit frustrated but time is on his side. But what’s telling is he even retweeted this from Yours Truly (@steveucnlive) over the weekend: “The way PBC fighters are flat out ducking (yes, ducking) Julian Williams is shameful. #boxing” And thanks, Julian, much appreciated.
But back to the point: It’s interesting that Trout, Martirosyan and the Charlos are so dismissive of Williams. It would be understandable if these were individuals like middleweight champion Saul Alvarez, Miguel Cotto or IBF/WBA middleweight titlist Gennady Golovkin – who are legitimate attractions. The aforementioned first threesome are guys who play in small venues, to minuscule audiences and, quite frankly, don’t have much of a following. To guys like “Canelo” and Cotto, these guys aren’t even B or C-sides to their A-sides.
One thing that is very noticeable as you deal with Williams and Edwards: They are extremely bright, intelligent individuals. Beyond that, however, they have a certain wisdom and perspective that belie their years in the sport. They seem to be very reasonable in their demands and understand their current standing in the sport. And trust me: That is a rarity in this often bizarre business. Edwards has made it clear time and time again that they are willing to take less than 50 percent versus Trout because they have an understanding that they still need victories like this to move up the food chain.
But it takes two to tango.
These Philadelphia throwbacks are unfortunately stuck in the new millennium boxing business. Yeah, news flash. Boxing has always been a business but never has it been so apparent as fighters themselves are now exhibiting the caution of managers (whose job it is to be risk-averse). Making it worse is there is a new breed of “fan-ager” who praises such behavior as if somehow he gets a financial cut.
Williams should voice his concerns and frustrations to Haymon. The problem is many of those same guys he wants to face are hiding behind the exact same man.
Julian Williams: The PBC Boogeyman - Undisputed Champion Network
@patscorpio must've helped pen the 2nd half of this article or at least gave it his stamp of approval
by Steve Kim | Dec 22, 2015
Photo Credit: Stephanie Trapp/TrappFotos/SHOWTIME®
As it stands now, young junior middleweight contender Julian “J Rock” Williams is still searching for a dance partner to kick off his 2016. Currently, he is in the process of getting involved in an IBF title eliminator, which means he must face the highest available – and willing – contender in the organization’s 154-pound rankings.
It was hoped that third ranked Michel Soro would take the assignment but, for whatever reason, that never came to fruition. Recently the focus turned to the seventh ranked Vanes Martirosyan, who would perhaps face the sixth ranked boxer-puncher from Philadelphia. It was, at least in theory, an easy fight to make, given both are advised by Al Haymon and under the Premier Boxing Champions umbrella.
Judging by the comments of Williams’ trainer/manager, Stephen Edwards, it seems like Martirosyan was not happy with the money being offered.
But here’s the real issue: Williams is simply too much risk for the reward being offered. And as it relates to his PBC colleagues who are paid well to blow out carefully hand-picked cannon fodder on various platforms, Williams is a boogeyman. Hey, there’s a reason why some/many of them flocked to Haymon – he provides vast exposure and, just as important, hefty paydays for relatively low risk bouts.
With this comes a certain sense of entitlement that is bound to seep into a fighter’s psyche. Yeah, Haymon can take his horses to water but he can’t make them drink – or fight tough. By consistently over-paying (which I know is a relative term and difficult to define) and undermatching his clients, has softened these guys to a point where they are much more like accountants than gladiators. Yeah, it may seem like a rather harsh statement but as Bill Belichick would say, it is what it is. With Waddell & Reed’s backing, they have fostered this environment.
Williams and his trainer are Philadelphia throwbacks in many ways. As you see them work, there is a respect and dedication to the craft and there is a real substance to Williams as a fighter, a certain well-rounded nature to his game. The 25-year old is a historian of the sport, who is constantly and currently studying the greats. Matchmakers will tell you privately that Williams will be a tough out for years to come because of his overall skill set.
His current record stands at 21-0-1 (13) and this past year, he handily defeated the trio of Joey Hernandez (UD 10), Arman Ovsepyan (TKO 6) and Luciano Cuello (TKO 1). No, this isn’t a formidable lot but 2015 was supposed to be another developmental year for Williams, who has yearned for meaningful fights versus those higher up on the food chain.
He has wanted Austin Trout since the beginning of this year and Trout was even shipped in to be a part of the PBC broadcast crew for the show on which Williams blasted out Cuello in one round back in September. They shared an exchange after this fight in which Trout argued for “high risk, gotta get the high reward,” something Joey Hernandez, Luis Galarza and Luis Grajeda certainly aren’t as Trout racks up one six-figure payday after another.
Several months back, Williams got into a rather memorable Twitter sparring match with Ishe Smith – who just recently fought off-TV against Tommy Rainone last Friday night – who stated, with his exalted position in boxing and his past seven-figure paydays this young buck was beneath him.
