Steph Curry is banned from Finals MVP contention

[Jplaya2023]

You can laugh all your want, still doesn't change the fact that Curry this season proved to be a better player than Zeke ever did.

Name one other perimeter player that was guarded over every inch of the halfcourt like Curry is. Even when they don't have the ball. With multiple players who gravitate towards him.



Another poster that can't read. I said help run the offense (go back through my posts) to see what I mean. Obviously Zeke RAN the offense. Do you like being dense on purpose when it comes to players/teams from previous eras?



Laimbeer was certainly no McHale (by any stretch of the imagination) but he was still able to create his shot - it wasn't all on spot up attempts and second chance opportunities. The point I was making there was it wasn't like he was scoring 17 points a game while nobody was guarding him.

curry has had 2 elite seaons, by comparison, zeke was an allstar from his 1st season all the way to his last season before blowing his achilies out. This is disrespectful. You're crowning curry to early. Stop it!

Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, see's more defensive attention than curry as a result of them not having 3 other 40% 3pt shooters on the floor with them at the same time. Lebron had all the attention of the warriors last year in the finals, unless you want me to think the other 6 ymca players lebron had garnered any respect from the warriors.

I'll admit on the vinnie/ kelly thing i didn't scroll through the other 500 post to find exactly what was said on that.

Lambier was a pick and pop player, or he scored on his own rebounds. You wasn't dumping it on the block and bill was killing people, like you could mchale or worthy. That's flat out incorrect. I bet 65% of bill's points were assisted on

 

[Texas2step]

What do you mean decide to show up before game 4.He was leading both teams in every statistical category up to game 4.Lebron is not a machine,He ran out of gas in game 4 because they only had 1 day of rest between games 3 & 4.Love had 4 full days of rest between games 2 and 4.The least he could do is go out and have a decent game.He's getting payed 22 m iilion per year.

Lebron was stat padding at the end of blowout games. People who watched the games realizes that game 5 is the only game Lebron made a big impact

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

curry has had 2 elite seaons, by comparison, zeke was an allstar from his 1st season all the way to his last season before blowing his achilies out. This is disrespectful. You're crowning curry to early. Stop it!

How many times do I need to say I'm not talking about on an all-time list. Just Zeke's peak as a player vs Curry's peak. Curry's place in history shouldn't be discussed until near the end of his prime, at least.

Jordan, Kobe, Lebron, see's more defensive attention than curry as a result of them not having 3 other 40% 3pt shooters on the floor with them at the same time. Lebron had all the attention of the warriors last year in the finals, unless you want me to think the other 6 ymca players lebron had garnered any respect from the warriors.

None of those three ever experienced the type of defensive attention that Curry does. LeBron was being guarding one-on-one in the Finals last season with Draymond deterring him away from the paint - while the rest of the Warriors stayed on the shooters/role players. Curry was being trapped/double teamed when he had the ball - even on PnRs behind the arc - the Cavs would force the ball outta his hands 26ft away from the rim with multiple players. Off the ball he had a man on him the moment he stepped foot in the halfcourt, and he had 2-3 in the vicinity gravitating towards him and over-helping when he was trying to navigate around screens.

If you can't see the defensive attention Curry receives after TWO SEASONS of this shyt - there's no hope for you. Remind me when either Jordan, Kobe or LeBron had dudes shadowing them over every inch of the halfcourt, on and off the ball.

Lambier was a pick and pop player, or he scored on his own rebounds. You wasn't dumping it on the block and bill was killing people, like you could mchale or worthy. That's flat out incorrect. I bet 65% of bill's points were assisted on

Where did I say that? Of course Bill wasn't killing defenders on the block.

Like I said the point I was trying to make was that he wasn't self-offensively inept to the point where he wasn't guarded.

 

[eastside313]

Why? Because you can't address the points I made?

The difference between me and you is I'm not here to recite popular narratives - I'm here to speak the truth.

And how did you come to this conclusion?

Because he's not. Both Kyrie (especially) and Curry manipulate the ball with both hands better than Zeke ever did. shyt even A.I. said they were on 'another level' compared to him -



I'm guessing you're the type of cat who treats players' opinions as gospel, ammirite? Do you still think my position is "laughable" when A.I. suggests they've taken what he showcased during his time to a new level?

I did NOT say this. I said they helped run the offense - meaning they helped move the ball in the halfcourt when running their sets. Zeke wasn't the team's ONLY option. Chuck even spoke on this himself after Dumars was drafted in '85; where he eventually shared the playmaking duties with Zeke.

