The Last of Us Part II Spoiler Discussion Thread

[kdslittlebro]

Just finished..

So These Story decisions that have everybody mad...I’ll split up the main talking points/controversial moments

Joel

Joel is one my favourite game characters of all time, but I didn’t have a big problem with how early he died and how/why like a lot of people did..it’s a fukked up violent world and bloody actions are going to have bloody consequences, that’s one of the games themes. With that said, I think I’d feel differently if it didn’t at least have his flashbacks, I’m glad it did, they were really well done and provided a lot of what we loved about their chemistry from the first game.

Abbie

I knew about playing as her for a good part of the game beforehand and was honestly dreading it as everything as Ellie up to that point had been stellar. I was wrong because some of her parts are easily some of the best in the entire game, the only section of hers I didn’t like was early on with Manny and the pregnant chick in the warehouses/train yard, as soon as I left them it was great from then out, she is also a lot of fun to play, so was Ellie, But Abbys weapons and abilities were flames, narrative wise I think they did a good job of showing her as Ellie’s parallel on the exact same revenge mission.

The Ending

This is the only sort off negative for me, I completely get what they were going for by having Ellie not kill her therefore stopping the cycle of violence ect, especially with Lev being there to witness the same way Ellie was there with Joel..but I literally crawled through hell to get there, ND could of easily shown how being consumed with revenge will leave you with nothing (which is what they were going for) and still have her journey not be for nothing by killing Abbie instead of letting her live, she lost Dina, JJ and her fingers (and therefore the ability to play guitar, the only thing she had left of Joel) because of her decision to pursue her, not because of her decision to kill her, that could of still happened and You could of gave Ellie/players some retribution for Joel and still drove home your message, because Either way she is still going home to nothing. It just doesn't make sense that after all of that killing, and knowing she will lose the last bit of happiness she has left if she does go after her, that she gets all the way there and doesn't kill her. I get the parralell of the last flashback where Ellie says she’d like to “try” and learn to forgive Joel and how that’s relevant to Abby, but I’m still not sure

Verdict

An overall Great journey/experience, everything else about the gameplay was amazing...The combat, Tension, Graphics, Environments, Voice Acting and Sound are all top tier, I honestly don’t get the hate for this games writing either, outside of some of the critisms of the ending which I get I think they did a great job of tying all of these threads together. I liked this just as much as the first game overall and the original is one of my Goat games

Agreed 100% except for the ending. I agree with your take on the ending as I felt the same way

Joel
Jesse
Relationship with Tommy
Relationship with Dina/JJ
Two Fingers
Put a knife to an incapacitated kids throat


Probably more that I’m forgetting and Ellie still let her walk

But I’m not docking points. It still made sense and was plausible. Plus they stepped out on a ledge they knew would upset the audience but they executed it well imo. Storytelling in games won’t be able to be pushed forward if agreeability is conflated with quality. It was still a high quality ending imo.

 

[MisterMajesty]

Still waiting on brehs to start listing these apparent “plot holes” that are all over the game

Gimme around half an hour or so an I'll give it a stab. I got a few things I'm confused bout

brehs make that claim then hot sauce dribble past it when nikkas ask them to list these plot holes.

 

[The axe murderer]

I just read about this part too in the regular discussion thread lmaooo

He put allllllllll his weight into that shot

 

[Turbulent]

Agreed 100% except for the ending. I agree with your take on the ending as I felt the same way



But I’m not docking points. It still made sense and was plausible. Plus they stepped out on a ledge they knew would upset the audience but they executed it well imo. Storytelling in games won’t be able to be pushed forward if agreeability is conflated with quality. It was still a high quality ending imo.

I agree that shyt has to progress. They can't just keep doing what is expected. I think most people agree with that. But i think they just felt like this story is just dumb and not plausible. The execution was just done poorly. I think every one sees they were shooting for "high art" which is fine if executed properly. The analogy i made earlier was that they were shooting for Lars von Trier but landed on 13 Reasons Why. They were trying to be deep but it just didn't make sense.

 

[kdslittlebro]

I agree that shyt has to progress. They can't just keep doing what is expected. I think most people agree with that. But i think they just felt like this story is just dumb and not plausible. The execution was just done poorly. I think every one sees they were shooting for "high art" which is fine if executed properly. The analogy i made earlier was that they were shooting for Lars von Trier but landed on 13 Reasons Why. They were trying to be deep but it just didn't make sense.

What parts of it did you consider dumb/implausible, if you're in that group? Not for arguments sake, just curious, or just quote where you said that part and I'll read

 

[The axe murderer]

I gotta say I felt about this character even when she died. Matter of fact I when she got murked. She a doc getting into dangerous situations like that and I'm sure docs are in short supply. That beginning line "Why would he have a say in it?" bytch that's his kid too
You using that baby for armour and hp?