Both Charlo brothers (Jermall holds the IBF 154-pound title and Jermell holds the No. 2 position) have made it clear that they really have no interest – even after Williams had offered to face them in Houston like he did in this tweet (@JRockboxing):
“I respect @FutureOfBoxing an we cool but this is the kinda fights boxing needs its for legacy money an braggin rights YES ILL GO 2 HOUSTON?”
He added the following:
“The fact that I hav to fight an eliminator just to fight @FutureOfBoxing should tell the boxin world exactly what’s happening open ya eyes”
Williams, who normally isn’t the boisterous type, then tweeted this a few weeks ago:
“PPL say he ain’t fightin nobody well how tf can I fight somebody if the whole stable is saying why I gotta fight jrock cuz I’m 21-0 DATWHY”
And then Williams delivered this message to Martirosyan as the latter turned down the fight:
“@VanesBoxing you can bullshyt Twitter but u can’t bullshyt me I’m not gonna argue wit u but don’t make me expose the truth”
Just the same, Edwards (@BreadmanBoxing) was in no mood to coddle either:
“@VanesBoxing best of luck vanes. You’re a nice kid but we have moved on. I don’t let jrock wait around. Your numbers were insane.”
Yeah, he’s getting a bit frustrated but time is on his side. But what’s telling is he even retweeted this from Yours Truly (@steveucnlive) over the weekend: “The way PBC fighters are flat out ducking (yes, ducking) Julian Williams is shameful. #boxing” And thanks, Julian, much appreciated.
But back to the point: It’s interesting that Trout, Martirosyan and the Charlos are so dismissive of Williams. It would be understandable if these were individuals like middleweight champion Saul Alvarez, Miguel Cotto or IBF/WBA middleweight titlist Gennady Golovkin – who are legitimate attractions. The aforementioned first threesome are guys who play in small venues, to minuscule audiences and, quite frankly, don’t have much of a following. To guys like “Canelo” and Cotto, these guys aren’t even B or C-sides to their A-sides.
One thing that is very noticeable as you deal with Williams and Edwards: They are extremely bright, intelligent individuals. Beyond that, however, they have a certain wisdom and perspective that belie their years in the sport. They seem to be very reasonable in their demands and understand their current standing in the sport. And trust me: That is a rarity in this often bizarre business. Edwards has made it clear time and time again that they are willing to take less than 50 percent versus Trout because they have an understanding that they still need victories like this to move up the food chain.
But it takes two to tango.
These Philadelphia throwbacks are unfortunately stuck in the new millennium boxing business. Yeah, news flash. Boxing has always been a business but never has it been so apparent as fighters themselves are now exhibiting the caution of managers (whose job it is to be risk-averse). Making it worse is there is a new breed of “fan-ager” who praises such behavior as if somehow he gets a financial cut.
Williams should voice his concerns and frustrations to Haymon. The problem is many of those same guys he wants to face are hiding behind the exact same man.
Julian Williams: The PBC Boogeyman - Undisputed Champion Network
@patscorpio must've helped pen the 2nd half of this article or at least gave it his stamp of approval
Julian Williams: The PBC Boogeyman
by Steve Kim | Dec 22, 2015
Photo Credit: Stephanie Trapp/TrappFotos/SHOWTIME®
As it stands now, young junior middleweight contender Julian “J Rock” Williams is still searching for a dance partner to kick off his 2016. Currently, he is in the process of getting involved in an IBF title eliminator, which means he must face the highest available – and willing – contender in the organization’s 154-pound rankings.
It was hoped that third ranked Michel Soro would take the assignment but, for whatever reason, that never came to fruition. Recently the focus turned to the seventh ranked Vanes Martirosyan, who would perhaps face the sixth ranked boxer-puncher from Philadelphia. It was, at least in theory, an easy fight to make, given both are advised by Al Haymon and under the Premier Boxing Champions umbrella.
Judging by the comments of Williams’ trainer/manager, Stephen Edwards, it seems like Martirosyan was not happy with the money being offered.
But here’s the real issue: Williams is simply too much risk for the reward being offered. And as it relates to his PBC colleagues who are paid well to blow out carefully hand-picked cannon fodder on various platforms, Williams is a boogeyman. Hey, there’s a reason why some/many of them flocked to Haymon – he provides vast exposure and, just as important, hefty paydays for relatively low risk bouts.
With this comes a certain sense of entitlement that is bound to seep into a fighter’s psyche. Yeah, Haymon can take his horses to water but he can’t make them drink – or fight tough. By consistently over-paying (which I know is a relative term and difficult to define) and undermatching his clients, has softened these guys to a point where they are much more like accountants than gladiators. Yeah, it may seem like a rather harsh statement but as Bill Belichick would say, it is what it is. With Waddell & Reed’s backing, they have fostered this environment.
