Tamir Rice case (12yo boy shot while carrying BB gun) - FULL VID RELEASED on 01/08/15

[Colicat]

Why do you say it's a non threatening situation

How is waving and pointing a gun non threatening?

The scene was secure. There was no crime (menacing) in progress. Tamir was not pointing a gun when the police arrived. Should the police have been concerned about the report of menacing? Yes. Should they have investigated the scene for further information (questioned the "suspect")? Yes. Should they have operated with an abundance of caution? Yes. Should they have shot up the place like it was the wild wild Midwest? No

 

[theworldismine13]

Here is where we differ. The scene was not out of control.
The cops were not approached. They approached, rather ambushed, Tamir. An armed individual by themselves in a public park in Ohio should not have warranted that ambush. Whether there are reports of menacing or not. The initial response was overkill. Ohio is an open carry state. For all the police know, Tamir could have been a permitted gun owner.

But he didn't get that benefit of the doubt. Why?

he didnt get the benefit either 1) because he was black or 2) there were reports that he was waving the gun at people

#2 seems more plausible

the problem with #1 is that to say this happened because he was black you would have to ignore all the other things that happened and ignore tamir's actions and just focus on the fact that a 12 year old got shot

i would actually agree that they ambushed him, i think they saw him sitting by himself and they were trying to bumrush the scene to intimidate him, and i think he saw the cops coming and he got up and approached the cop car and that is where the line was crossed

like i said i think its fuked up, i think the kid had no idea of the magnitude of what he was doing, but by looking at the video and his actions, i dont think the cops can be held responsible for not giving him benefit of the doubt, the cops had to assume they were dealing with an armed and dangerous person until told otherwise

 

[theworldismine13]

The scene was secure. There was no crime (menacing) in progress. Tamir was not pointing a gun when the police arrived. Should the police have been concerned about the report of menacing? Yes. Should they have investigated the scene for further information (questioned the "suspect")? Yes. Should they have operated with an abundance of caution? Yes. Should they have shot up the place like it was the wild wild Midwest? No

a person sitting down at a bench that is suspected of waving a gun is not a secure scene in any way shape or form, its an extremely dangerous scene

and they shot him as he approached them, how is a presumed armed person approaching a vehicle a secure scene?

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

Oh... so wait... the caller tells 911 the gun is probably a fake... and the cops are supposed to believe that... but the caller says he's a juvenile... and the cops aren't supposed to believe that.

if they thought the little breh was dangerous, why would they roll up next to him like that? come on man.

 

[Colicat]

he didnt get the benefit either 1) because he was black or 2) there were reports that he was waving the gun at people

#2 seems more plausible
the cops had to assume they were dealing with an armed and dangerous person until told otherwise

The problem with number 2 is that it is past tense. Tamir was not a clear and present danger upon the police's arrival. Because of this, he should have been questioned not executed.

a person sitting down at a bench that is suspected of waving a gun is not a secure scene in any way shape or form, its an extremely dangerous scene

and they shot him as he approached them, how is a presumed armed person approaching a vehicle a secure scene?

Extremely dangerous ....Tamir would not have had the illogical fight or flight reaction of flashing the gun, BUT FOR the police ambush.

The police are trained professionals. While this may be extremely dangerous to you, it is not a scene that warrants shots being fired.

 

[shonuff]

right, who drives into an armed confrontation?

uh the police

thats what they do - respond to situations with armed people

 

[tmonster]

uh the police

thats what they do - respond to situations with armed people

oh wow breh, thanks for that info, I retract my question

 

[theworldismine13]

The problem with number 2 is that it is past tense. Tamir was not a clear and present danger upon the police's arrival. Because of this, he should have been questioned not executed.



Extremely dangerous ....Tamir would not have had the illogical fight or flight reaction of flashing the gun, BUT FOR the police ambush.

The police are trained professionals. While this may be extremely dangerous to you, it is not a scene that warrants shots being fired.

i just dont agree, he was very much a clear and present danger

in hindsight its obvious he wasnt dangerous, but from the what was known at the time, he was dangerous

like i said, to put it on race you have to ignore all of tamir's behavior prior to the shooting, tamir's behavior was completely nuts and extremely dangerous before the cops got there, the whole situation of him even being there in a park by himself is mind boggling

 

[ℒℴѵℯJay ELECTUA]

Aim for the legs.

