Religion/Spirituality The Official Bible Study Thread

Liu Kang

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There's a lot of religion discussion in Higher Learning and I don't get it. It's like if you combined TSC with The Coli sports forum. There'd be some overlap of discussion but it'd mostly be two different groups talking about two different things and plenty of animosity when the topics cross over. That's pretty much how this forum feels.
Unfortunately those are topics that some posters take at heart and maintaining a calm discussion is often difficult in those cases. So I get what you mean and that's also why we may try to have some "official" threads in the future where people can discuss more at peace regarding some matters (and avoiding said matters to spill in the whole sub). It may not be the best thing because providing discussion and debate is the essence of a message board but not everything has to be debated and be about confrontation, sometimes, a simple cordial exchange is also a good thread, which we hope will be the case here.
 

Thsnnor

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Ephesians 2:7-9 KJV
That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. [8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

There is nothing a person can do by their own works to obtain salvation. The OT states in Isaiah 64:6 all of our righteousness is like filthy rags. There is nothing we can bring to the table, no work can contribute to our own salvation. Salvation is a gift from God. Only those who choose Jesus (Romans 10:9) will spend eternity with Him.
 
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Chez Lopez

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YAHUSHA HA MASHIACH
Ephesians 2:7-9 KJV
That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. [8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

There is nothing a person can do by their own works to obtain salvation. The OT states in Isaiah 64:6 all of our righteousness is like filthy rags. There is nothing we can bring to the table, no work can contribute to our own salvation. Salvation is a gift from God. Only those who choose Jesus (Romans 10:9) will spend eternity with Him.
Yes that is truth, this shows how Yahusha the Messiah loves us. But how do we love Him?

8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

the next verse should clarify the message given.

ephesians 2:10
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Mashiach Yahusha unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

It is a given that Yahusha HaMashiach loves us by grace to those that believe and have faith, but this is just the beginning. How can you quantify your faith without a physical action? The book of James clarifies this as well.

James 2
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
 

Thsnnor

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Yes that is truth, this shows how Yahusha the Messiah loves us. But how do we love Him?

8] For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: [9] Not of works, lest any man should boast.

the next verse should clarify the message given.

ephesians 2:10
10 For we are his workmanship, created in Mashiach Yahusha unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

It is a given that Yahusha HaMashiach loves us by grace to those that believe and have faith, but this is just the beginning. How can you quantify your faith without a physical action? The book of James clarifies this as well.

James 2
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

The problem is many don't read the Word and don't even get that far.

Matthew 10:32-39 KJV
Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. [33] But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven. [34] Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. [35] For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. [36] And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. [37] He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. [38] And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. [39] He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

People must make a decision to actively follow Jesus. People will be persecuted for being a follower and it will cause you to lose family and friends.

Matthew 7:13-23 KJV
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: [14] Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. [15] Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. [16] Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? [17] Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. [18] A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. [19] Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [20] Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. [21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Many will be led astray due to trying to find their own way to God. Many will be led astray due to false gospels, preachers and doctrine.

John 14:6 KJV
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

People say death is the end or there is no life after death. I say you are going to be dead infinitely longer then you were alive.... you better make sure you are correct. Turn to Jesus while there is still time.
 

Chez Lopez

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YAHUSHA HA MASHIACH
The problem is many don't read the Word and don't even get that far.

Matthew 10:32-39 KJV
Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. [33] But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven. [34] Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. [35] For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. [36] And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. [37] He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. [38] And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me. [39] He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

People must make a decision to actively follow Jesus. People will be persecuted for being a follower and it will cause you to lose family and friends.

Matthew 7:13-23 KJV
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: [14] Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. [15] Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. [16] Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? [17] Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. [18] A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. [19] Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. [20] Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. [21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Many will be led astray due to trying to find their own way to God. Many will be led astray due to false gospels, preachers and doctrine.

