R.I.P. Chris Kelly of Kriss Kross

[mobbinfms]

the bolded can be said about as well.

and lets not act as if outkast made Atlanta into some sort of hip-hop powerhouse. Atlanta didn't reach that status until a decade later, no thanks to them. they were just the first extra-lyrical rappers to come out of there, and people still don't respect that city in terms of lyricism. lets keep it all the way real.

so so def was a big deal and everybody knew it was Atlanta-based.

and yea, kriss kross repped Atlanta in their intro. they just didn't rep it to the death.



shyheim was the goat child lyricist but that's pretty much where the buck stops.

lets be real. unless youre a fan of dude, you'd be hard-pressed the name the titles of any of his songs. hes not even at the top of his ilk. da youngsters and illegal made more noise in terms of that raw east coast chit.

and in no way is shyheim seeing the hot boys. I mean, its not even a fair comparison seeing that the hot boys were an adult group. I don't know why theyre being brought up in this debate. to this day, millions of people are still under the assumption that BG & turk were grown. the only person stressing their age was wayne. they were compared to groups like TRU & The Lox. they weren't being compared to the magnificent 7 or the lil soldiers.

Yep. I agree that Puff is a great comparison. All Kast did was be the first rappers to move some serious units and rep for ATL. KK and AD very easily could have beat them to the punch, but didn't. This isn't a huge achievement at all. JD was the man from ATL first. Just not a rapper. It's really more of a clarification than anything.

I agree about Shy too. He was B list at best. But I'd rather hear 2nd album Shy spit over any of the hot boys.

 

[mson]

i'm impressed,better than i thought. But i dont think he's seeing the hb's,maybe turk,not the rest

 

[Wacky D]

Yep. I agree that Puff is a great comparison. All Kast did was be the first rappers to move some serious units and rep for ATL. KK and AD very easily could have beat them to the punch, but didn't. This isn't a huge achievement at all. JD was the man from ATL first. Just not a rapper. It's really more of a clarification than anything.

JD didn't have to rap. the point is, the flag was in the ground. that's all that matters when you want to talk about somebody putting a city on the map.

and for the record, so so def was already moving units before outkast, was moving more units than outkast, and most importantly; they had a bigger impact on the culture.

 

[mobbinfms]

JD didn't have to rap. the point is, the flag was in the ground. that's all that matters when you want to talk about somebody putting a city on the map.

and for the record, so so def was already moving units before outkast, was moving more units than outkast, and most importantly; they had a bigger impact on the culture.

you do need to be a rapper to be the first rapper.

Not sure I'd agree with the cultural impact claim, but that's intangible and subjective anyhow.

 

[Wacky D]

you do need to be a rapper to be the first rapper.

Not sure I'd agree with the cultural impact claim, but that's intangible and subjective anyhow.

we're not talking about being the first rapper. we're talking about putting a city on the map.

I don't see how my cultural impact comment is even arguable seeing that outkast had very little cultural impact.

 

[mobbinfms]

we're not talking about being the first rapper. we're talking about putting a city on the map.

I don't see how my cultural impact comment is even arguable seeing that outkast had very little cultural impact.

Aren't we talking about which rapper put ATL on the map? If not, I don't really care.

Andre 3000 was the first to do all the things that these new "weirdo" rappers do. Also, listen to Bombs Over Baghdad. The impact may not have been immediate and it may not have been solely due to Outkast - but they were ahead of their time (Andre at least).

Make the case for So So Def's cultural impact - hip-hop wise of course.

 

[Wacky D]

Aren't we talking about which rapper put ATL on the map? If not, I don't really care.

Andre 3000 was the first to do all the things that these new "weirdo" rappers do. Also, listen to Bombs Over Baghdad. The impact may not have been immediate and it may not have been solely due to Outkast - but they were ahead of their time (Andre at least).

Make the case for So So Def's cultural impact - hip-hop wise of course.

influencing a bunch of industry plants that wouldn't have bothered to pick up a mic in respectable eras is not cultural impact.

so so def's track record speaks for itself. Jermaine dupri is a super-producer. look at all the artists & tracks that either came outta so so def or were affiliated with JD. and look at the impact of said music. comparing outkast's track record is laughable, and that's not a knock on them at all. I understand that Jermaine dupri isn't much of a beloved personality but come on.

