seemorecizzy
Superstar
or we could just get some good players to play with him
u know, what phil is being paid 15 million a year to do
Put Some Hornacek On Our Game: 2016 New York Knicks Offseason Thread
- Thread starter Typical Knicks Fan
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u know, what phil is being paid 15 million a year to do
Kang Deezy
Overall Nice Guy
This shyt is hilarious, you guys are an embarrassment to knowledgeable NBA fans
I'm not even sure I'd trade crowder straight up for melo, no joke... Crowder is a leader, a man, plays all world defense and fits within the offense... Plus he's on a bargain contract.
Danny Ainge has been pretty vocal that if he moves the Brooklyn pick, it won't be for a player in his 30s... Look it up, look up his interviews from the last two weeks on toucher and rich, or dale and Holley... Both are on podcasts under iTunes.
Carmelo Anthony has an awful contract and hasn't proven to be able to play 60 games in a season in at least two years, never mind, you know, actually get a team to the playoffs... He's an overweight chucking ball hog with bad knees, yet you think a team is going to throw a godfather offer at yall
It's best for the Knicks long term future to get his contract off the books, get any kind of youth and or draft picks back and go from there
How can we do that without draft picks (since we already know free agents worth a damn have no interest in New York because they're cowards.)
seemorecizzy
Superstar
we dont want to get into another situation where no one wants to make the "stat" leap and come to our squad
you see when we got stat, melo chandler kidd etc eventually followed
before that, Wasnt NO ONe coming here
talent attracks talent
no ones coming here to play with just porzingis no matter how much potential he has shown
our best bet is to keep melo, keep zingis, and try to get other solid players to join them
phil should be aggressively trying to make trades every minute of his job
and he should get rid of the arrogrance he had in free agency that may have cost us a star
zingis isn't going no where, atleast see whether melo/phil can atract some talent within the next 2 years
if it doesnt work, then we go for the full zingis re build
but right now? for what
we have a star whos having one of his better seasons, and is popular amongst his peers. he's just asking for help.
phil so caught up in doing things his way and not wanting ppl thinking melo has any influence on any of his moves, that hes not even utilizing it
the one year he had actual help, yall saw what happened
Lol ok Boston fan, we'll just be ok with giving him away.
Nah breh, sorry but you're definitely wrong here. The best teams in the league were built primarily through the draft, you build your foundation via the draft and bolster your roster with free agency. Just look at the playoff teams right now and the majority of their core players were either drafted by them, traded on draft night, or had their rights traded -
Utah - Gobert, Hayward, Hood, Burks (Favors traded to them his rookie year)
Memphis - Conely & Gasol (Marc's rights were traded to the Grizz)
Portland - McCollum, Leonard, & Lillard
Dallas - Dirk
LAC - Blake & Jordan
OKC - Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka
SAS - Duncan, Parker, Kawhi, Manu
GS - Curry, Thompson, Barnes, Green
CLE - Kyrie, Thompson & Bron (
) TO - Val & Demar
BOS - Sullinger, Bradley
ATL - Horford, Teague, Black Hitler
MIA- Wade
INDY - George, Turner
CHI - Butler, Rose, Noah, Gibson, Mirotic
CHA - Kemba, MKG, Zeller, Frank
There are some exceptions but the absolute best teams in the league were built via the draft, of course there are misses, but to say people are overvaluing picks isn't right. Outside of superstars they are the most valuable assets in the league because of the rookie contracts, the Celtics are going to have around $50 million in caproom because all those young dudes on their team are on rookie deals, in addition to having the Nets picks.
Your point about wanting Nerlens doesn't make sense, before he was a "Sure thing" the Sixers traded an all-star for him on draft night even though he had a torn ACL. You don't need to have the top pick to build a foundation, especially since Knicks already have their key piece which would be Kristaps, a lot of the guys I named weren't even top picks, hell the Warriors were built with picks 7 (Barnes & Curry), 11 (Thompson), 35 (Green). Also, you say you don't want to get caught in the same cycle as the Sixers, yet the last time they were in the playoffs was 4 years ago, the last time the Knicks made the playoffs was 3 years ago, you're already stuck in the same cycle as them but without the prospect of a draft pick
The Knicks are caught in no mans land right now, this is the worst position to be in, not having a draft pick in a year where you're not going to make the playoffs, all while having an aging star player.
Kang Deezy
Overall Nice Guy
Not giving him away
Just telling you that if the Celtics are involved in any kind of deal with Melo going anywhere, the Brooklyn pick won't be included
Will there be draft picks involved? Absolutely. But in my opinion neither Love nor Melo are worth any of the Brooklyn picks, 2016 especially.
The way the league is going with the cap, draft picks are so valuable because they are cheap contracts with options. Plus it's easy to keep players you draft because of the years and the money...
So is 2 or 3 years of Melo with bad knees making 25 million a year worth more than 10 years of a top 3 pick at 4 million a year, plus all the extra cap space?