The kid sure as hell ain't gonna have a say in being a potential 2 for 1 happy for the clickers

 

[kdslittlebro]

I gotta say I felt about this character even when she died. Matter of fact I when she got murked. That beginning line "Why would he have a say in it?" bytch that's his kid too
You using that baby for armour and hp?

The kid sure as hell ain't gonna have a say in being a potential 2 for 1 happy for the clickers

I felt worse for her in Ellie's POV than Abby's 100%. By the time I got back to the aquarium I didn't give a fukk about either one of em, especially the way she was talking greasy at the end. I see why Abby still cared tho. I only felt bad for the baby

 

[Turbulent]

What parts of it did you consider dumb/implausible, if you're in that group? Not for arguments sake, just curious, or just quote where you said that part and I'll read

Let me preface this by saying i haven't played the game but "watched" it so take what i say with a giant grain of salt.

I think the two main points that don't make sense are Joel being careless and dying as a result. Him dying is cool but they basically caught him slipping which is not consistent with the character.

The second part is the ending of course where she went through all of the journey killing many on her watly and in a flash decides not to kill abby. I understand she was broken and fukked up by the end but thos is over the top. I don't see a person or character not going through with it. She should have given up along the way. This part should have been a choice. Or they should have found a better reason for ellie not to kill abby.

 

[MidniteJay]

I gotta say I felt about this character even when she died. Matter of fact I when she got murked. That beginning line "Why would he have a say in it?" bytch that's his kid too
You using that baby for armour and hp?

The kid sure as hell ain't gonna have a say in being a potential 2 for 1 happy for the clickers

You a savage but I ain't gonna lie I felt the same way. shyt crazy I'm expecting to hate Abby and her crew for what they did but ended up liking her whole crew except for Mel.

For the small amount of time we see him even Manny getting his head blown off got a reaction from me.

 

[The axe murderer]

I felt worse for her in Ellie's POV than Abby's 100%. By the time I got back to the aquarium I didn't give a fukk about either one of em, especially the way she was talking greasy at the end. I see why Abby still cared tho. I only felt bad for the baby

She tried to be this

She that baby should have died in that truck crash

 

[The axe murderer]

You a savage but I ain't gonna lie I felt the same way. shyt crazy I'm expecting to hate Abby and her crew for what they did but ended up liking her whole crew except for Mel.

For the small amount of time we see him even Manny getting his head blown off got a reaction from me.

That many head blow had me
I hit the meek mill " hold on wait a minute, you thought I was finished

 

[kdslittlebro]

Let me preface this by saying i haven't played the game but "watched" it so take what i say with a giant grain of salt.

I think the two main points that don't make sense are Joel being careless and dying as a result. Him dying is cool but they basically caught him slipping which is not consistent with the character.

The second part is the ending of course where she went through all of the journey killing many on her watly and in a flash decides not to kill abby. I understand she was broken and fukked up by the end but thos is over the top. I don't see a person or character not going through with it. She should have given up along the way. This part should have been a choice. Or they should have found a better reason for ellie not to kill abby.

I see where people are coming from with Joel getting caught slipping, but old Joel likely doesn't save Abby in the first place. I took it as him getting content/sloppy over the years at Jackson. You see how soft Tommy was toward them originally, but he immediately snapped back into demonic mode after Ellie told him she was dipping with or without him.

The second part, I feel the same way, especially considering all the loss she had to endure, and even lost her family as a result of going to SB (she didn't know until she got back, but I knew that would happen as a player assuming Ellie lived through it). And all the pain she endured in SB itself I was taking pleasure in fukking her up at the end. I also could understand having to face that decision to continue that cycle of violence or not, *not really facing her until she has to finish the job. I think they laid out good enough reasoning for me to understand it, even if I didn't agree with it, but to each their own.

Also, I watch playthroughs of games I beat to pass the time sometimes, but that shyt really ain't the same feeling as playing, but you already saw the story now so I imagine it won't make much of a difference for you

 

[MidniteJay]

That many head blow had me
I hit the meek mill " hold on wait a minute, you thought I was finished

Tommy ain't no joke Him and Joel in their prime must have been Negan levels of savagery.

 

[kdslittlebro]

For the small amount of time we see him even Manny getting his head blown off got a reaction from me.

Another one I could see Abby's admiration for, but I could never get the image of him spitting on dead Joel outta my head.

 

[The axe murderer]

Another one I could see Abby's admiration for, but I could never get the image of him spitting on dead Joel outta my head.

I was glad he got cyclops'd