John 14:6 KJV
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

People say death is the end or there is no life after death. I say you are going to be dead infinitely longer then you were alive.... you better make sure you are correct. Turn to Jesus while there is still time.
Absolutely. Those verses take on an entirely profound reading, especially when you tell people that His Name wasn jesus. Its a very very VERY hard lesson in bible study, but let me tell you from personal experience that my mother, father and brother have disowned me for true gospel interpretation. The verses you quoted are EXACTLY the struggle that believers will go through. You can look around even on this board and see a persecution spirit that has engulfed the attitudes of people who don believe anything, now try to tell a church goer the bible says not to celebrate christmas, or that jesus is the name of a different god, or that the law of moses was never destroyed. It goes from hard to impossible.


[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. [22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? [23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


As you can imagine, calling on a name other than the true Name of the Messiah, but in the Name of the Messiah, is what the verse you posted is discussing. This verse is specifically for future christians, which is mind blowing in itself. The greek translated word for iniquity is anomos, which means lawlessness. So Yahusha here is a speaking to a people that act in His Name, but are calling the wrong Name and not practicing the law. It is an absolutely mind blowing fufillment of scripture. Cheers brother.
 
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Thsnnor

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1 Corinthians 1:18 KJV
For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

Acts 4:12 KJV
Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.


The world is getting people comfortable with the pleasures it has to offer. How many people have to crash and burn through money, women, men, power, drugs, status, erotic pleasures before realizing it is not worth it? Seek Jesus.
 

rapbeats

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Again...you lack understanding and you need to stay away from those new translations as well.

Explain this? Read all 3 verses and pay closes attention to verse 17.



The seed of Israel that is doing that will get that judgement when he cracks through the sky. You need to read the Book of Maccabees and see the accounts of men of the Lord, Israelites that were put to death by the Greeks because they refused to eat unclean foods.

Paul was talking about people deciding to eat as they wish as long as its according to the dietary law. Go to the Book of Daniel, Daniel was on a vegetarian diet while he was in Babylon. He abstained from eating meat. He was not being unlawful and a brother cannot come and make him eat even lawful meat because he has the liberty to do that within the law. You also have some brethren that may be fasting and he may not want to eat because of it and brother might be all in face like "Man, this chicken is good breh...you should try it :jawalrus:". You will be surprised how that can disrupt harmony among brethren. That is why Paul had to bring it up.

I have a friend that does not eat beef or pork and people get on him it about it sometimes..he is not a hindu either...he just never liked beef since he was a kid and eats fish and chicken. That is basically what Paul was talking about...allowing a man to exercise that liberty that is within the law...he was not talking about go and eat swine other abominations.

Those unclean foods are responsible for many of our ailments. Gout, obesity, high blood pressure, diabetes. That is why the people that just so happen to be from the seed of Israel suffer the curses/sicknesses for eating those same foods.
you're inserting your own stuff into it. i know exactly what those scripts said. and i know to beware of the translations. but even with that, the many other versions still state the exact same thing.

what bothers you, dont bother me at a DNA LEVEL.

so called SWINE doesnt affect us all in the same way. you can show me pictures, etc all you want. thats just a fact of life. its the reason my old a... grandmother who just died at 90 and change smoked her entire life. but never had cancer of anything. she ate pork her entire life, beef her entire life. never had a real ailment. she died of natural causes. nothing special. she lived longer then a many of vegan, or a many of fish/chicken only eater. Its at the DNA level where you have to watch your diet. What agrees with you may not agree with me on the food options. Leave your brother alone about it, as long as he's well. now we know for a fact a huge number of people have issues with pork eaten in abundance. so yes i think its ok to tell people about the ills of pork. but if you have that one off person that isnt bothered by it at all. ... LEAVE HIM BE like the script says. That goes for shell fish as well. and like you said which i already said. Leave those vegans alone. as long as they are healthy(some are not, so some need to get off that wave) leave them alone and let them be. The same way you can now choose your sabbath. as long as you make the day holy. its the sabbath. its similar to how you can turn any place into church(4 walls or in the middle of the forest..doesnt matter) as long as you have 2 or more rocking with you on that same vibe.

