Nas - Magic 2 (Discussion thread)

A

Alvin

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DontEemTry said:
Hitboy + Nas is cool but they don't have one classic together if we keepin it a buck.

shyt sounds surface level. Nas + Remi had a lot of misses but their dope shyt is over the top dope. Same with Preme, Hav etc. There's some grit missing with Hitboys sound.
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Magic is perfect though.
 
Ziggiy

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FunkDoc1112 said:
I'll admit I was wrong about the setlist and was going off memory but the rest of this rambling is you being unable to discern the fact that every post I'm making is an opinion. I called Hit-Boy a B+ producer - I didn't see he was a B-list producer, that was just my flippant way of saying he's pretty good but there are better guys but you seem unable to comprehend that. Your "facts" of sales are already shaky because Nas isn't selling much better than those guys to begin with and has the benefit of being a legacy artist, and then your other facts are metacritic score... a collection of OPINIONS. Not only a collection of opinions, but opinions you guys were quick to throw in the bushes when they were lukewarm on the first two KD's so weight do they really have in this argument?

And if you want me to prove i was there, here ya go. I don't like posting my picture on here because I look like a Tubi-casted Lloyd Banks but whatever:




Regardless of how much of the setlist was classics, they were what he closed the show with and got the most response from fans.
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You called Hit Boy a B-Tier producer in RESPONSE to what I said to another poster. Which means you clearly wanted to debate. If your going to debate OPINION vs OPINION then at some point facts are going to be brought up in benefit OF that opinion. If you wanted to simply state your opinion and leave it at that you wouldn’t have quoted me. Again, I saw your initial post, thought it was dumb as fukk, and scrolled past it.

FunkDoc1112 said:
TO ME, I enjoy the KD albums but they're not hitting me on the level where I don't think other producers would do a better job, I threw out Alc as an example and here comes Ziggiy pulling out some white savior BS straight from his ass. That's it. Plain and simple.
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No nikka, YOU quoted ME, which means you wanted some smoke. Problem is your opinion has ZERO basis in any facts other than that your clearly another stuck in the 90’s nikka.

And time and time again throughout these posts you’ve been WRONG. You say its “Shaky ground” to use sales because he isn’t selling “that much” more than than any Alchemist produced album and yet he IS. To the tune of 10-35k more than ANY Alchemist project. And again your initial thesis is that Alchemist is better than Hit Boy and would make a better album with Nas if they locked in. You also said that Nas fans shouldn’t use “The Lost Tapes like the big joker in any argument in Hit Boy’s favor”.

Ok fine, so I kept the Lost Tapes 2 and the fact that its been TWENTY ONE YEARS since Nas utilized Alchemist production out of the argument. I used sales as, not an indication of quality against Alchemist but as an indication of quality FOR Hit Boy amongst not only Nas fanbase, but the wider hip hop purchasing populace. Hit Boy’s obviously helped invigorate Nas, and his suggestions also helped Nas get attention he might NOT have amongst the younger listeners. It was Hit Boy’s idea for a Firm reunion, which obviously made core fans happy, but it was ALSO Hit Boy’s idea for Nas to work with Dirk and work with Asap Ferg and Fivio. This opened Nas up to a wider and potentially younger fanbase. And guess what? It WORKED. Kings Disease charted higher than Lost Tapes 2 before it, and Spicy charted as a single. If Nas had worked with Alchemist would he have made the same suggestions? Or would he have Nas rapping alongside Boldy James, Roc Marciano, and Gibbs? Would that have translated into better music? We don’t know, but we DO know is that, as an independent artist, Nas was able to chart higher with KD1 than he was with even some of his major label albums back in his prime. So again, when countering OPINIONS, Nas and Hit Boy is a winning combination financially. Winning the Grammy IS NOT the end and be all, however both Freddie and Alchemist stated they wanted to win. So it meant something to THEM

Alchemist in his own words

“I can’t front, at first it was like, “Wow, that’s crazy.” But then when we got closer, I was really hoping we were going to win, just because I felt like it would’ve been a win for everybody. For Boldy, for Roc, for Evidence, for Action, for all of us who’ve been putting in. You know what I mean? It would’ve been everyone’s W, because I think it represented that you could do something, do your best, and still be recognized on that level.

obviously I’d be fronting sitting here like I don’t care if I was to get a Grammy. It would’ve been amazing. You know your price goes up, everything goes up. It would’ve been a nice win, man. But losing to Nas ain’t a bad thing either.”

www.theringer.com

How Alchemist and Boldy James Found the Cheat Code on Their New Album, ‘Bo Jackson’

www.theringer.com www.theringer.com

So Nas sold more. Nas won The Grammy that Alchemist JUST ADMITTED he coveted. What POSSIBLE reason would your OPINION outweigh the success of Hit Boy’s production and suggestions brought to Nas?