Again. I did NOT say this. Learn to read -

Laimbeer was certainly no McHale (by any stretch of the imagination) but he was still able to create his shot - it wasn't all on spot up attempts and second chance opportunities. The point I was making there was it wasn't like he was scoring 17 points a game while nobody was guarding him.


I don't need to look at the stats when I know Johnson helped run the offense when Zeke was off the floor (and when they played together). Chuck wasn't worried when Zeke went to the bench because he knew Johnson would always be able to keep the offense running smoothly until it was time for him to check back in.

What the hell are you even talking about?

Just as I thought - you have absolutely no idea of what you're taking about.

.

You posted a you tube of Magic Johnson saying he had a bad series

I say

Magic dropped 18 14 8 on 56% shooting that year

Throwing out #s with no context. Do me a favor and watch those Finals.

Then a few pages later

CAN Y'ALL nikkaS STOP SAYING THIS BULLshyt WHEN I'VE ACKNOWLEDGED AND ADDRESSED THIS shyt?



i) Tripucka and Johnson helped run the offense - regardless Draymond acts the go-between man for the Warriors other players - not necessarily to help Curry, it's really helping the team get the best possible shot because of the Warriors' motion offense. We've seen Curry run the offense and put up assists under Jackson, yet the offense wasn't ass good as it was now.
ii) Tripucka and Laimbeer helped him carry the main scoring load while attracting "defensive attention". Both players were among the best scorers at their respective positions who could create their own shots during that season:

Zeke averaged 21 ppg on 45% shooting
Tripucka averaged 19 ppg on 47% shooting (his career-high was 26.5 ppg - quite clearly he's comparable to Klay)
Laimbeer averaged 17.5 ppg on 50% shooting

lol you tell me to go watch the1985 finals, then you go look at the piston stats and a YouTube video and comeback and say Tripuka is comparable to klay.

You say laimbeer was attracting defensive attention and gettin his own shot and Vinnie Johnson helped run the team. You can say whatever you want but anybody making claims that bill lambeer was out there on the court creating his own shot doesnt know anything about Bill laimbeer.

which is why it's pointless to go back and forth with you. its ok that Draymond runs the Warriors offense. You don't have to go making up stuff by looking at stats in an attempt to minimize zeke by comparing what piston players did to what warriors players do.

 

[Illuminatos]

Why are you nikkas acting like comparing Curry to Zeke is some form of blasphemy?

You 90s ball stans are fukking disgusting man. You fakkits won't ever admit that today's players are better than the ones you grew up with. You'll ignore all the facts and evidence all because you're blinded by nostalgia. Bunch of delusional washed up bytch nikkas.

 

[MAKAVELI25]

Why are you nikkas acting like comparing Curry to Zeke is some form of blasphemy?

You 90s ball stans are fukking disgusting man. You fakkits won't ever admit that today's players are better than the ones you grew up with. You'll ignore all the facts and evidence all because you're blinded by nostalgia. Bunch of delusional washed up bytch nikkas.

Did you watch Zeke play? I ask that rhetorically because:

1. You're younger than me (2.) You don't strike me as the kind of kid to go back and watch game film.

So your answer is prolly "no". In which case you shouldn't even be involved in this debate.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

.

You posted a you tube of Magic Johnson saying he had a bad series

I say

Then a few pages later

lol you tell me to go watch the1985 finals, then you go look at the piston stats and a YouTube video and comeback and say Tripuka is comparable to klay.

And I gave context (because I know what I'm talking about) - you go and reference Magic's #s failing to realize he fukked up multiple times in that series, basically costing the Lakers the championship. Nobody would reply with Magics #s when confronted with the FACT he "choked" like somehow he wasn't without blame when it's the most regurgitated LeBron 11' Finals performance comparative from a previous era. That tells me you don't know what you're talking about.

.
You say laimbeer was attracting defensive attention and gettin his own shot and Vinnie Johnson helped run the team.

Laimbeer was attracting defensive attention and yes Johnson did help run the team.

You can say whatever you want but anybody making claims that bill lambeer was out there on the court creating his own shot doesnt know anything about Bill laimbeer..

Here's the problem: you're viewing things in absolute tense. There's a HUGE difference between McHale's ability to create his own shot and Laimbeer's ability to create his own shot. Yet, Liambeer wasn't void of all self-shot creation, which is the point to me bringing up his name and the reason for why he scored 17 ppg during that season.

which is why it's pointless to go back and forth with you. its ok that Draymond runs the Warriors offense. You don't have to go making up stuff by looking at stats in an attempt to minimize zeke by comparing what piston players did to what warriors players do.