 

[mobbinfms]

influencing a bunch of industry plants that wouldn't have bothered to pick up a mic in respectable eras is not cultural impact.

so so def's track record speaks for itself. Jermaine dupri is a super-producer. look at all the artists & tracks that either came outta so so def or were affiliated with JD. and look at the impact of said music. comparing outkast's track record is laughable, and that's not a knock on them at all. I understand that Jermaine dupri isn't much of a beloved personality but come on.

Impact is impact - whether it be positive or negative. LAD had a huge impact on how emcees approached making albums in terms of trying to cater to all audiences and regions. It had a negative impact on the music in the long run of course.

You aren't making a great case for JD. What is the cultural impact of KK, Brat or Bow Wow? I would say minimal. JD was a great producer - but where are the classic albums? Where are the classic singles that aren't considered fluff? I'm sure I'm missing something as I'm thinking back - but what?

Again - this is limited to hip-hop. I don't want to hear about Xscape or Usher.

 

[Wacky D]

Impact is impact - whether it be positive or negative. LAD had a huge impact on how emcees approached making albums in terms of trying to cater to all audiences and regions. It had a negative impact on the music in the long run of course.

You aren't making a great case for JD. What is the cultural impact of KK, Brat or Bow Wow? I would say minimal. JD was a great producer - but where are the classic albums? Where are the classic singles that aren't considered fluff? I'm sure I'm missing something as I'm thinking back - but what?

Again - this is limited to hip-hop. I don't want to hear about Xscape or Usher.

LAD influenced rappers that actually made an impact. outkast mostly influenced plants & rappers that nobody cares about.

having classic albums doesn't necessarily equate to impact. besides, outkast don't even have that. they have 1 classic and barely.

in terms of impact on hip-hop culture, theres somewhat of a marriage between rap and r&b. but if you want to just keep it hip-hop fam, then youre ruining your argument for outkast actually. also, outkast blew up off of an r&b machine.

and if you cant see the cultural impact of kriss kross & da brat, then we don't need to have this discussion. and lets not even get on the fact that so so def played a major role in the rise of Atlanta crunk, the sound that made Atlanta a powerhouse city in hip-hop.(and im not proppin that chit up, but it is what it is).

 

[Wacky D]

damn tmz

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lol. this is why I hate white media's coverage of hip-hop.

theres nothing tragic about this video. chit is no different than any random youtubes freestyle.

the worst part was in the caption when they said he was "rapping about a room full of dead bodies".

 

[mobbinfms]

LAD influenced rappers that actually made an impact. outkast mostly influenced plants & rappers that nobody cares about.

having classic albums doesn't necessarily equate to impact. besides, outkast don't even have that. they have 1 classic and barely.

in terms of impact on hip-hop culture, theres somewhat of a marriage between rap and r&b. but if you want to just keep it hip-hop fam, then youre ruining your argument for outkast actually. also, outkast blew up off of an r&b machine.

and if you cant see the cultural impact of kriss kross & da brat, then we don't need to have this discussion. and lets not even get on the fact that so so def played a major role in the rise of Atlanta crunk, the sound that made Atlanta a powerhouse city in hip-hop.(and im not proppin that chit up, but it is what it is).

So so def has zero classic albums. Do you dispute that?

Outkast has arguably 0-3 classic albums.

I don't see KK having much of an impact on the culture. Same with Brat. I don't see how you could argue Outkast didn't have more of an impact. They've got more classic songs than all of So So Def's hip hop roster combined.

I remember those So So Def Bass Allstars albums. I don't consider that hip hop though. Is that what you're referring to? I know Jon was making moves with Too Short back in the late 90s. Then there was Bia Bia, but I wasn't paying that much attention (although that was a great song).

 

[Wacky D]

So so def has zero classic albums. Do you dispute that?

Outkast has arguably 0-3 classic albums.

I don't see KK having much of an impact on the culture. Same with Brat. I don't see how you could argue Outkast didn't have more of an impact. They've got more classic songs than all of So So Def's hip hop roster combined.

