Official Fiscal Cliff Discussion

daze23

daze23

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88m3 said:
A 401k is throwing feces on a wall and hoping a tree grows
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they always sell it to you like it's "tax free", but you'll have to pay taxes on that money when you finally get it. the hope is you'll be in a lower income bracket (because you're 'retired'), but who knows how that will really work out
 
Mr. Somebody

Mr. Somebody

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daze23 said:
they always sell it to you like it's "tax free", but you'll have to pay taxes on that money when you finally get it. the hope is you'll be in a lower income bracket (because you're 'retired'), but who knows how that will really work out
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Who knows if it wont crash before its time to get it. We lost a lot of money after 911. Mutual funds went to poo. I didnt like that but what are you gonna do. God giveth and god taketh away.
 
daze23

daze23

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Mr. Somebody said:
Who knows if it wont crash before its time to get it. We lost a lot of money after 911. Mutual funds went to poo. I didnt like that but what are you gonna do. God giveth and god taketh away.
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that's how I feel. who knows what income brackets will look like in 30-40 years. we might be communists by then, comrade
 
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While I was up and near my laptop I figured that I'd try to consolidate all this discussion into one place, especially because the deadline is upon us. President Obama is also doing Meet the Press tomorrow with that closest Republican dikk Gregory, who is terrible at his job. So tune in. But just to breakdown where we're at:

Congressional leaders scrambling for a deal on 'fiscal cliff' | Nation | News from Fort ...

BY WILLIAM DOUGLAS AND ANITA KUMAR
McClatchy Newspapers

WASHINGTON -- Senate leaders worked feverishly behind closed doors Saturday to avert the most painful parts of a looming fiscal crisis, debating which taxpayers could or should pay more as part of a deal that would ward off tax increases for everyone.

Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., and Minority Leader Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., were racing to forge a deal in time for votes tonight by the Senate and the House. Their aides met privately in a nearly deserted Capitol.

Lawmakers expected to be briefed by this afternoon, though some doubted that a compromise can be reached. Most lawmakers were absent Saturday, awaiting word from their leaders.

Without an agreement by Monday evening, Bush-era tax cuts would expire for all taxpayers, President Barack Obama's cut in the payroll tax for Social Security would expire, jobless benefits would dry up for 2 million unemployed, the alternative minimum tax would hit more taxpayers, Medicare payments to doctors would be cut, and $109 billion in federal government spending cuts would start, the first installment toward $1.2 trillion.

At the center of the private talks Saturday was the question of which Bush-era tax cuts to extend. Democrats were pushing to extend only those on individual income below $200,000 and family income below $250,000, which would mean a tax increase for all income above that.

Republicans had been pushing to extend all the tax cuts, but people close to the talks said they would be open to taxing top wage earners, perhaps those making $400,000 or above -- as Obama had offered as part of an earlier compromise attempt.

Negotiators were discussing four other issues as part of a possible scaled-back package -- unemployment benefits, the alternative minimum tax, Medicare payments to doctors and the extension of tax breaks offered to companies and individuals, according to a congressional aide familiar with the talks but not authorized to speak publicly.

But some painful measures are increasingly likely to take effect, at least temporarily.

No one was known to be pushing to extend the cut in the payroll tax, enacted as a temporary measure designed to stimulate the economy by putting more cash in people's pockets. If the cut expires Monday night, every taxpayer would see his paycheck shrink as that tax goes back to 6.2 percent from 4.2 percent.

And a final deal was not expected to include an increase in the debt limit, which will be reached Monday, or changes to Social Security or Medicare. At one point, Democrats and Republicans had agreed to apply a less generous measure of inflation to the government programs to lower cost-of-living adjustments.

The two sides had yet to agree on another politically sensitive issue: how to tax inherited estates.

Republicans -- and many Senate Democrats from states with large family farms -- want to maintain the current tax structure, which exempts estates worth up to $5 million and taxes those above that at 35 percent. Obama has proposed a $3.5 million exemption and a tax rate of 45 percent, a proposal that is far more acceptable to liberals.

There was also no agreement on how to handle roughly $100 billion in automatic spending cuts scheduled to affect the Pentagon and other federal departments in the fiscal year that ends in September.

House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio, has insisted that House Republicans will refuse to delay or cancel the cuts, known as "sequestration," without fresh spending cuts to replace them.

Democrats find that proposition hard to accept.

Many Republicans are alarmed by the prospect of deep military cuts, which outgoing Defense Secretary Leon Panetta has said would devastate national security. Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., said Friday that many Republicans would find it difficult to support a "fiscal cliff" package that let the cuts take effect.

"I don't see how you could do a deal without sequestration being part of it," McCain said. "Too many of us care too much about it."

Congress will convene for a rare Sunday afternoon session, with the Senate opening at 1 p.m. and the House at 2 p.m. Votes could come as soon as today but most likely would be pushed to Monday as talks continue.

Both parties will meet behind closed doors this afternoon.

If no agreement is reached, Obama reminded Republicans, he will call for a vote on a proposal that would block the tax hike on income below $250,000 and would extend unemployment insurance for 2 million out-of-work people, which expired Saturday.

Obama's threat capitalizes on a key advantage in the tax-and-spend battle. Republicans who oppose his bare-bones bill would be in the awkward position of protecting the wealthiest at the expense of the middle class.

"I believe such a proposal could pass both houses with bipartisan majorities -- as long as these leaders allow it to come to a vote," Obama said.

"If they still want to vote 'no' and let this tax hike hit the middle class, that's their prerogative -- but they should let everyone vote. That's the way this is supposed to work."

Republicans face the prospect of voting for a tax increase for the first time in two decades, a potential milestone that has deeply divided the party. Still, they suggested Saturday that they could stomach raising income tax rates at a higher threshold than what Obama has proposed -- $500,000 might be acceptable, according to a source who asked to remain anonymous to discuss internal negotiations.

Reid said he would schedule an up-or-down vote Monday, absent another deal.

As the talks commenced, Obama and the Republicans went to the airwaves to state their public positions once more.

"It's a balanced plan -- one that would protect the middle class, cut spending in a responsible way, and ask the wealthiest Americans to pay a little more," Obama said in his weekly radio address.

"And I'll keep working with anybody who's serious about getting a comprehensive plan like this done -- because it's the right thing to do for our economic growth."

Republicans, in their rebuttal, said they agree with Obama about sparing millions of Americans from hardship.

They just disagree with some of the ways to do it.

"The president's proposal to raise taxes on the top 2 percent of Americans won't even pay one-third of the annual interest that's now owed on this massive $16 trillion debt," said Sen. Roy Blunt, R-Mo.
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Happy New Year's fellas, I don't know if I'll be on again before then. :yeah:

It's been an eventful 6 months. :salute: Hopefully I'll find the time to post up threads a bit more next year.





































If I come back and see that any of you were posting in HL at midnight on new year's instead of getting drunk, you're banned :ufdup:
 
Piff Perkins

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Chill nikkas. The only taxes you'll see go up are your payroll taxes, because the payroll tax cut likely won't be extended (no one is talking about it). The Bush shyt...no one is paying income taxes in January, the IRS/government will hold back for the first few weeks.
 
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