I've said this many of times. the difference between the OT and the NT from what i gather is the OT was about The letter of the law . the NT is about the Spirit of the Law.

you can follow the letter of the law but dont have your heart in it. so in essence odds are you probably are violating one of those 600+ laws by not having your heart in it while going thru the routine of checking off each law you've abided by. But if can some how correctly follow the SPIRIT of the law. then you will always be on point with God. because its about your heart. you adopt a child for a check from the state or did you do it out of the kindness of your heart? at the end of the day both cases show you adopted a child. people from the outside will THINK you did a great deed. but only God can judge a man's true intentions(the heart).

What is your motive when you do what you do? is it to seem holier then thou? if so then you're still in violation.

another example of the difference between LETTER of the LAW vs SPIRIT of the LAW
Matthew 12:10-12
Jesus Heals on the Sabbath
10 And a man was there whose hand was withered. And they questioned Jesus, asking, "Is it lawful to heal on the Sabbath?"-- so that they might accuse Him. 11 And He said to them, "What man is there among you who has a sheep, and if it falls into a pit on the Sabbath, will he not take hold of it and lift it out? 12 "How much more valuable then is a man than a sheep! So then, it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath."… [/quote}

See there's an underlining reason or reasons why some super religious folk would rather have "the letter" of the law over "the spirit" of the law. Because following something without dealing with your heart is not easy but its much easier to do, then to check your own personal motives every time you do something/think something. since we are all sinful by nature. Its much easier to just do the things or dont do the things on the list and FEEL GOOD about yourself. and not only that. This is a will power thing. I will say this, some people are better at WILL power then others. But personal WILL power is not GOD power or CHRIST power. God always wants you to depend on HIM to get thru, not your own will. eventually your own WILL, will.... lead you astray... it never fails.

So what ends up happening is, the guys with the best WILL power end up being the leaders. meaning they have followers. which means they have POWER/GLORY/REVERENCE/ Money could come into play/FAVOR. We know Man loves these things too much and things get real shaky when we start chasing these things. but thats exactly what happens with the LETTER OF THE LAW ultra religious folk. They start to feel as if they are the authority since they are the only few who can actually WILL themselves into doing everything properly. That in essence makes them GOD on earth or a bunch of Jesus' down here on earth. thats not what God intended.
The difference between the two usually is humility..TRUE humility. not trying to show yourself as being humble. but actually being HUMBLE. there's a difference. someone running around saying "i'm very humble" isnt humble. humble people never mention the fact they're humble,they just are. Think about that for a moment.
 

rapbeats

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Marvel is absolutely right. You must understand the times to understand what Paul is saying here. That's the danger of new translations, they change doctrine as well

The jews of the time were persecuting followers of the Messiah by forcing them to become circumcised and forcing them to adhere to the law for righteousness, not for the righteousness of Yahusha HaMasciach. They were teaching that the circumscision is what saves, not the Messiah. Paul put a stop to that. Paul taught that salvation comes through the Name of Yahusha first, then through abiding by the law of Yahusha. Christians use verses like these to attempt to undermine the law and denounce biblical teaching.

Romans 3
28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. 29 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also: 30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith. 31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid : yea, we establish the law.



And if its in the bible its NOT a myth. If the bible backs up what another culture deems as mythology, then the culture is wrong, not the bible. If we pick apart the bible deeming what is myth and what is true by our own societies standards, then we destroy Yahuah's word and uphold the word of man.



Romans 3
3 For what if some did not believe ? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect ? 4 God forbid : yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written , That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged .
yes you may have christians who use verses to escape the truth. thats not what that was about. That was showing how there are the ultra religious out there, that will try to pin people down on things they themselves do not truly know or want to know the context of. for the reasons i stated above in my previous post about why a lot of folks like the LETTER of the law vs the SPIRIT of the law.

But this will always be an issue for the orthodox vs the non orthdox believers.

