Some Liberals do this thing after shootings that is so hypocritical.

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So you think everybody should be forced to be trained in the military like in Switzerland :dwillhuh:

Sounds kid of oppressive to me, friend.

Also, Switzerland has like 8 million people, and is literally the RICHEST country on earth :heh:


What a foolish comparison :heh:

Bro, you haven't made single post here with any sort of facts, statistics or anything meaningful.

All you have been doing is making these absurd posts. Why can't your argue your position accordingly?

You spent too much time here arguing with theists and forgot how to engage in a debate against someone who presents you with facts.
 

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It's funny, I was just talking to a Swiss person about this a few days ago. He was telling me that it was because the country has mandatory military service that every home has one of these, but he seemed very opposed to the idea himself and also said that some of the politicians over there were trying to change the laws so that people have to turn in their rifles after military service instead of being able to keep them, and that the gun violence over there has been on the rise. I don't know the specifics, though, so I can't really comment on the situation, and he was only one person.

The law didn't come close to passing, and the violence went up (it has recently began to trend downwards) but this is relative to their statistics and not when compared to other countries.
 

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Can one of you geniuses bring up the gun violence and crime rats in the UK, which has the harshest gun control laws in the West? Can you tell me how many massacres they had after these laws were passed?
 

The Real

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Can one of you geniuses bring up the gun violence and crime rats in the UK, which has the harshest gun control laws in the West? Can you tell me how many massacres they had after these laws were passed?

The UK always had strict gun control, though, and it always had a very low rate of gun violence, too. This seems like a counterintuitive example to use for your argument. They've had maybe 4 real gun rampages in the last 100 years.
 

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Criminals typically use illegal weapons. It makes no sense punishing responsible citizens for the actions of criminals who use illegal weapons and a small majority of irresponsible users of legally purchased firearms.
 

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Bro, you haven't made single post here with any sort of facts, statistics or anything meaningful.

All you have been doing is making these absurd posts. Why can't your argue your position accordingly?

You spent too much time here arguing with theists and forgot how to engage in a debate against someone who presents you with facts.

Switzerland is the richest country on earth isn't a fact?

Everyone is drafted and trained in the military isn't a fact?

When did I argue with theists? I'm a theist myself :heh:

Are you good breh :heh:
 

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kevm3

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the norway shooter obtained his weapons in a nation with strict control laws. chicago is one of the strictest cities in the us in regards to gun control, yet it has one of the higher murder rates.

How many people die from drunk driving and how much trouble is caused by alcohol. Do you suggest banning this as well?
 

GoddamnyamanProf

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Nah your thread is dumb and I'll explain why (Your cited SCOTUS cases are irrelevant btw. Your claim is that gun control is "crip walking on the Constitution," so let's stick to the intent of the framers as opposed to some Supreme Court judges opinion on it, lest you want to defend blind super PACs because of the Citizens United ruling).

1. Your initial premise of accusing liberals of hypocrisy for opposing The Patriot Act and FISA and being pro-gun control is non-sequitur. Many do not see calling for regulations and restrictions on semi-automatic assault rifles an infringement on liberty, and it certainly does not compare in magnitude or scale to warrantless wiretapping, which is clearly a violation of the 4th amendment because there's no probable cause for roaming warrantless wiretaps. They didn't even try to fight it in court, they just urged lawmakers not to prosecute because there isn't even a question of the constitutionality of it.

Even if we do go with your claim that regulating assault rifles is an infringement on liberty, well, every right granted in the Constitution is limited in some respect. I'll go to the famous "You can't yell fire in a crowded theater" example. So obviously people who are against FISA and the Patriot Act and for gun control just have a different threshold and interpretation of what liberties they think should be limited and to what degree. That doesn't make them hypocrites.

You might want to watch who you point the finger at for hypocrisy because many would argue that social security and other social welfare programs you support are not constitutional unless you stretch the fukk out of the general welfare clause in article I. You can't pick and choose what you want to be strict constitutional interpreter about then call people hypocrites if they see things another way.

2. It's silly to say you know that the framers intended the 2nd amendment to not restrict any types of firearms whatsoever, even semi-automatic assault rifles, when it was written at the time when the most advanced firearm was the flintlock rifle. I will remind you that the Constitution was meant to be a living document, of course.

Look at the 2nd amendent.

It's easy to see why the framers would want to give robust rights to arms to people when they led a revolution themselves against a colonial power and were fighting against the American Indians whose land they stole. And they wanted to reassure anti-federalists that militias would've be disarmed. The 2nd amendment was more about granting rights to form a militia to combat Indians or tyrannical government and appeasing those with militia leanings than it was about personal protection and this is common knowledge.

But that's neither here nor there, really. Again, it says the people should have the right to bear arms and it will not be infringed. But the line has to be drawn somewhere unless you think people should be able to own their personal nuclear missile silos.

