SCOTUS Watch Thread

[Robbie3000]

Is that possibly an outlier due to the larger Asian population? I don’t think they went up in Michigan or Florida.

Cali favors them demographically so I don't expect as extreme jump elsewhere.

Y’all may be right about top state schools, but I think it will be different at the Ivies. Asians are going to be way more over represented than they currently are.

 

[WIA20XX]

Most of this debate has been about highly selective colleges - Ivy and State.

I'm curious as to how this affects admissions at lower ranked colleges.

 

[Robbie3000]

White women benefitted the most from it which is already a downfall.

It mostly helped minority children from upper middle class to wealthy families attend college.

Bertrand Cooper had an article about Harvard's Affirmative Action program and how it was the children of wealthy African parents and wealthy that made up the group, even though Harvard had perfect representation across race:

https://archive.fo/NM1sR#selection-647.0-869.468

All your crab in a barrel dreams are coming true. Congrats.

 

[DrBanneker]

White women benefitted the most from it which is already a downfall.

It mostly helped minority children from upper middle class to wealthy families attend college.

Bertrand Cooper had an article about Harvard's Affirmative Action program and how it was the children of wealthy African parents and wealthy that made up the group, even though Harvard had perfect representation across race:

https://archive.fo/NM1sR#selection-647.0-869.468

A lot of this is factual but a more recent development as far as immigrants are concerned. And AA helped lower income Blacks too. Let's not act like the lower or even middle class has traditionally dominated Ivy League student bodies. Poor and middle class Black folks benefited a lot at good state schools and smaller non-Ivy private schools.

 

[Bleed The Freak]

Someone needs to sue for legacy admissions and I am here for the fukkery

 

[T’Challa’s Heir]

Someone needs to sue for legacy admissions and I am here for the fukkery

I’ve thought about that, and don’t think it’s possible for essentially 2 reasons

1) Legacy status doesn’t facially touch a protected class. Race is a protected class, so the consideration of that is how they killed AA. So I’m not sure there’s an actual constitutional violation to allege under the 14th amendment in the same way there is when race is used.

2) make the round about argument, due to past discrimination and longstanding effects of racism. Legacy admission is basically a proxy for race, and that consideration of legacy admissions implicit also considers the now banned use of race. Which runs into problems because there are minority legacy admits. And even I could sell that theory. I don’t know how to get around disparate impact analysis. Which is basically if a policy seems to solely hurt black people, so long as no one is on record saying the n-word and expressly saying we did this to hurt black people, no harm no foul.

 

[mastermind]

A lot of this is factual but a more recent development as far as immigrants are concerned. And AA helped lower income Blacks too. Let's not act like the lower or even middle class has traditionally dominated Ivy League student bodies. Poor and middle class Black folks benefited a lot at good state schools and smaller non-Ivy private schools.

I am a lower income child of African immigrants. I am saying it didn’t help some lower income people, but that it didn’t a large enough swath of us. It also mostly benefitted white women, which was not the intended goal of it.

It needed to be improved and worked in to help the right people, but it never did and instead got picked apart over 50 years by the courts.

 

[Megadeus]

Welp there it is. It was all fun and games in 2016 with the contrarians.

The silver lining is whites will now realize how much they were benefitting from affirmative action over Asians.

Yep. I saw this day coming from jump, so I'm mentally prepared... Still kinda sad tho to see yet another can of worms pried open. This is gonna affect academia and the corporate world as a whole in a major way

 

[T’Challa’s Heir]

I am a lower income child of African immigrants. I am saying it didn’t help some lower income people, but that it didn’t a large enough swath of us. It also mostly benefitted white women, which was not the intended goal of it.

It needed to be improved and worked in to help the right people, but it never did and instead got picked apart over 50 years by the courts.

I don’t know if you’re mixing up two arguments. But white women have been the biggest beneficiaries in terms of AA in the work place. I don’t think that holds true for education. And if we get super technical, this decision didn’t bar the use of sex for AA, just race. So white women, under the law can still benefit from it.

 

[ADevilYouKhow]

Both sides, Baby

“I like my racism out in the open”

“ Black people do not benefit from AA”

 

[Bleed The Freak]

I’ve thought about that, and don’t think it’s possible for essentially 2 reasons

1) Legacy status doesn’t facially touch a protected class. Race is a protected class, so the consideration of that is how they killed AA. So I’m not sure there’s an actual constitutional violation to allege under the 14th amendment in the same way there is when race is used.

2) make the round about argument, due to past discrimination and longstanding effects of racism. Legacy admission is basically a proxy for race, and that consideration of legacy admissions implicit also considers the now banned use of race. Which runs into problems because there are minority legacy admits. And even I could sell that theory. I don’t know how to get around disparate impact analysis. Which is basically if a policy seems to solely hurt black people, so long as no one is on record saying the n-word and expressly saying we did this to hurt black people, no harm no foul.

I think colleges will be shamed or heavily pressured to get rid of this practice. I could see a lot of Blue states putting into their laws to ban this (even though they have some of the worst offenses of it).

I'm sure Connecticut, Massachusetts, California and New Jersey won't exactly get their colleges on support of it. New York too. Gonna be a lot of pushback due to donations.

Colorado already did it.

 

[T’Challa’s Heir]

I think colleges will be shamed or heavily pressured to get rid of this practice. I could see a lot of Blue states putting into their laws to ban this (even though they have some of the worst offenses of it).

Colorado already did it.

You got a link to an article about Colorado? I was unaware of that. I wasnt sure a state had the authority to do something like to a private school.

 

[mastermind]

I don’t know if you’re mixing up two arguments. But white women have been the biggest beneficiaries in terms of AA in the work place. I don’t think that holds true for education. And if we get super technical, this decision didn’t bar the use of sex for AA, just race. So white women, under the law can still benefit from it.

I know sex wasn't in on the decision.

And sex isn't reported in admissions, but it is a correlation that they have benefitted in the workplace in taking on senior positions and they an uptick in women in college.

My only point is this shyt never worked to help the intended audience as much and our government never went far to remedy it.

 

[Bleed The Freak]

You got a link to an article about Colorado? I was unaware of that. I wasnt sure a state had the authority to do something like to a private school.

only public

https://www.cnn.com/2021/05/29/us/colorado-bans-legacy-preferences-college-admissions-trnd/index.html

 

[Voice of Reason]

I know sex wasn't in on the decision.

And sex isn't reported in admissions, but it is a correlation that they have benefitted in the workplace in taking on senior positions and they an uptick in women in college.

My only point is this shyt never worked to help the intended audience as much and our government never went far to remedy it.

Yep it didn't help ADOS enough and other demographics came in and benefitted.