Williams and his trainer are Philadelphia throwbacks in many ways. As you see them work, there is a respect and dedication to the craft and there is a real substance to Williams as a fighter, a certain well-rounded nature to his game. The 25-year old is a historian of the sport, who is constantly and currently studying the greats. Matchmakers will tell you privately that Williams will be a tough out for years to come because of his overall skill set.
His current record stands at 21-0-1 (13) and this past year, he handily defeated the trio of Joey Hernandez (UD 10), Arman Ovsepyan (TKO 6) and Luciano Cuello (TKO 1). No, this isn’t a formidable lot but 2015 was supposed to be another developmental year for Williams, who has yearned for meaningful fights versus those higher up on the food chain.
He has wanted Austin Trout since the beginning of this year and Trout was even shipped in to be a part of the PBC broadcast crew for the show on which Williams blasted out Cuello in one round back in September. They shared an exchange after this fight in which Trout argued for “high risk, gotta get the high reward,” something Joey Hernandez, Luis Galarza and Luis Grajeda certainly aren’t as Trout racks up one six-figure payday after another.
Several months back, Williams got into a rather memorable Twitter sparring match with Ishe Smith – who just recently fought off-TV against Tommy Rainone last Friday night – who stated, with his exalted position in boxing and his past seven-figure paydays this young buck was beneath him.
Both Charlo brothers (Jermall holds the IBF 154-pound title and Jermell holds the No. 2 position) have made it clear that they really have no interest – even after Williams had offered to face them in Houston like he did in this tweet (@JRockboxing):
“I respect @FutureOfBoxing an we cool but this is the kinda fights boxing needs its for legacy money an braggin rights YES ILL GO 2 HOUSTON?”
He added the following:
“The fact that I hav to fight an eliminator just to fight @FutureOfBoxing should tell the boxin world exactly what’s happening open ya eyes”
Williams, who normally isn’t the boisterous type, then tweeted this a few weeks ago:
“PPL say he ain’t fightin nobody well how tf can I fight somebody if the whole stable is saying why I gotta fight jrock cuz I’m 21-0 DATWHY”
And then Williams delivered this message to Martirosyan as the latter turned down the fight:
“@VanesBoxing you can bullshyt Twitter but u can’t bullshyt me I’m not gonna argue wit u but don’t make me expose the truth”
Just the same, Edwards (@BreadmanBoxing) was in no mood to coddle either:
“@VanesBoxing best of luck vanes. You’re a nice kid but we have moved on. I don’t let jrock wait around. Your numbers were insane.”
Yeah, he’s getting a bit frustrated but time is on his side. But what’s telling is he even retweeted this from Yours Truly (@steveucnlive) over the weekend: “The way PBC fighters are flat out ducking (yes, ducking) Julian Williams is shameful. #boxing” And thanks, Julian, much appreciated.
But back to the point: It’s interesting that Trout, Martirosyan and the Charlos are so dismissive of Williams. It would be understandable if these were individuals like middleweight champion Saul Alvarez, Miguel Cotto or IBF/WBA middleweight titlist Gennady Golovkin – who are legitimate attractions. The aforementioned first threesome are guys who play in small venues, to minuscule audiences and, quite frankly, don’t have much of a following. To guys like “Canelo” and Cotto, these guys aren’t even B or C-sides to their A-sides.
One thing that is very noticeable as you deal with Williams and Edwards: They are extremely bright, intelligent individuals. Beyond that, however, they have a certain wisdom and perspective that belie their years in the sport. They seem to be very reasonable in their demands and understand their current standing in the sport. And trust me: That is a rarity in this often bizarre business. Edwards has made it clear time and time again that they are willing to take less than 50 percent versus Trout because they have an understanding that they still need victories like this to move up the food chain.
But it takes two to tango.
These Philadelphia throwbacks are unfortunately stuck in the new millennium boxing business. Yeah, news flash. Boxing has always been a business but never has it been so apparent as fighters themselves are now exhibiting the caution of managers (whose job it is to be risk-averse). Making it worse is there is a new breed of “fan-ager” who praises such behavior as if somehow he gets a financial cut.
Williams should voice his concerns and frustrations to Haymon. The problem is many of those same guys he wants to face are hiding behind the exact same man.
Julian Williams: The PBC Boogeyman - Undisputed Champion Network
@patscorpio must've helped pen the 2nd half of this article or at least gave it his stamp of approval
did not read article but why do you say that? lol
Just had a back and forth with Vanes Martirosyan about whether he over-priced himself outta the J Rock fight
He over-priced himself...and I got him at the end
I still wanna see him fight J Rock though because he's a better opponent than Willie Nelson
He over-priced himself...and I got him at the end
I still wanna see him fight J Rock though because he's a better opponent than Willie Nelson
Steve Kim is basically talking about paying too much money for lesser fights is the reason why the bigger fights are being turned down.