GnauzBookOfRhymes
Superstar
Biden asking for another $37,700,000,000 in aid to Ukraine
Russia is
Russia is
Russia's Invasion of Ukraine (Official Thread)
- Thread starter newarkhiphop
- Start date
I'm gonna wait on this one. Too much fukkery from both sides. Both sides have reason to lie about what happened here.
Marlow Stanfield
Superstar
No capitulation.
No surrender.
No negotiations.
All or nothing.
Ukraine's victory march aint stopping for shyt.
fukk Putin and fukk blowing the game-winning fast break with 5 second left on the clock.
Kneel on 3rd and inches, brehs
No surrender.
No negotiations.
All or nothing.
Ukraine's victory march aint stopping for shyt.
fukk Putin and fukk blowing the game-winning fast break with 5 second left on the clock.
Kneel on 3rd and inches, brehs
BK The Great
Veteran
This shyt is too much at this point
health care for all
88m3
Fast Money & Foreign Objects
Russia needs to be stopped. I hope we start giving even more money to Ukraine and start putting more money aside for Covid it's getting rough out here
Marlow Stanfield
Superstar
Get caught slippin by the local street thugs, orc crehs
Spidey Man
Superstar
Russia needs to talk Putin into retiring before NATO takes over the sky and this war escalates
they're just making sure ukraine has enough for 2023 before the new congress is sworn in,
The more money that goes to Ukraine the more it keeps Putin in check… NATO might as well give Ukraine membership…
Mister Terrific
It’s in the name
[/QUOTE]
The only thing I know about this war is a movie I saw on Amazon of them fighting in the mountains, but Wikipedia states India recovered all of its territory
Kargil War - Wikipedia
Regardless, I don’t think it’s a factor of leaders not caring about civilian casualties, I think it’s political suicide for most regimes to allow foreign occupiers into your territory with attempting to take it back and is widely supported by the citizenry. Look at the falklands a seemingly insignificant series of islands yet retain an important symbolic meaning to Argentinian’s and Brits. Or the various island disputes between China, Korea and Japan. Korea holds massive political reactionary rallies over.
Look at these dumbass rocks
Japan and Korea disputed the Dodko Islands for 300 years
If a Korean politician came a long and said he is going to let Japan have these rocks he would be skewered in a day.
Hell, look at Taiwan, does China frame the taking of Taiwan as a geopolitical necessity due to its importance as a open water port or semi-conductor manufacturer? No, it’s about national honor.
Without a major defeat there is no way Zelensky and his government would be able to survive giving up the Donbas and Crimea and the next politician elected to government would very likely be pro returning these lands to Ukraines rightful internationally recognized possession.
The terms of the armistice that ended World War 1 and the treaty of Versailles virtually guaranteed a 2nd conflict.
The demands placed on the German people were harsh enough to create enmity within the population but not harsh enough to prevent future ability to make war. The primary cause of German militarism was the Junker class of the Prussian aristocracy which were never completely enamored with Hitler but were supportive because he enabled their militaristic culture.
The Allies at the end of the war left much of Germany’s social, political and military structure in tact. If you notice most of the high command of the Nazi’s had names like Von Manstein, Von Block, Von Kluge, Von Rundstedt, Von Kleist etc. Von is an aristocratic designation.
There is a reason the 2nd go around the Allies made no mistakes and abolished Prussia as a political entity and abolished the Junker class. This not Hitler was the source of German militarism.
To put it simply the allies did not go far enough in World War 1. A complete occupation and dismantling of German social and political structures largely geared towards making war (Prussia was one of the few states that existed to make war in history outside of maybe Sparta), and purging of the aristocracy would’ve prevented World War 2. Which is exactly what they did in 1945.
Now we can’t go into Russia and so the same, but what Ukraine can do is remove Russia from their territory and purge the Donbas and Crimea of the social and political structures that allowed themselves to be usurped by Russian militarism.
Half measures will only lead to more conflict down the road.
These are all examples of Empires on their way out. The British empire was on its death door and did not have the political, social or military will to administer its colonial possessions. The USA was pressuring Britain, France, Netherlands etc to renounce its colonial possessions and join the American led liberal order. The British had crushed numerous Indian rebellions previously, if Ghandi was born in 1860 he would’ve been dealt with like numerous other Indian, Irish, and African intellectuals. Hell when the US replaced the British in many of these countries assassinations of benign non-violent political leaders like Patrice Lumumba were common.
Similarly the Soviets were already collapsing internally when it’s territories broke away. The Hungarian and Polish workers tried similar non-violent resistance in the 50’s and 60’s and were crushed by tanks. The Tiananmen Square massacre was non-violent student protests that were destroyed with as much violence as possible because China was not a declining political power.
Non-violent resistance only works if the conditions are right for them. Usually an empire that is collapsing already.
Conversely Putin has stated he is outside of the liberal world order and his decisions will be counter to whatever hurts the US and it’s allies views on these things. There is absolutely no indication that Ukrainian territory would be won back by passive resistance as Putin is not acting out of economic necessity but a perceived spiritually and blood duty.
How long shall we allow Ukrainian territory to be Russian hands? 30 years? 50? 100?
Also, if Putin keeps his conquests what examples does that set for the rest of the world? You can just take territories with no long term political repercussions? Nuclear and arms proliferation on a massive scale?
Look, I understand that the things I'm saying are too uncomfortable for most of the people here to read. You've spent your entire life being conditioned by the ruling world governments to accept war and violence as the ultimate solutions. The cartoons you watched, the history you were taught in school, the blockbusters that were put out, the message the news media promote, the positions of the governments in power, they ALL push the violence narrative as the solution. That doesn't mean it's objectively true, any more than racist or imperialist ideologies were objectively true in the 1800s. But it's the only message in play for most people.
Objective reality suggests not only that there are other ways, but that on average those other ways are more effective by every measure:
The '3.5% rule': How a small minority can change the world
Nonviolent protests are twice as likely to succeed as armed conflicts – and those engaging a threshold of 3.5% of the population have never failed to bring about change.www.bbc.com
Why nonviolent resistance beats violent force in effecting social, political change
Harvard Professor Erica Chenoweth discovers nonviolent civil resistance is far more successful in effecting change than violent campaigns.news.harvard.edu
Are peaceful protests more effective than violent ones?
“There’s certainly more evidence that peaceful protests are more successful because they build a wider coalition,” says Gordana Rabrenov.news.northeastern.edu
I think we all understand the sentiment. Ghandi and Martin Luther King Jr are taught in school. I think we don’t find your point of view realistic given what we have heard coming from the Russian side. When fascists start talking about blood and soil you aren’t going to Naruto talk them down.