Serious Question: What exactly does Lebron do BETTER right now than Penny Hardaway did offensively?
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DoubleClutch
Superstar
That's not saying lebron could do X better than Penny could do X. It's just saying lebron tried harder per 48 minutes than Penny or just played more minutes/took more shots, etc.
but the point is Penny did everything lebron did at a younger age against better competition and before lebron and he looked better doing it. Lebrons game looked forced at home, and has had its share of criticisms over the years.
All you experts come and tell me ONE major weakness Penny had offensively only 3 years into the league
He's more of a natural and more skilled whereas lebron lies on his size and iq more and had more years to develop his game.
The point is Penny was just as good potentially at a younger age and more skilled and talented to the naked eye. Penny never reached his prime but saying we've never seen an all around player like lebron is basically saying Penny didn't exist.
It's almost like some kid saying the NBA never seen a player like Kobe Bryant.
The craziest thing is lebron learned from watching Penny.
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I know you didn't read all that and watch the video in 2 minutes
Absolutely no bigger Penny stan than me growing up.
But nah, Bron is way better. More importantly he's way more consistent.
Penny was dominant seldomly, Bron is dominant all the time. Could Penny put up Bron numbers? Yes, for maybe a game or two....but not consistently for an entire year.
Rigby.
The #1 Rated Mixtape of all Time
Rigby.
The #1 Rated Mixtape of all Time
I'm almost 90% sure Curry takes a lot less shots than JordanSeriously though, after looking at the stats. Lebron's y'know 27 and 7. But Kobe's averaged 28 when with Shaq, he's hit 30, 34, 35 a few times. It's insane.
Magic's around 20 points, but 15 assists. Larry Bird 24 points, 7 assists
Bill Russell 20 points, 24 rebounds Wilt started 40 points, 20 rebounds, finally settled to 15 ppg territory
Then you hit Michael Jordan's stats.
He had Hardaway's 5 assists pretty much. But he averaged over 30 points a game for 7 years in a row
Four other years, he was within a point and a half of thirty, one time he averaged fukking 37 points a game.
You don't even have to watch him play, you just read his PPG stat line and are like "Give him the GOAT."
I would've been honored to watch that guy play, because honestly I don't even understand. Steph Curry hits 3 pointers from behind 8 dudes, and he only averages 21. What the hell was Michael Jordan doing
Curry isn't a volume shooter anyway, but if he was
That's not saying lebron could do X better than Penny could do X. It's just saying lebron tried harder per 48 minutes than Penny or just played more minutes/took more shots, etc.
but the point is Penny did everything lebron did at a younger age against better competition and before lebron and he looked better doing it. Lebrons game looked forced at home, and has had its share of criticisms over the years.
All you experts come and tell me ONE major weakness Penny had offensively only 3 years into the league
He's more of a natural and more skilled whereas lebron lies on his size and iq more and had more years to develop his game.
The point is Penny was just as good potentially at a younger age and more skilled and talented to the naked eye. Penny never reached his prime but saying we've never seen an all around player like lebron is basically saying Penny didn't exist.
It's almost like some kid saying the NBA never seen a player like Kobe Bryant.
The craziest thing is lebron learned from watching Penny.
Again, you keep bringing up natural skill and talent to go with how the game looks and that's stupid.
Lebron is more Duncan-esque than anything. He simply looks for the best way to do something and will keep doing it until it can be stopped. He's not trying to be flashy, he's trying to be effective. That doesn't make him lacking in skill.
You're talking about Lebron's shooting but him and Penny are comparable three point shooters. Penny's best year is like 1.5 (4.5 3PA) and Lebron was matching that his 2nd year in the league 1.4 (3.9 3PA). How much better was Penny at shooting? Penny's shooting isn't a weakness but Lebron's is despite Lebron matching Penny's best season?
When people talk about Lebron's all around game, it's about the fact that he can do pretty much everything at a high level. He can play the role of an elite playmaker, an elite scorer, an elite bigman, or anything in between. Lebron might be less versatile than Penny but it doesn't matter because he's still a better scorer because he's absolutely elite at what he's good at and it's all but impossible to stop him.
Again, is Brooke Lopez a more skilled and better offensive player than Shaq? Brooke has more range, a better FT shooter, a better ball handler, and has way more post moves than Shaq but is he better and more impactful than Shaq?
DoubleClutch
Superstar
A lot of good points made in this tread like the one above.
All I'm saying is penny was just as skilled if not more.
Lebron got him on rebounds but everything else is debatable to me
The way I see it, Lebron
produces better cause he's bigger stronger and faster than most not more skilled and has played on teams where he had to do it all and players/coaches let him do whatever he has wanted since day one.
Penny was more passive and more of a team player so his stats aren't showing a consistent dominant performance but at times dominated the game like Lebron did. Just look up his best games.
He didn't have to do it all ALL the time. You know what he was capable of just by watching him against great defenders like pippen, who said penny was better than him in his rookie year.
Or when everyone is comparing his passes to magic.
