OFFICIAL Game of Holmes Season 8 Thread - A Dream of Flat Tops 4/14/19
- Thread starter Jax
- Start date
Even then it was to subdue the enemy and get them to surrender. In this case the Lannister armies had already surrendered.
Go back and watch episode 4. When going over the battle they literally say they lost 80 percent of the dothraki or something like that. There is a few left.After episode 3 the writers said the Dothraki were wiped out as people.
Last thing I'm going to say on the Dany thing, feel like we are going in circles with it:
The Mad Queen descent was rushed, but I've seen a lot of people here make fun of the bells and at Daenerys' mind breaking at the point of surrender but imo it made sense and was set up earlier in the episode.
Seasons 1 to 7 showed up a Daenerys that rose from the very lowest of lows to the height of power. In Season 1 and 2, we see Daenerys realize that without power, no one will respect her or take her claim seriously. She’s told repeatedly that she’s nothing without an army, and she’s nothing without ships. She gained those. We cheered for her.
When Daenerys leaves Essos, she thinks she can rule through compassion and be loved by the people once she gets rid of Cersei. She had her armies. She had dragons. She had powerful allies in Westeros. She had the strongest claim to the throne and finally had the chance to take King’s Landing.
Season 7 and Season 8 was about losing that power. First, her powerful allies are stripped away one by one. Olenna, Elliria, Yara. Tyrion mismanages them as Hand of the Queen and makes horrible tactical mistakes.
In S08E01, Daenerys realizes she doesn’t have the love of the people. In Essos, she broke their chains and earned their devotion and became their Mysha. She freed them from their oppressive masters and they were grateful to her and made her their queen. In the North, Sansa and Jon had already broken their chains. They defeated Ramsay. Sansa and Jon, as Starks, have earned their loyalty for a lifetime. Daenerys is faced with a smallfolk — her subjects — that don’t love her. It’s a harsh realization for her.
In S08E02, she loses her claim. Jon tells her his true identity, and suddenly she’s not the only Targaryen in the world. Even moreso, Jon’s claim is stronger. He’s a natural leader. She’s immediately threatened by his confession, and is shaken by it.
In S08E03, she loses Jorah. He was there for her since the beginning. He was devoted to her not because of her power, not because of her dragons, but because he loved her. He never would’ve betrayed her and she trusted him fully. He’s essentially been her rock through all her hardship. And then he dies protecting her.
In S08E04, she loses her second child, and Missandei. One by one, everyone she held close that was devoted to her and her alone was taken from her. Her dragons were a symbol of her power; with only one left, she was beginning to get desperate. Her only advisor from Essos was Grey Worm, and he was a soldier.
In S08E05, she loses Varys, Tyrion, and Jon. Through betrayal, no less. Jon betrays her by telling Sansa, and Sansa tells Tyrion, who tells Varys. Varys openly conspires against her and (presumably) tries to poison her and turn Jon against her. She kills him without a trial, without asking for his last words, and without a second thought. At that point, she’s on the brink.
And Jon goes to her, and she seeks one last bit of comfort from him. She tells him that people love him, and that’s something she’ll never have.
”Far more people in Westeros love you than love me. I don’t have love here. I only have fear.”
He counters by saying that he loves her, and that she’ll always be his queen. But when they kiss, Daenerys realizes that he’ll never truly love her again. And so, she says: "Alright then. Let it be fear"
When the bells ring, Daenerys realizes that while the city has surrendered she’ll never be secure as queen as long as the people don’t truly, irrevocably fear her. She will never be loved by them. She has lost everything she has gained and every friend she’s made, and she’s completely alone. King’s Landing becomes a symbol of everything she’s ever been through — her brother selling her like a brood mare, Drogo's death, being ridiculed and laughed at from Pentos to Slaver's Bay to Mereen, being threatened at every turn, losing her dragons, losing her loved ones. She’s on her dragon, she’s alone, she feels powerless, and she’s angry.
So what does she do when feels powerless? She reminds them all that she is still powerful. The people will never love her, so they will fear her.
Killing all those civilians shows that she's had a trait of vindictiveness early on in her life, going back seasons in the story.
Those quotes I posted above show that she's dreamed of violent revenge, burning cities to the ground.
Violent vindictiveness has always been a part of her character that she had to control (or have others help her control).
Also... as people keep forgetting... She has a predisposition to psychosis, it's been repeatedly said in the show that madness runs in the Targaryen bloodline.
The Mad King didn't start off genocidal... His extremely violent nature grew over time.