I remember those So So Def Bass Allstars albums. I don't consider that hip hop though. Is that what you're referring to? I know Jon was making moves with Too Short back in the late 90s. Then there was Bia Bia, but I wasn't paying that much attention (although that was a great song).

I wasn't even thinking about lil jon's stint or affiliation with so so def. I was referring to the youngbloodz & bone crusher.

outkast doesn't have 3 arguable classic albums. their debut album is the only certified classic under their belt. only their diehard fans recognize them other chits as classics. and im not even using that as a negative because like I said, droppin a classic album doesn't translate into impacting the culture. I don't know why you repeatedly insist on bringing this up anyway. what don't you understand? lol.

bul on the old board put it better than me, but i'll sum it up: outkast doesn't have any songs, albums, verses, lines, moments, etc that are synonymous with hip-hop or reasonate with the community in general. on the flipside, kriss kross, da brat and even Jermaine dupri when he picked up the mic have checkmarks in a number of those categories. THATS impacting the culture. also, kriss kross & da brat made history in the game. what has outkast done that was historical? and im not getting on them. that's not a bad thing on outkast's part. it just is what it is.

 

[mobbinfms]

I wasn't even thinking about lil jon's stint or affiliation with so so def. I was referring to the youngbloodz & bone crusher.

outkast doesn't have 3 arguable classic albums. their debut album is the only certified classic under their belt. only their diehard fans recognize them other chits as classics. and im not even using that as a negative because like I said, droppin a classic album doesn't translate into impacting the culture. I don't know why you repeatedly insist on bringing this up anyway. what don't you understand? lol.

bul on the old board put it better than me, but i'll sum it up: outkast doesn't have any songs, albums, verses, lines, moments, etc that are synonymous with hip-hop or reasonate with the community in general. on the flipside, kriss kross, da brat and even Jermaine dupri when he picked up the mic have checkmarks in a number of those categories. THATS impacting the culture. also, kriss kross & da brat made history in the game. what has outkast done that was historical? and im not getting on them. that's not a bad thing on outkast's part. it just is what it is.

How could classic albums be irrelevant to a discussion of impact within a musical genre?

Like I said, Outkast has 0-3 classic albums. Notice the zero there. Personally, sometimes I feel like all three are classics, sometimes I feel like none of them truly qualify.

When you say KK and Brat made history, are you referring to sales? Honestly, I think both sold well when they were popping but their work is either forgotten or not held in high regard nowadays.

Numerous Outkast songs are synonymous with hip-hop or resonate with the audience generally.

 

[Wacky D]

How could classic albums be irrelevant to a discussion of impact within a musical genre?

Like I said, Outkast has 0-3 classic albums. Notice the zero there. Personally, sometimes I feel like all three are classics, sometimes I feel like none of them truly qualify.

When you say KK and Brat made history, are you referring to sales? Honestly, I think both sold well when they were popping but their work is either forgotten or not held in high regard nowadays.

Numerous Outkast songs are synonymous with hip-hop or resonate with the audience generally.

youre confusing impact with acclaim.

when I said that KK & da brat made history, im referring to more than just sales. hell, I didn't even touch on the fact that they were huge trendsetters. what trends did outkast ever set?

face it my man. outkast just wasn't an impact group. that's not a negative. they just never had THAT appeal. hell, I rarely ever hear their names mentioned offline. NOT EVEN WHEN I LIVED DOWN SOUTH!!!

@ the bolded. I don't think you understand what im saying. in other words, outkast never made a song or album that stopped time. they never did anything that stopped time. they had some popular singles. some classic singles. but not popular or classic enough.

as for the classic thing, yea I noticed the 0 there and I knew exactly what you meant. and when you think about it, you'll see that it all goes back to their lack of impact.

but yea, SPCM is generally recognized as a classic. kind of a low-level classic but it gets enough recognition to pass the bar and be referred to as such. but those other 2 joints really aren't even in the picture.

 

[Prodigital]

lol. this is why I hate white media's coverage of hip-hop.

theres nothing tragic about this video. chit is no different than any random youtubes freestyle.

the worst part was in the caption when they said he was "rapping about a room full of dead bodies".

TMZ never gives a fukk about context, still had me

His camera man was obviously on some shyt tho