Where do you draw the line? You can carry a semi-automatic assault rifle, but not a fully automatic machine gun? What about silencers? What about extended clips? Can I pack a rocket-propelled grenade launcher? What about hand grenades? Can I put land mines in my yard? What about a shoulder-mounted rocket launcher and stinger missiles? Can I drive a tank? A gunboat? White phosphorous?

There were no semi-automatic assault rifles and extended clips that hold 50 rounds in 1787. The framers couldn't even fathom that, just like we can't fathom the weapons of the future.

I'll try. Let's say in the future, we can use our mobile devices to call in small aerial drones that fire hails of projectiles that we could call in like missile strikes to cut people down while we're in our homes. Should that be legal? Hey, if you ban them, according to your logic, that's a violation of the 2nd amendment.

So everyone draws the line somewhere. I might draw the line at semi-automatic assault rifles. You might draw the line at fully automatic machine guns...or RPGs, I don't know.

3. You kinda discredited yourself a bit by how you framed it in the beginning. Not only the bogus hypocrisy charge, but you called regulations and restrictions on military-style firearms for private citizens "cripwalking on the Constitution," instead of just stating you think it places unfair limits on the 2nd amendment, which is the type of hyperbolic, sensationalized rhetoric one would expect to hear from Michael Savage or Rush Limbaugh, and makes it hard to take you serious as someone operating from cold logic as you're posturing to be.

This is the level of discourse in this forum. I bring up a simple point, and then back it up extensively with historical and legal proof, and I get attacked personally and am subjected to long posts that provide no actual argument or proof.

Go head, do a little research on what the founding fathers and men of the enlightenment thought about the 2nd Amendment principles. You'll be presently surprised at just how much they took into consideration future scenarios and weapons.

But keep calling me names, rush Limbaugh, gun nut and posting long winded posts that amount to no argument. I'll be here if any of you decide to bring any valid counter arguments.

Thread was over right here. White flag.
 

kevm3

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Alcohol-Related Deaths Kill More Than AIDS, TB Or Violence, WHO Reports


Alcohol causes nearly 4 percent of deaths worldwide, more than AIDS, tuberculosis or violence, the World Health Organization warned on Friday.

Rising incomes have triggered more drinking in heavily populated countries in Africa and Asia, including India and South Africa, and binge drinking is a problem in many developed countries, the United Nations agency said.

Yet alcohol control policies are weak and remain a low priority for most governments despite drinking's heavy toll on society from road accidents, violence, disease, child neglect and job absenteeism, it said.

Approximately 2.5 million people die each year from alcohol related causes, the WHO said in its "Global Status Report on Alcohol and Health."

"The harmful use of alcohol is especially fatal for younger age groups and alcohol is the world's leading risk factor for death among males aged 15-59," the report found.

Time to go back to prohibition as well?
 

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Thread was over right here. White flag.

Only in this piece of shyt forum do people consider a reply that ignores legal and historical facts as great. I mean if Vic argued what he did on any other more civilized forum without citing law, how to go about amending the law and making up lies about the framers intentions, he'd be laughed at.

Here, its more important if you agree with someone instead of making an actual argument.
 

MeachTheMonster

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the norway shooter obtained his weapons in a nation with strict control laws. chicago is one of the strictest cities in the us in regards to gun control, yet it has one of the higher murder rates.

How many people die from drunk driving and how much trouble is caused by alcohol Do you suggest banning this as well?

You can't compare guns to alcohol because a gun's sole purpose is to kill. Guns are deadly weapons. And in some cases they are easier to get than a drivers license. Currently there isn't even a real system in place to track these guns on a national level. Criminals can go to states with very lenient gun laws and purchase a bunch of weapons then bring them back to a state with more strict laws and sell them on the black market. Currently mentally disabled people can buy guns and bullets. The Colorado shooter bought thousands of bullets online after he had been seen for mental health issues. Don't you think there should be some type of system in place to at least red flag these situations before they become massacres.

What I don't understand is that people who are gun advocates will tell you guns are important and they are a great responsibility. But they don't want to accept that responsibility and prove they are worthy of it. If you advocate for guns why wouldn't you want them to be as safe as possible? Why wouldn't you want it harder for criminals to get their hands on guns? Why wouldn't you want the guns that are sold to at least be accounted for and trackable?
 

Dusty Bake Activate

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Only in this piece of shyt forum do people consider a reply that ignores legal and historical facts as great. I mean if Vic argued what he did on any other more civilized forum without citing law, how to go about amending the law and making up lies about the framers intentions, he'd be laughed at.

Here, its more important if you agree with someone instead of making an actual argument.

I did cite law. I cited the fukking 2nd amendment and the intent of the framers and you cannot refute it. You type into you're blue in the face, but you cannot, have not, and will not make a credible case that the framers intended the 2nd amendment to mean that it is unconstitutional for the government to place any restrictions on any conceivable weapons for private citizens to own.
 
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