Here is a brief reminder of the Mad King's story...
"Although his rule began benevolently, he succumbed to the madness caused by his incestuous lineage, and was eventually deposed by Lord Robert Baratheon in a civil war. "
I think a lot of people have forgotten (or didn't notice) the foreshadowing in previous Seasons. Even GRRM was building this same Arc in his books.
She's narcissistic, has a streak of vindictiveness, has a bad temper, and her bloodline is predisposed to mental illness.
All that has been shown since Season 1.
After experience massive trauma in a short space of time (2 Dragons killed, 2 of her best friends killed, her lover breaking up with her, being betrayed by Varys).... Her worst tendencies came to the surface... Which is a very believable psychological context for her worst traits to come to the surface.... Grief, Rage, and Paranoia.
Her grief was IMO the catalyst for her violent psychosis.
A bunch of us predicted that she was going to become psychotic and commit genocide (Mad Queen), based on everything we had seen of her since Season 1.
The Mad Queen descent was rushed, but I've seen a lot of people here make fun of the bells and at Daenerys' mind breaking at the point of surrender but imo it made sense and was set up earlier in the episode.
Seasons 1 to 7 showed up a Daenerys that rose from the very lowest of lows to the height of power. In Season 1 and 2, we see Daenerys realize that without power, no one will respect her or take her claim seriously. She’s told repeatedly that she’s nothing without an army, and she’s nothing without ships. She gained those. We cheered for her.
When Daenerys leaves Essos, she thinks she can rule through compassion and be loved by the people once she gets rid of Cersei. She had her armies. She had dragons. She had powerful allies in Westeros. She had the strongest claim to the throne and finally had the chance to take King’s Landing.
Season 7 and Season 8 was about losing that power. First, her powerful allies are stripped away one by one. Olenna, Elliria, Yara. Tyrion mismanages them as Hand of the Queen and makes horrible tactical mistakes.
In S08E01, Daenerys realizes she doesn’t have the love of the people. In Essos, she broke their chains and earned their devotion and became their Mysha. She freed them from their oppressive masters and they were grateful to her and made her their queen. In the North, Sansa and Jon had already broken their chains. They defeated Ramsay. Sansa and Jon, as Starks, have earned their loyalty for a lifetime. Daenerys is faced with a smallfolk — her subjects — that don’t love her. It’s a harsh realization for her.
In S08E02, she loses her claim. Jon tells her his true identity, and suddenly she’s not the only Targaryen in the world. Even moreso, Jon’s claim is stronger. He’s a natural leader. She’s immediately threatened by his confession, and is shaken by it.
In S08E03, she loses Jorah. He was there for her since the beginning. He was devoted to her not because of her power, not because of her dragons, but because he loved her. He never would’ve betrayed her and she trusted him fully. He’s essentially been her rock through all her hardship. And then he dies protecting her.
In S08E04, she loses her second child, and Missandei. One by one, everyone she held close that was devoted to her and her alone was taken from her. Her dragons were a symbol of her power; with only one left, she was beginning to get desperate. Her only advisor from Essos was Grey Worm, and he was a soldier.
In S08E05, she loses Varys, Tyrion, and Jon. Through betrayal, no less. Jon betrays her by telling Sansa, and Sansa tells Tyrion, who tells Varys. Varys openly conspires against her and (presumably) tries to poison her and turn Jon against her. She kills him without a trial, without asking for his last words, and without a second thought. At that point, she’s on the brink.
And Jon goes to her, and she seeks one last bit of comfort from him. She tells him that people love him, and that’s something she’ll never have.
”Far more people in Westeros love you than love me. I don’t have love here. I only have fear.”
He counters by saying that he loves her, and that she’ll always be his queen. But when they kiss, Daenerys realizes that he’ll never truly love her again. And so, she says: "Alright then. Let it be fear"
When the bells ring, Daenerys realizes that while the city has surrendered she’ll never be secure as queen as long as the people don’t truly, irrevocably fear her. She will never be loved by them. She has lost everything she has gained and every friend she’s made, and she’s completely alone. King’s Landing becomes a symbol of everything she’s ever been through — her brother selling her like a brood mare, Drogo's death, being ridiculed and laughed at from Pentos to Slaver's Bay to Mereen, being threatened at every turn, losing her dragons, losing her loved ones. She’s on her dragon, she’s alone, she feels powerless, and she’s angry.
So what does she do when feels powerless? She reminds them all that she is still powerful. The people will never love her, so they will fear her.