People were saying the same things about penny they are saying about Lebron.
Only difference is, penny's game was actually fun to watch.
Lebrons game from day one just ain't that fun to watch if he's not on a break away dunk. It's pretty basic and he wasn't the most skilled but he is smart especially now. That's why hes using a post game now because it's easier than hitting open jumpshots (and he gets easy assists passing out from double teams)
But his post game still ain't better than penny's, it's just more effective
Like someone said Lebron finds out what works and can't be stopped and does it over and over cause it's easy for him.
Sounds a lot like JAMES HARDEN game to me, which the coli seems to hate unanimously
Harden gets buckets by doing the same 3 moves over and over and drawing fouls. I guess he's a better/more skilled scorer than curry according to his high ppg
The problem is I watch players and the game and judge them more on that than i rely on what s piece of paper says.
But lebrons stats show him to be better than penny. So it is what it is.
I'll just leave you Lebron fans with another penny mix but you'd probably rather see his stats
All I'm saying is penny was just as skilled if not more.
Lebron got him on rebounds but everything else is debatable to me
The way I see it, Lebron
produces better cause he's bigger stronger and faster than most not more skilled and has played on teams where he had to do it all and players/coaches let him do whatever he has wanted since day one.
Penny was more passive and more of a team player so his stats aren't showing a consistent dominant performance but at times dominated the game like Lebron did. Just look up his best games.
He didn't have to do it all ALL the time. You know what he was capable of just by watching him against great defenders like pippen, who said penny was better than him in his rookie year.
Or when everyone is comparing his passes to magic.
People were saying the same things about penny they are saying about Lebron.
Only difference is, penny's game was actually fun to watch.
Lebrons game from day one just ain't that fun to watch if he's not on a break away dunk. It's pretty basic and he wasn't the most skilled but he is smart especially now. That's why hes using a post game now because it's easier than hitting open jumpshots (and he gets easy assists passing out from double teams)
But his post game still ain't better than penny's, it's just more effective
Like someone said Lebron finds out what works and can't be stopped and does it over and over cause it's easy for him.
Sounds a lot like JAMES HARDEN game to me, which the coli seems to hate unanimously
Harden gets buckets by doing the same 3 moves over and over and drawing fouls. I guess he's a better/more skilled scorer than curry according to his high ppg
The problem is I watch players and the game and judge them more on that than i rely on what s piece of paper says.
But lebrons stats show him to be better than penny. So it is what it is.
I'll just leave you Lebron fans with another penny mix but you'd probably rather see his stats
DoubleClutch
Superstar
Definition of a 1 star thread.
Propaganda
Superstar
A lot of good points made in this tread like the one above.
All I'm saying is penny was just as skilled if not more.
Lebron got him on rebounds but everything else is debatable to me
The way I see it, Lebron
produces better cause he's bigger stronger and faster than most not more skilled and has played on teams where he had to do it all and players/coaches let him do whatever he has wanted since day one.
Penny was more passive and more of a team player so his stats aren't showing a consistent dominant performance but at times dominated the game like Lebron did. Just look up his best games.
He didn't have to do it all ALL the time. You know what he was capable of just by watching him against great defenders like pippen, who said penny was better than him in his rookie year.
Or when everyone is comparing his passes to magic.
People were saying the same things about penny they are saying about Lebron.
Only difference is, penny's game was actually fun to watch.
Lebrons game from day one just ain't that fun to watch if he's not on a break away dunk. It's pretty basic and he wasn't the most skilled but he is smart especially now. That's why hes using a post game now because it's easier than hitting open jumpshots (and he gets easy assists passing out from double teams)
But his post game still ain't better than penny's, it's just more effective
Like someone said Lebron finds out what works and can't be stopped and does it over and over cause it's easy for him.
Sounds a lot like JAMES HARDEN game to me, which the coli seems to hate unanimously
Harden gets buckets by doing the same 3 moves over and over and drawing fouls. I guess he's a better/more skilled scorer than curry according to his high ppg
The problem is I watch players and the game and judge them more on that than i rely on what s piece of paper says.
But lebrons stats show him to be better than penny. So it is what it is.
I'll just leave you Lebron fans with another penny mix but you'd probably rather see his stats
stop it son. you actually just watched highlight reels. cuz if you were old enough to see prime penny you wouldn't be trying to make this comparison...even if you were a hardaway stan.
or is this just an awkward attempt to shyt on lebron?
A lot of good points made in this tread like the one above.
All I'm saying is penny was just as skilled if not more.
Lebron got him on rebounds but everything else is debatable to me
The way I see it, Lebron
produces better cause he's bigger stronger and faster than most not more skilled and has played on teams where he had to do it all and players/coaches let him do whatever he has wanted since day one.
Penny was more passive and more of a team player so his stats aren't showing a consistent dominant performance but at times dominated the game like Lebron did. Just look up his best games.
He didn't have to do it all ALL the time. You know what he was capable of just by watching him against great defenders like pippen, who said penny was better than him in his rookie year.