NYK- Porzingis, GrantNah breh, sorry but you're definitely wrong here. The best teams in the league were built primarily through the draft, you build your foundation via the draft and bolster your roster with free agency. Just look at the playoff teams right now and the majority of their core players were either drafted by them, traded on draft night, or had their rights traded -
Utah - Gobert, Hayward, Hood, Burks (Favors traded to them his rookie year)
Memphis - Conely & Gasol (Marc's rights were traded to the Grizz)
Portland - McCollum, Leonard, & Lillard
Dallas - Dirk
LAC - Blake & Jordan
OKC - Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka
SAS - Duncan, Parker, Kawhi, Manu
GS - Curry, Thompson, Barnes, Green
CLE - Kyrie, Thompson & Bron (
TO - Val & Demar
BOS - Sullinger, Bradley
ATL - Horford, Teague, Black Hitler
MIA- Wade
INDY - George, Turner
CHI - Butler, Rose, Noah, Gibson, Mirotic
CHA - Kemba, MKG, Zeller, Frank
There are some exceptions but the absolute best teams in the league were built via the draft, of course there are misses, but to say people are overvaluing picks isn't right. Outside of superstars they are the most valuable assets in the league because of the rookie contracts, the Celtics are going to have around $50 million in caproom because all those young dudes on their team are on rookie deals, in addition to having the Nets picks.
Your point about wanting Nerlens doesn't make sense, before he was a "Sure thing" the Sixers traded an all-star for him on draft night even though he had a torn ACL. You don't need to have the top pick to build a foundation, especially since Knicks already have their key piece which would be Kristaps, a lot of the guys I named weren't even top picks, hell the Warriors were built with picks 7 (Barnes & Curry), 11 (Thompson), 35 (Green). Also, you say you don't want to get caught in the same cycle as the Sixers, yet the last time they were in the playoffs was 4 years ago, the last time the Knicks made the playoffs was 3 years ago, you're already stuck in the same cycle as them but without the prospect of a draft pick
The Knicks are caught in no mans land right now, this is the worst position to be in, not having a draft pick in a year where you're not going to make the playoffs, all while having an aging star player.
Dog, that's all fine. I asked him what he would be personally ok with. We're both on record stating that we'd rather keep Melo. I disagree that trading Melo for a few mid rounders and Mosgov is good for our future. I'd rather keep Melo and help KP transition from Robin to Batman.
Porzingis doesn't need Melo. I hate that people have built that narrative since he got drafted.
He straight up got booed on Draft Night and he was like...Alright I will show you all
qnsfinest
Superstar
I've been debating over this all day. As much as it hurts me to say this, because Melo has been my favorite player since he was drafted. But if we can get BK's first round pick, a few other future picks and a good player like Bradley or Crowder. I think thats a steal for us.
Obviously we can get two huge scenario's from this that will shape the next 10yrs of this future if we make this trade.
Scenario 1- We get the 1st of 2nd pick and we select Simmons. Now we potentially have 2 young franchise players on our team for the next 10+yrs. We will have enough cap space (I think) to possibly offer 2 max contracts. Not saying we will get Durant or Westbrook, but we can have a shot at either one. We will also have a great shot at Whiteside, Batum and Conley if we strike out with durant and westbrook. and a team of whiteside, KP, simmons, Batum and conley sure sounds good in the East against a declining Cavs and Bulls.
Scenario 2- The BK pick ends up being outside of the top 3 and we strike out picking up a big potential franchise player like Ingram, dunn or Simmons. We strike out again with big free agents and don't get Westbrook or Durant. We only end up with 1 good free agent like Batum and we're practically a bottom seed in the playoffs unless KP turns out to be Dirk within 4yrs.
But all in all, I think the Knicks have to make this move. And it has to include BK's first pick and a player and future picks. I love Melo, but he clearly is on the decline and he probably has 2-3 elite yrs left. With a top 3 pick, we can set out franchise up with 10+yrs and cap space.
Obviously we can get two huge scenario's from this that will shape the next 10yrs of this future if we make this trade.
Scenario 1- We get the 1st of 2nd pick and we select Simmons. Now we potentially have 2 young franchise players on our team for the next 10+yrs. We will have enough cap space (I think) to possibly offer 2 max contracts. Not saying we will get Durant or Westbrook, but we can have a shot at either one. We will also have a great shot at Whiteside, Batum and Conley if we strike out with durant and westbrook. and a team of whiteside, KP, simmons, Batum and conley sure sounds good in the East against a declining Cavs and Bulls.
Scenario 2- The BK pick ends up being outside of the top 3 and we strike out picking up a big potential franchise player like Ingram, dunn or Simmons. We strike out again with big free agents and don't get Westbrook or Durant. We only end up with 1 good free agent like Batum and we're practically a bottom seed in the playoffs unless KP turns out to be Dirk within 4yrs.
But all in all, I think the Knicks have to make this move. And it has to include BK's first pick and a player and future picks. I love Melo, but he clearly is on the decline and he probably has 2-3 elite yrs left. With a top 3 pick, we can set out franchise up with 10+yrs and cap space.
NYK- Porzingis, Grant
You also drafted Guillermo Hernangomez who people are pretty high on, he was a draft and stash, could come next year or the year after. It's a great start, people think you need to draft a superstar for it to be a good pick, Grant was a solid pick and has good potential.
Like in this years draft, Denzel Valentine will probably be a very good rotational player. Not every pick needs to be a homerun, just get on base, you already hit a grandslam with Kristaps.
Porzingis doesn't need Melo. I hate that people have built that narrative since he got drafted.
He straight up got booed on Draft Night and he was like...Alright I will show you all
He doesn't need Melo, but Melo makes his life a lot easier and speeds the process up. For the first half of the kids career, Melo was the only one with the forsight to seek KP out. Imagine all the look aways we'd have to endure while force feeding Afflalo, our only viable offensive weapon.
NYK- Porzingis, Grant
Even though he was undrafted, Galloway deserves to be ahead of Grant at this point. As a fifth year senior and the 19th overall pick, Jerian looks like a D League player right now :hface:
Not gonna give up on Grant though.
