Nas has top 3 best production in hip hop ever.

[SirBiatch]

you take out all the bad beats ... he still has like 5 CDs worth of just classic songs with perfect beats

Lost Tapes alone is a perfect example of what you're trying to say
nikkas got a whole throwaway project of perfect, well developed classics

exactly

Lets talk about this though, if you have random producers and not a main in house guy
AND you smoke way too much weed (Snoop, Nas) Does that make you rap over certain shyt you thought was dope more?
and then it ends up being a mess basically because you are too high with nobody to reign you in?

redman had sermon to reign him in
cypress hill had muggz
alot of stoners have one main dude

but the ones that go to random producers are picking random beats

Makes sense Never thought about it that way

 

[BK The Great]

some of my favs, there's more than that though

 

[Lifer11]

Half of the rappers you named are lucky to have 3 albums to their name. Mase? "Everyone" from Rocafella? Take out Dre and Kanye because the vast majority of their best songs/beats have been their own

We're not talking discography, we're talking production. And YES Mase, his albums are all at worst good albums, with good to great production.

Everyone on the Roc was getting prime Just Blaze, Kanye, Swizz, just to name a few. And why does Kanye and Dre producing for themselves disqualify them from the conversation?

Besides Mase and the role players on the Roc everyone on my list has over 3 albums. And Mase's 3 albums all have great production, and the role players on the Roc/State Prop I'm counting as a whole, and altogether they have more than 3 albums (Tough Love, Brothers From Another, Philadelphia Freeway, State Prop 1 & 2, plus countless mixtapes--from their ties to Jay and Kanye they had incredible production nonstop.)

Again u can't just remove Kanye and Dre cause they produced for themselves that's nonsense based on nothing more than u moving the goalposts to strengthen ur argument.

And besides the solo State Prop acts who don't have 3 solo albums, who did I list that is LUCKY to have 3 albums? If u say Beanie youre probably young. He has 3 good to great albums filled with great production, and a handful of mixtapes that rival most rappers best albums.

Fab and Ross earned the right to drop pretty much whenever they want, and they both have very good/great to amazing production everytime, and I damn near hate Ross and haven't fukked with Fab like that in years. Snoop's legacy was sealed in the 90s and had great production then.


Nas is my 2nd GOAT, but his production is his weakest link by far. Still good to great production just not on par with his abilities as a rapper/lyricist.

 

[DaveyDave]

We're not talking discography, we're talking production. And YES Mase, his albums are all at worst good albums, with good to great production.

Everyone on the Roc was getting prime Just Blaze, Kanye, Swizz, just to name a few. And why does Kanye and Dre producing for themselves disqualify them from the conversation?

Besides Mase and the role players on the Roc everyone on my list has over 3 albums. And Mase's 3 albums all have great production, and the role players on the Roc/State Prop I'm counting as a whole, and altogether they have more than 3 albums (Tough Love, Brothers From Another, Philadelphia Freeway, State Prop 1 & 2, plus countless mixtapes--from their ties to Jay and Kanye they had incredible production nonstop.)

Again u can't just remove Kanye and Dre cause they produced for themselves that's nonsense based on nothing more than u moving the goalposts to strengthen ur argument.

And besides the solo State Prop acts who don't have 3 solo albums, who did I list that is LUCKY to have 3 albums? If u say Beanie youre probably young. He has 3 good to great albums filled with great production, and a handful of mixtapes that rival most rappers best albums.

Fab and Ross earned the right to drop pretty much whenever they want, and they both have very good/great to amazing production everytime, and I damn near hate Ross and haven't fukked with Fab like that in years. Snoop's legacy was sealed in the 90s and had great production then.


Nas is my 2nd GOAT, but his production is his weakest link by far. Still good to great production just not on par with his abilities as a rapper/lyricist.

I was mostly talking about those State Prop cats. Separately I don't know who of them does and doesn't have 3 or more albums. The reason it matters is because I can show you at least 3 Nas albums full of great to classic production but he has 10+ albums so there's a lot more room for error compared to someone who only has 2 or 3 albums.

Also there's he fact that Nas never had an in house production team with him. Mase had the benefit of being signed to Bad Boy (and are you really saying his second and third album had GREAT production? Not from my memory), had State Prop not got signed to the Roc (through the Beanie affiliation I think) then they damn sure wouldn't have the likes of Ye and Just Blaze helping them. Nas didn't come up with a crew or group attached to a producer.