Killing all those civilians shows that she's had a trait of vindictiveness early on in her life, going back seasons in the story.
Those quotes I posted above show that she's dreamed of violent revenge, burning cities to the ground.
Violent vindictiveness has always been a part of her character that she had to control (or have others help her control).
Also... as people keep forgetting... She has a predisposition to psychosis, it's been repeatedly said in the show that madness runs in the Targaryen bloodline.
The Mad King didn't start off genocidal... His extremely violent nature grew over time.
Here is a brief reminder of the Mad King's story...
"Although his rule began benevolently, he succumbed to the madness caused by his incestuous lineage, and was eventually deposed by Lord Robert Baratheon in a civil war. "
I think a lot of people have forgotten (or didn't notice) the foreshadowing in previous Seasons. Even GRRM was building this same Arc in his books.
She's narcissistic, has a streak of vindictiveness, has a bad temper, and her bloodline is predisposed to mental illness.
All that has been shown since Season 1.
After experience massive trauma in a short space of time (2 Dragons killed, 2 of her best friends killed, her lover breaking up with her, being betrayed by Varys).... Her worst tendencies came to the surface... Which is a very believable psychological context for her worst traits to come to the surface.... Grief, Rage, and Paranoia.
Her grief was IMO the catalyst for her violent psychosis.
A bunch of us predicted that she was going to become psychotic and commit genocide (Mad Queen), based on everything we had seen of her since Season 1.
Jhoon
Spontaneous Mishaps and Hijinks
No they didn’t.
What? They dropped their swords. The only thing we don’t know is who rang the bells
BlaqkSpliffin
Ni**as Still Weird - Me
1)You can believe what you want. If you gonna believe his words about the ending of the story, I'm gonna believe his words about having a hard time finishing this next book.
2)GRRM has had issues with how D&D hava handled his source material. They have no input on the prequels and he'll be more hands on because those stories are mostly done.
3)I don't believe this but if it does happen hopefully it will make alot more sense and they'll give an actual reason. Jon ain't gonna reject her in the books and the dragons won't die in the books because in his own words fully grown dragons cannot be killed like they portrayed in the show. So their gonna need a different motivation that doesn't undermine her whole character and that doesn't revolves around the Targaryen narrative that isn't even factual. I'm no Dany fan and actually didn't even care that much for her story until I saw how stupid they made her and every other character for fukking plot points. I'm a Jon fan and even tho he's annoying the hell outta me I can say he's acting completely in character. I can't say that for Dany.
I AM WARHOL
Veteran
I'm not a Dany stan but I genuinely feel bad for Emilia Clarke and the character of Daenerys. Straight up turned her evil. One of the few episodes of TV I've watched that left me feeling bad for an actor
BlaqkSpliffin
Ni**as Still Weird - Me
The cinematography in this episode was next level and visually stunning from beginning to end. Almost made me overlook the writing cause shyt was dope.By the way, the buildup to the burning, including Varys execution... beautifully done
Jhoon
Spontaneous Mishaps and Hijinks
Do you remember what Marlo said to Prop Joe?
Qyburn:Your grace, we gotta bounce
Cersei:Nah, we got this. I have scorpions!
Qyburn:Fire crotch took them all down
Cersei:well, the gold company got it. 20k deep, fool.
Qyburn:They got blasted, too
Cersei:fukk them. My BD Already took one down. He already said the first one was just a real big lizard. We good. Blackwater bay good.
Qyburn:Them gone, too.
Cersei:gone, you say? Welp, at least the red keep gonna keep us safe. Ain’t never fell. Ain’t falling today.
Qyburn:unsullied just breached the red keep you dumb bytch.
Cersei:halp.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA THAT bytch GOT CRUSHED BY SOME ROCKS!!!!
whe that was going on all i could think of is like saddam hussein
I AM WARHOL
Veteran
But they gave up tho so it's not applicable. She wasnt taking anything from anyone at that point. She already won decidedly. That was genocide
Jhoon
Spontaneous Mishaps and Hijinks
Genocide? You guys are using the wrong words.
The Fukin Prophecy
RIP Champ
Perfect image that summarizes 8 seasons of this show...
KevCo
Bond's gun spoke once....
Whos editing these? Rian Johnson?
Another Big 'Game Of Thrones' Mistake Accidentally Gave Jaime Lannister His Hand Back
Another Big 'Game Of Thrones' Mistake Accidentally Gave Jaime Lannister His Hand Back