Who Were The Pharisees?
by Wayne Blank

Of the three major religious societies of Judaism at the time of the New Testament (the Pharisees, the Sadducees, and the Essenes), the Pharisees were often the most vocal and influential. The origin of the Pharisees is uncertain, but their movement is believed to have grown from the Assideans (i.e. the "pious"), who began in the time of the Maccabean Revolt (see The Maccabees) against the Greek/Syrian ruler Antiochus IV, or "Antiochus Epiphanes," around 165 B.C. It was during that roughly 4 centuries between the end of the Old Testament record and the birth of Jesus Christ, prior to the rise of the Roman empire (see Ancient Empires - Rome), that the idolatrous Greek influence was at its peak in Jerusalem (see Ancient Empires - Greece,The Ptolemies and The Seleucids). The first direct mention of the Pharisees was by the Jewish/Roman historian Flavius Josephus in describing the three sects, or schools, into which the Jews were divided in 145 B.C.
The name Pharisee in its Hebrew form means separatists, or the separated ones. They were also known as chasidim, which means loyal to God, or loved of God - extremely ironic in view of the fact that by His time, they made themselves the most bitter, and deadly, opponents of Jesus Christ and His message.

The Pharisees perhaps meant to obey God, but eventually they became so devoted and extremist invery limited parts of The Law (plus all that they themselves added to it), that they became blind to The Messiah when He was in their very midst. They saw His miracles, they heard His Words, but instead of receiving it with joy, they did all that they could to stop Him - eventually to the point of getting Him killed because He truthfully claimed to be the Son of God.

Jesus Christ had strong words about the Pharisees, and what awaits some of them:



"For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes [see Lawyers] and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." (Matthew 5:20 RSV).
"He answered them, "And why do you transgress the Commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? For God commanded, 'Honor your father and your mother,' and, 'He who speaks evil of father or mother, let him surely die.' But you say, 'If any one tells his father or his mother, What you would have gained from me is given to God, he need not honor his father.' So, for the sake of your tradition, you have made void the Word of God." (Matthew 15:3-6 RSV) [see The Ten Commandments and The Ten Commandments Now?].

"How is it that you fail to perceive that I did not speak about bread? Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees." Then they understood that He did not tell them to beware of the leaven of bread, but of the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees." (Matthew 16:11-12 RSV)
(Note: Just as yeast causes bread to rise, yeast was sometimes used as a symbol of sinful pride which made people haughty and "puffed up.")

"The scribes and the Pharisees sit on Moses' seat; so practice and observe whatever they tell you, but not what they do; for they preach, but do not practice. They bind heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with their finger. They do all their deeds to be seen by men; for they make their phylacteries broad and their fringes long, and they love the place of honor at feasts and the best seats in the synagogues, and salutations in the market places, and being called rabbi by men. But you are not to be called rabbi, for you have one teacher, and you are all brethren. And call no man your father on earth, for you have one Father, who is in heaven." (Matthew 23:2-9 RSV)
(Note: A perhaps somewhat surprising statement - the Pharisees were correct according to their limited perspective, and were to be obeyed by the Jews under their authority. But, they were not to be emulated in their way of life - they were Hypocrites.)

"But woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because you shut the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither enter yourselves, nor allow those who would enter to go in." (Matthew 23:13 RSV).

"Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you tithe mint and dill and cummin, and have neglected the weightier matters of the Law, justice and mercy and faith; these you ought to have done, without neglecting the others. You blind guides, straining out a gnat and swallowing a camel!" (Matthew 23:23-24)

The lesson from the Pharisees' example is that self-righteousness is not righteousness, and that God's true people are to live according to all of God's Word, not just certain parts that are most convenient or to one's own liking

now i will say this. there is always a fear of going to soft when you go with the SPIRIT of the law vs the LETTER. and going to soft means you start re-writing the law to suit whatever you want to be OK. but the very same thing is going on with the letter of the law crew its just more internal with their hearts. you are trying to hold others accountable for not keeping certain laws. but yet if Jesus were to check your records he would find that you've failed at a many of law that you wont speak about. People can get easily caught up on Text and exact laws. its called legalism. and actually forget the real reason why we are even given the law and abiding by them to begin with. they are more or less worshiping the law and not God himself. but like i said, it can happen to either side of the coin just in different ways. so both sides need to watch it.
 