You still don't get it. Zeke wasn't doing it by HIMSELF - he had help. He had help in the scoring department and he had help with playmaking. I was trying to draw a line where the overlapping of their skillsets and success weren't down to Curry having help and Zeke not having any help at all.

 

[Illuminatos]

Did you watch Zeke play? I ask that rhetorically because:

1. You're younger than me (2.) You don't strike me as the kind of kid to go back and watch game film.

So your answer is prolly "no". In which case you shouldn't even be involved in this debate.

I've watched hundreds of Isiah Thomas games.

 

[Cyber]

The gap between peak Curry and peak Zeke is closer then it's made out to be by both sides, and this is probably the only non-pistons fansite where the majority would say Zeke since most NBA fans slurp the shyt out of Curry and Zeke remains a polarizing figure.

Curry has ways to go before surpassing Zeke on the all-time list though, Curry has been the better regular season player but Zeke's dominance in the postseason puts him on top.

 

[eastside313]

And I gave context (because I know what I'm talking about) - you go and reference Magic's #s failing to realize he fukked up multiple times in that series, basically costing the Lakers the championship. Nobody would reply with Magics #s when confronted with the FACT he "choked" like somehow he wasn't without blame when it's the most regurgitated LeBron 11' Finals performance comparative from a previous era. That tells me you don't know what you're talking about.

Laimbeer was attracting defensive attention and yes Johnson did help run the team.

Here's the problem: you're viewing things in absolute tense. There's a HUGE difference between McHale's ability to create his own shot and Laimbeer's ability to create his own shot. Yet, Liambeer wasn't void of all self-shot creation, which is the point to me bringing up his name and the reason for why he scored 17 ppg during that season.



You still don't get it. Zeke wasn't doing it by HIMSELF - he had help. He had help in the scoring department and he had help with playmaking. I was trying to draw a line where the overlapping of their skillsets and success weren't down to Curry having help and Zeke not having any help at all.

No you didn't give me context. You posted a YouTube video. I never said magic was without blame. I said curry isn't playing up to his caliber in the finals. His numbers are well below his season avg is what I said. You then went to YouTube and said well magic stink in the 85 finals. And I posted his numbers which were very good. I never said he didn't choke or anything of the sort.

Vinnie Johnson was not a pg. Did he run some plays of course what guard doesn't. That was Isiah team from the time he was drafted until the time he left. Saying Vinnie helped run the team is like saying robert horry helped shaq in the post.

Bill laimbeer had zero post game and was not taking anybody off the dribble. Tell me how he was creating his own shot since you know it all. Your bringing his name up because you looked at his stats and you said ow he scored 17ppg he must've been some type of offensive force.

I never said Isiah didn't have help, but he was the unquestioned leader and driving force of the pistons. He was thee playmaker thee table setter for the Pistons. Able to score 20 a game and get plenty of assists and run the team.

But you want to make up some narrative that Tripuka and Vinnie Johnson was out there being playmakers and Bill laimbeer was out there taking people off the dribble and getting his own shot.


Warriors are a different team and are successful how they play. We get it you think curry is better than Isiah. But you don't have to attempt to correlate piston players to warrior players. Draymond is the table setter for the Warriors. That doesn't mean you have to say look Tripuka and Vinnie Johnson also ran the Pistons. Look Tripuka and Bill laimbeer scored these points. He's like klay and laimbeer was a offensive force. In an attempt to say Why didn't Isiah score like curry since he had them on his team.

 

[KOBE]

Again, that doesn't make him a better passer. A large amount of his assist opportunities come from when he sucks in defenders on drives and kicks (I'd like to see the heat map of team defenses on his drives). I'm referring to passing skillsets: creativity, halfcourt offense, getting the ball to players in their spots, finding cutters, creating holes in the defense, finding players in traffic when the defense is set etc etc.

Creativity? Oh you mean when Curry creatively turns it over by doing too fancy of a pass.

Getting the ball to players in their spots? I think Westbrook repeatedly finds Durant repeatedly in the midrange area, Roberson when he's cutting, Adams when he draws in the defenders and he's right under the hoop or when he's cutting alongside him for alley oops, Kanter for midrange jumpers, Morrow from beyond the arc, etc.

He creates holes in the defense by making the defense collapse, you just said this yourself, which allows him to find all the open players and he gets it to them too, regardless of the position he's in or even if he's in the air.

It's outright ridiculous to suggest Curry is a better passer than Westbrook, even if you have a hard on for him. The Warriors offense and ball movement is also far and away better and like I already said they have better offensive players than what Westbrook has to deal with. It's easier to find guys for open threes when they can knock them down than finding a guy like Waiters/Roberson behind the arc and having no idea if they're hot enough to hit it. Westbrook is the better passer than Curry, assists DO matter in this discussion as it's clear that he finds his guys all the time. Oh and there would be no need for "extra passes" if you were finding guys in their spots/already cutting at the rim.