Bu bu but…Sales don’t mean EVERYTHING right? Hell it could be argued they mean NOTHING. Even though it IS called the “Music Business” for a REASON. Ok, but we can’t quantify musical greatness with Sales all the time because there are hundreds, if not thousands of albums that have gone under-appreciated and unnoticed only to later on be dubbed classics. “Reasonable Doubt classic should’ve went triple”. I get it. And I agree, so moving ON


I cited critical acclaim. Surely if Alchemist was just THAT untouchable of a producer and Freddie Gibbs, Boldy James, Armand Hammer, etc benefit creatively and sonically from his beats there MUST be an ample amount of acclaim to support this. You wanted to debate your OPINION regarding this correct? But again, as 99% of your posts, there’s ZERO evidence to support this. Not only that, you JUST typed that the metacritic scores for the first two in the KD series were “Lukewarm” and that we as Nas fans were quick to “Throw them in the bushes”. This is WRONG. KD1 was met with positive acclaim (72 score to be exact). It was met with higher acclaim than both Nasir and Lost Tapes 2 before it. The only review we as Nas fans threw in the bushes was the Rolling Stone review, not even because of the low score, but because the review spent more time talking about the Kelis allegations and misquoting lyrics than it did talking about the music. KD2 was universally acclaimed (86 score) and was amongst the top ten highest acclaimed rap albums of 2021. It actually was challenging Kendrick Lamar’s TPAB as the highest acclaimed rap album of all time before Pitchfork published they’re review. Ok fine, fukk Pitchfork, but to call a Generally acclaimed album and a Universally acclaimed album “lukewarm”
Makes zero sense whatsoever. KD3, as stated before, was the highest acclaimed rap album of last year. So if we’re talking about the MAJORITY of opinions then it is YOU who is on an island regarding Hit Boy’s production, not me or anyone who truly enjoys the albums.

If its YOUR opinion that Alchemist is a better producer and would make better music with Nas than Hit Boy then fine. Its my opinion that Dominique Wilkins would have been better on the 80’s Lakers than James Worthy. But there’s no FACT to back that opinion up and you certainly can’t quote ME thinking we’re just going to opinion for opinion and i’m not going to cite those facts as well as point out everything WRONG in your posts. You weren’t even worthy of me responding to your initial post because it was stupid but you WANTED this debate and you got it. If you want nothing more than to stand on your OPINIONS (no matter how retarded they are) on a forum DESIGNED for discourse and debate then don’t quote me ever again. Matter of fact put me on ignore.
 
K

kes929

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Piff Perkins said:
While I agree with you, to be fair there's really no music Nas could have released from 2021 onward that would match those classics, reaction wise at a concert. He's a legacy artist and most of his fans are emotionally attached to music released when they were younger, coinciding with when he made his best music: 1994-2002. That's where all his hits and most memorable tracks are. I've heard The Don ring off at a Nas concert but that's prob the most recent banger he has that would get a reaction. Just based on the videos I've seen it didn't look like most people cared for the KD stuff - not because they dislike the songs, but because they didn't come to hear that. People go to legacy concerts to hear legacy music. And before people say "but it was billed as a KD show" who cares. Concerts are usually named after a new album...doesn't mean people go there expecting to only hear new music. When I went to Jay's 4:44 Tour I went expecting to hear Hard Knock Life, 99 Problems, etc and that's what I heard. Not as many classics as I would have liked though.

A decade from now Kendrick/Drake/Cole will be in the same boat, which is kinda crazy to think about. They maybe have 1-2 more albums left in them before they become legacy acts.
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The people that I’ve talk to that attended said that Thun and 30 both went crazy when it dropped at MSG
 
ThirdAct

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Wonder how many songs it will be. I'm thinking shorter tracklist than KD3 but maybe a little longer than the first Magic.
 
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