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rapbeats

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You see there below? it can go both ways. these are not scriptures only for the christian that just wants to have the easy way out and doesnt want the laws. its also for the legalism ultra orthodoxed saying he/she follows all 600+ laws to a T and going hard at people who supposedly dont even when they know in their heart of hearts they are not following these things with their heart first in the right place. they are just checking off a list. So these scripts are for both sides.

"There is a way which seems right to a man, but its end is the way to death." (Proverbs 14:12 RSV)
"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes, but the Lord weighs the heart." (Proverbs 21:2 RSV)

"This people honors Me with their lips, but their heart is far from Me; in vain do they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the precepts of men.' You leave the Commandment of God, and hold fast the tradition of men." (Mark 7:6-8 RSV)

"Let no one deceive you with empty words, for it is because of these things that the wrath of God comes upon the sons of disobedience." (Ephesians 5:6 RSV)

"See to it that no one makes a prey of you by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and not according to Christ." (Colossians 2:8 RSV)

"For they are a rebellious people, lying sons, sons who will not hear the instruction of The Lord; who say to the seers, "See not"; and to the prophets, "Prophesy not to us what is right; speak to us smooth things, prophesy illusions, leave the way, turn aside from the path, let us hear no more of the Holy One of Israel." (Isaiah 30:9-11 RSV)
 

Chez Lopez

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YAHUSHA HA MASHIACH
The Word of Yahuah is the Law, and Yahusha, His Son, followed the Word. Infact He was the Word transformed into flesh. Abiding by the law is how we as humans show that we have faith in Him the Messiah.

Matt 5:17
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil
.

We do the law, because we love Him. Spiritual belief with a physical action, not just one or the other.

John 14:15-17
If ye love me, keep my commandments. And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
 

ReturnOfJudah

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I have the Zondervan Encylopedia of the Bible Vols 1, 2, and 3. Im trying to get the whole collection, so I have A-L on iBooks, on my iphone. And check this out bro on this is a couple of sentences from Vol 1 A-C page 1320 under the word Angels:

`When refuting the SADDUCEES' argument against angels and RESSURECTION, Jesus stated that angels were not sexual and did not marry. He also pointed out their present superiority to human beings, ut said that people who are worth of the coming age "are like the angels. They are God's children since they are children of the ressurection. (Luke 20-30-36). :datazz:
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rapbeats

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and i'll leave yall with this since i brought it up

Question: "What does the Bible say about legalism? How can a Christian avoid falling into the trap of legalism?"

Answer:
The word “legalism” does not occur in the Bible. It is a term Christians use to describe a doctrinal position emphasizing a system of rules and regulations for achieving both salvation and spiritual growth. Legalists believe in and demand a strict literal adherence to rules and regulations. Doctrinally, it is a position essentially opposed to grace. Those who hold a legalistic position often fail to see the real purpose for law, especially the purpose of the Old Testament law of Moses, which is to be our “schoolmaster” or “tutor” to bring us to Christ (Galatians 3:24).

Even true believers can be legalistic. We are instructed, rather, to be gracious to one another: “Accept him whose faith is weak, without passing judgment on disputable matters” (Romans 14:1). Sadly, there are those who feel so strongly about non-essential doctrines that they will run others out of their fellowship, not even allowing the expression of another viewpoint. That, too, is legalism. Many legalistic believers today make the error of demanding unqualified adherence to their own biblical interpretations and even to their own traditions. For example, there are those who feel that to be spiritual one must simply avoid tobacco, alcoholic beverages, dancing, movies, etc. The truth is that avoiding these things is no guarantee of spirituality.

The apostle Paul warns us of legalism in Colossians 2:20-23: “Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: ‘Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!’? These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.” Legalists may appear to be righteous and spiritual, but legalism ultimately fails to accomplish God’s purposes because it is an outward performance instead of an inward change.

To avoid falling into the trap of legalism, we can start by holding fast to the words of the apostle John, “For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ” (John 1:17) and remembering to be gracious, especially to our brothers and sisters in Christ. “Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand” (Romans 14:4). “You, then, why do you judge your brother? Or why do you look down on your brother? For we will all stand before God's judgment seat” (Romans 14:10).