 

[Tha_Mac]

Damn this nikka @Gil Scott-Heroin love him some Steph Curry

 

[360Waves]

Damn this nikka @Gil Scott-Heroin love him some Steph Curry

Breh has the nerve to call me a LeBron dikkrider but you'll never catch me staying up all through the night, writing dissertation after dissertation for 2 days straight just to protect a player. And the crazy thing is he does it in like 8 different threads at once.

 

[Mars]

Lebron was stat padding at the end of blowout games. People who watched the games realizes that game 5 is the only game Lebron made a big impact

This is just stupid and ignorant.

Game 1:

Cavs took a 1 pt lead in the 3rd qt,Lebron makes a shot to put them up 68-67,I guess Lebron's 18p,6r,6a up to that point doesn't count ? Lebron went to the bench with the cavs down only 3 pts,GS goes on a 13-2 run with James on the bench.Cavs go from down 3 to down 14 with James on the bench.I guess that's his fault ?

Game 3:

Cavs were up By only 8 pts at the half,Lebron broke the game open in the 2nd half,but I guess his 32p,11r,6a doesn't count.Oh...by the way,Lebron scored 8 of the cavs first 19 points to put them up 19-4,but I guess he had no impact on helping cleveland get the lead....and what about his great defense on T.Green ? I guess that doesn't count also.What's so funny is that Irving scoed 12 pts in the 1st quarter after the cavs went up by 15 points,but I guess his pts count and Lebron's don't

Game 4:

Lebron scoes and gives the Cavs a 2 pt 4th qt lead,83-81....but I guess Lebron's 19p,8a,7r up to that point doesn't count ?


I guess all of the points Curry,Thompson and Green score when GS is up double digits doesn't count aswell.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

Creativity? Oh you mean when Curry creatively turns it over by doing too fancy of a pass. .

Or how Westbrook flings it into the 10th row on a simple crosscourt pass?

Getting the ball to players in their spots? I think Westbrook repeatedly finds Durant repeatedly in the midrange area, Roberson when he's cutting, Adams when he draws in the defenders and he's right under the hoop or when he's cutting alongside him for alley oops, Kanter for midrange jumpers, Morrow from beyond the arc, etc.

Yes I know all of this. You're speaking as if this is some higher level that Curry isn't on. If you'd seen him under Jackson with a ball dominant, 1-2 ball movement offense you would've seen the EXACT same from Curry. Difference is now the Warriors run a motion offense and they have more playmakers which has cut down Curry's opportunities to set players up in the traditional sense.

He creates holes in the defense by making the defense collapse, you just said this yourself, which allows him to find all the open players and he gets it to them too, regardless of the position he's in or even if he's in the air.

Nobody is debating this.

It's outright ridiculous to suggest Curry is a better passer than Westbrook, even if you have a hard on for him..

i) I never said Curry was a better passer - I just said that Rondo, Rubio and CP are the PGs who're better passers than he is - Westbrook and Curry are comparable (gun to my head I'd say Curry though)
ii)



It seems to me you aren't familiar with his passing ability if you think it's "outright ridiculous" to even suggest he might be better Westbrook.

The Warriors offense and ball movement is also far and away better and like I already said they have better offensive players than what Westbrook has to deal with. It's easier to find guys for open threes when they can knock them down than finding a guy like Waiters/Roberson behind the arc and having no idea if they're hot enough to hit it.

Why are you only talking about what's happened this season? Why are you ignoring the offense and players under Jackson?

Westbrook is the better passer than Curry, assists DO matter in this discussion as it's clear that he finds his guys all the time.

First of all he doesn't find his guys all the time which is why he's turnover prone.

Assists only matter if you're willing to tell the full story.

Westbrook dominates the ball more than Curry - therefore he's going to have more opportunities to get assists
Westbrook passes the ball more to set players in scoring position - therefore he's going to have more opportunities to get assists
Westbrook runs a ISO-dominant offense, as opposed to Curry who runs a motion offense - therefore he's going to have more opportunities to get assists
Westbrook has less playmakers on his squad - meaning he has a bigger playmaking role - therefore he's going to have more opportunities to get assists.

I don't see why this is so hard to understand.

Oh and there would be no need for "extra passes" if you were finding guys in their spots/already cutting at the rim.

If you knew how the Warriors offense worked you wouldn't be saying this nonsense.