Or when everyone is comparing his passes to magic.
People were saying the same things about penny they are saying about Lebron.
Only difference is, penny's game was actually fun to watch.
Lebrons game from day one just ain't that fun to watch if he's not on a break away dunk. It's pretty basic and he wasn't the most skilled but he is smart especially now. That's why hes using a post game now because it's easier than hitting open jumpshots (and he gets easy assists passing out from double teams)
But his post game still ain't better than penny's, it's just more effective
Like someone said Lebron finds out what works and can't be stopped and does it over and over cause it's easy for him.
Sounds a lot like JAMES HARDEN game to me, which the coli seems to hate unanimously
Harden gets buckets by doing the same 3 moves over and over and drawing fouls. I guess he's a better/more skilled scorer than curry according to his high ppg
The problem is I watch players and the game and judge them more on that than i rely on what s piece of paper says.
But lebrons stats show him to be better than penny. So it is what it is.
I'll just leave you Lebron fans with another penny mix but you'd probably rather see his stats
The difference between James and Penny compared to Curry and Harden is that Curry is much more efficient.
Lebron is also much more efficient than Penny even when scoring at a higher volume. It's not really debatable. Plenty of players have the talent to explode spontaneously but the difference between elite and very good is consistency.
Lebron is consistently dominant and efficient like Duncan is. Lebron is pretty much what happens when you mix in Duncan's sheer IQ and put it in Shaq.
Also, Lebron isn't just bigger and stronger than people. That's an awful way to describe Lebron. Lebron has amazingly soft-hands around the rim, he has an amazing ability to both absorb contact or power through it depending on how he plans to finish, he has amazing predictive skills, etc.
Lebron is very good at basic things which is why he's so hard to stop. It's why Lebron gets into the lane at will even though people will play off of him and plan to keep him out the lane. He's good at protecting the balls on drives and cutting off angles to poke the ball away without fouling. He's good at using his lower body and hips to seal off smaller defenders from bothering him or using fakes to get bigger defenders flat footed.
Lebron is an ungodly cerebral and intelligent player. The reason you think he's boring is because he doesn't need to be flashy to get a shot off when he wants but we've seen Lebron hit numerous "WTF" shots when he's put in truly awkward situations where he's off one leg and half outta bounds.
Kobe does crazy shots and stuff because he HAD to. He copied a lot of Jordan's game but he simply wasn't as athletic or strong as Jordan so he had a harder time creating separation like Jordan could...even with the same moves.
Lebron rarely needs to do things because he's great at putting himself into the best situation to get shots off which is a skill. But stop trying to use that as a slight against Lebron.
I loved Penny. I always love guys with that varied skill set. He was evolutionary Magic Johnson to me. I thought he and Shaq would win championships together and I wanted to see it happen.
But he wasn't even close to as good as Lebron. He just so rarely opposed his will on a game...
He could be a 30-point scorer, but rarely scored 30+ points, even in the playoffs when rotations tighten up and teams rely on their stars more. He was a gifted passer, but rarely had one of those 12-assist games - more like he had a highlight-reel assist here and there rather than picking the other team apart play after play. He was a solid and at times even lockdown defender, but never the elite, "he might just take over this game with his defense" level. He couldn't impose his will on a game with rebounding, like Lebron and even Magic did from time to time. He could shoot the ball, but was never that threatening of a 3pt shooter when he still had his athleticism...
It was like Penny had all the tools, but we were still waiting for him to really grow into them when the injuries came.
Penny might have been every bit as good as Lebron if he had gotten stronger, avoided the injuries, and began to oppose his will on games when his team needed it.
But he wasn't even close to as good as Lebron. He just so rarely opposed his will on a game...
He could be a 30-point scorer, but rarely scored 30+ points, even in the playoffs when rotations tighten up and teams rely on their stars more. He was a gifted passer, but rarely had one of those 12-assist games - more like he had a highlight-reel assist here and there rather than picking the other team apart play after play. He was a solid and at times even lockdown defender, but never the elite, "he might just take over this game with his defense" level. He couldn't impose his will on a game with rebounding, like Lebron and even Magic did from time to time. He could shoot the ball, but was never that threatening of a 3pt shooter when he still had his athleticism...
It was like Penny had all the tools, but we were still waiting for him to really grow into them when the injuries came.
Penny might have been every bit as good as Lebron if he had gotten stronger, avoided the injuries, and began to oppose his will on games when his team needed it.
So essentially you're giving Penny extra points for NOT improving his game? And you're punishing Bron for working on his craft?
backbreaker65
All Star
No Penny still improved on the skills he has, he just didn't need that "if he had a i.e. Post Game, left hand, I.Q ect" Penny had all that in spades and improved upon them. By being a finished product, he could do it all. at high level.So essentially you're giving Penny extra points for NOT improving his game? And you're punishing Bron for working on his craft?
Broad Street Bully
Sick & Tide Sixers/Phillies/Cowboys fan smh
Im surprised you know who Penny is, youngin