A word of caution is necessary here. While we need to be gracious to one another and tolerant of disagreement over disputable matters, we cannot accept heresy. We are exhorted to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints (Jude 3). If we remember these guidelines and apply them in love and mercy, we will be safe from both legalism and heresy. “Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world” (1 John 4:1).
Please don't derail this thread and let it live.

It is a specific thread for people who want to debate and discuss about the content of the Bible. If you don't agree, if you anti-religions, if you don't try to exchange about it, just don't participate and/or ignore the thread. Anything that will constitute derailment should be reported and will get deleted.

The thread title is clear ("Bible study"), so the participants will most likely be Christians and may post things that may oppose science and/or non-religious people but it's ok because it is not a thread to debate about religion(s). The purpose of this thread is similar to the one of the Conspiracy Thread, it's a safe haven, so please don't disturb the peace in here.
it shouldnt be just christians. it could be non believers that dont know either way. they can come in too. but without the derailment mentality. it can also be Jews(black/white) or Black hebrews, etc.
 

Chez Lopez

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YAHUSHA HA MASHIACH
the thing is, Christianity is a whole separate religion from what the bible teaches, even though it uses the bible to justify its belief structure.

points of reference:

1. the bible states that the Sabbath day is holy and that it must be set apart from the rest of the days. not any day, the set aside day sanctified by Yahuah.

-the Christian church worships on sunday, not the Sabbath day. this day was set apart by the roman catholic church to appease newly designated Christians.


2. the bible states to not take the Name of Yahuah in vain. the word vain in Hebrew is shoo. This word means emptiness or nothingness. This means the actual Name is meant to be used worshiped and praised, not discarded and unused

-the Christian church substitutes titles like 'god' or 'the lord' in where in Hebrew scripture His Name was pronounced and praised. This practice comes from the heretical phariseeic Judaism that became the teachers against the law, builders of new tradition-based law and refused to speak the Name, contrary to biblical doctrine.


3. the bible states that a person should not worship idols, or bow to idols or use idols in worship of Yahuah, that this is an abomination of the faith and also a pagan tradition.

-the Christian church is completely idolatrous, worshipping using wooden idols, statues, Christmas trees, gold and silver necklaces and other religious trinkets. All of these types of worship are traditional pagan practices, united with the Christian church by roman catholics.


4. the bible state that the law of Yahuah given to moses is the word of Yahuah and meant to be followed. There is no distinguishing between the old and new testament in this issue, all followers of the Messiah Yahusha completed the law and even new greek converts were brought into the synagogues to learn the law. Yahusha Himself testifies that the law will not change until the end of the world.

-the Christian church refuses to adhere to the law of moses, regardless of the biblical doctrine of the Messiah, the testimony of both old and new testaments and historical evidence.


5. the bible teaches that the Name of the Messiah Yahusha is important and we can only be saved by calling upon His Name. The bible also states that there is only one Name given to the Messiah, in two places (acts 4, 2 thesselonians) and that those who believe in this Name will be saved.

-the Christian church states that calling on the name of jesus is sufficient for salvation, even though it is historically impossible that jesus was His given name. the church teaches that whatever way a parishioner wants to call upon Him is sufficient, even though jesus is a name that was used by multiple other pagan deities linking back thousands of years to ancient Greece.

What we have here is an entirely separate religion based on belief of many non biblical concepts, separation of the old testament from the new testament and adherence to a system of thought identical to many other worldy religions (idolatry, solstice worship etc). Jesus has a different doctrine from the bible, under a different name, celebrating different holidays and worshipping on a different day of the week. These facts catagorize christianity as a whole other doctrine that uses the bible only for thematic semblance. Early followers of the bible adhered strictly to Judaic biblical law AND believed in Yahusha the Messiah, it was hundreds of years later when roman catholic christianty merged with paganism to present to us the modern Christian church.

This is not meant to point the finger at Christians for heretical belief structure, it is adherence to the Word of Yahuah, as we are commanded. Cheers fellas!
 
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