 

[tmonster]

he was very much a clear and present danger

just how clear could it be? do toy guns not exist? do children not use toy guns? do children not lack the perspective of adults? the very outcome of the events speak against this clarity, this is tautologically trite.

 

[Colicat]

i just dont agree, he was very much a clear and present danger

in hindsight its obvious he wasnt dangerous, but from the what was known at the time, he was dangerous

like i said, to put it on race you have to ignore all of tamir's behavior prior to the shooting, tamir's behavior was completely nuts and extremely dangerous before the cops got there, the whole situation of him even being there in a park by himself is mind boggling

Yeah it's a shame that the kid was by himself... I still haven't seen any reports about his mother. Where was she? Where was the father? It was a Saturday. Where were his friends?


Nonetheless, the cops were not privy to what happened before. They heard reports of a black male who keeps pulling a gun in and out of his waist pointing it at RANDOM people in a public park.

Wouldn't a sane person think that Tamir is emotionally disturbed/ mentally ill/under the influence after that report?....
Proper policing is to ambush an emotionally disturbed/mentally ill/intoxicated armed person?

oh but wait... nope... it's a Black male.... we don't think of those possibilities... we should assume he's a clear and present danger to the gazebo and grass... makes sense....

 

[theworldismine13]

just how clear could it be? do toy guns not exist? do children not use toy guns? do children not lack the perspective of adults? the very outcome of the events speak against this clarity, this is tautologically trite.

Somebody called 911 cuz he was scaring the shyt out of people, the only things that cops knew was that a person was waving a gun and it was scaring people

 

[theworldismine13]

Yeah it's a shame that the kid was by himself... I still haven't seen any reports about his mother. Where was she? Where was the father? It was a Saturday. Where were his friends?


Nonetheless, the cops were not privy to what happened before. They heard reports of a black male who keeps pulling a gun in and out of his waist pointing it at RANDOM people in a public park.

Wouldn't a sane person think that Tamir is emotionally disturbed/ mentally ill/under the influence after that report?....
Proper policing is to ambush an emotionally disturbed/mentally ill/intoxicated armed person?

oh but wait... nope... it's a Black male.... we don't think of those possibilities... we should assume he's a clear and present danger to the gazebo and grass... makes sense....

Yeah actually it might be proper policing to ambush a person that is disturbed

 

[Colicat]

Yeah actually it might be proper policing to ambush a person that is disturbed

:erroneous:

 

[shonuff]

ok not for nothin but this is why people say the public has the memory of a fukking goldfish

there have been plenty of stories about young kids - yes KIDS bringing guns to school geting guns at their home and SHOOTING other kids and other adults - wasnt even a month ago some 14 year old kid shot his friends and cousins before some teacher tackled him as he was reloading ?? nooone rememebers this??

so to say that some how the police being called to a person/kid with a gun is suppsed to mean that they are suppsed to know the myrid of things in the back ground that brings that person to be at that situation and somehow wait until the kid shoots at someone or just brandishes the pistol at someone or PROVE they have a a gun when they only have a toy that looks real when you have ppeople calling and saying hey theres a kid with a gun "waving it around "

talk about crazy

one person out of what 3 maybe 4 says they THINK its a topy - well if they really THOUGHt it was a toy why are you calling the police/

a DUH becuase it MIGHT NOT BE A TOY and if thats the case then it means its real so you call the police because a kid/man/girl /old person waving a gun and pointing it at people is ...wait for it ...DANGEROUS

its a threat - the THREAT is alredy there with him having a "gun" til its proven he isnt a threat

you cant say NOONE else is not around the kid - why? because the police are "around" him and he has a gun

with other people around - it means he is a threat

lastly not for nothing but in these modern times - not the 20 or so fukking years ago you guys seems to be in - who the fukk GIVES their kid a replica of a gun?? with mass shootings or just plain old regular shootings being done by kids- esp a black kid

if its damgerous JUST being black and male how do you then say - well imma let my endangered black male child who can be shot by the police with NOTHING at all - imma let him play in a park with somethign that LOOKS like a dangerous weapon around other people - he will be fine - i did it 20- 30 years ago

dudes are like well the cops should know he was just playing he was just a kid he had a replica - they should have watied til he actually shot someone

this kid was a darwin award wating to happen - and it happened

if YOU think its so non threatening to have a replica pistol - why dont you walk around with one - see how it works out for you just around your family