You say Jay has this great power to choose amazing beats but he has some terrible choices in his discography. I Know What Girls Like? Jigga My nikka? Hola Hovito?

 

[Eternal Tecate]

 

[Lifer11]

I was mostly talking about those State Prop cats. Separately I don't know who of them does and doesn't have 3 or more albums. The reason it matters is because I can show you at least 3 Nas albums full of great to classic production but he has 10+ albums so there's a lot more room for error compared to someone who only has 2 or 3 albums.

Also there's he fact that Nas never had an in house production team with him. Mase had the benefit of being signed to Bad Boy (and are you really saying his second and third album had GREAT production? Not from my memory), had State Prop not got signed to the Roc (through the Beanie affiliation I think) then they damn sure wouldn't have the likes of Ye and Just Blaze helping them. Nas didn't come up with a crew or group attached to a producer.

You say Jay has this great power to choose amazing beats but he has some terrible choices in his discography. I Know What Girls Like? Jigga My nikka? Hola Hovito?

Where did I say anything about Jay having some great power to select beats?

The Roc was the hottest most powerful imprint out, on the biggest label at the time in Def Jam so they were able to lock up the nicest up and coming producers, especially since at that time a Jay placement was like a career starter for them, but I never said anything about Jay having some kind of "great power" to select beats.

Also like I said in my first post, this is as subjective as it gets. I've listened to every Nas album front to back back to front, and while there's plent of production I love there's also a lot of shyt I hate. To me it's the only weakness in his whole career, which says a lot that his only weakness isnt the lyrics the flows or delivery.

As for the "what if" scenarios with State Prop, it literally couldn't be more pointless, we're only discussing them cause they got signed which gave the the resources they needed to make great music. Same with Mase having the Bad Boy machine, it doesn't matter how he acquired better production, there's no asterisk here, he was on Bad Boy and had better production.

Your arguments are like saying, "well Mugsy Bogues was only 5'3" tall or he would've been one of the nastiest dunkers ever." Or, "man if Magic didn't have the Showtime Lakers behind him John Stockton would've been a better all around PG." None of that matters cause this is how it DID play out so we deal in reality not "what ifs".


If you want to deal in "what ifs", what if Nas would've signed to Rocafella in 98-99 and had prime Ye, Just Blaze , Swizz, and the Roc/Def Jam machine behind him, would he be hands down the GOAT?

 

[Yinny]

Honestly, I may have to dwell on this.

I swear Jay has rapped over some if the worst beats ever created on rap.

I know what girls like, ain't no nikka, ghetto techno, Hollywood, and reminder are god awful.

Put this side by side against Nas worst and Nas will win

Agree with the bolded

 

[Awesome Wells]

I'd say, Hov, Cube, Redman, ATCQ, KRS, Common, GFK, Scarface and Rakim, are definitely nods for best production too.

Would Guru and CL Smooth count too?

 

[Piff Perkins]

Which other songs?

 

[Awesome Wells]

I haven't heard this in ages!!

When this album dropped, I was playing this track to death. Loved this joint!!

 

[Professor Polo]

I think it depends on what type of beats you're looking for...Jay definitely got some duds too...but I do think Jays ear WAS better than Nas' at one point. But Nas got CLASSSIC SHYT....case in point...

Yeah, I mean that's a top 10 Nas song for me and arguably one of the best remixes ever

 

[SirBiatch]

That Star Wars beat is incredible

Looking back, I've really given this board a lot of prophecy. I should be more stingy with the knowledge.

as we proceed....

As I said, once you start looking at unreleased Nas, he obliterates 99% of rappers

i know exactly what you are saying alot of these cats are dense as fukk on this board

you take out all the bad beats ... he still has like 5 CDs worth of just classic songs with perfect beats

 

[prophecypro]

The Nas has bad beats narrative feels like it comes from people who dont even listen to his albums and then just read that other people say it cause they want him to make Illmatic beats or hop with Kanye/Just/9th

Sure, there's other MCs that pick better beats than him, but what he actually raps on isnt that bad at all its just not the trendy beat.

Either way I thought this narrative should have been put to rest with Life is Good. Even if you dint like the album No ID and Salaam had the right beats to fit Nas to sound sonically pleasing while still comfortable with him to flow

Kyambo Hip Hop Joshua is A&Ring his next album and I know Statik Selektah been hanging out with him (Which might be seen as a bad thing seeing as people feel like he just appropriates signature NY sounds) so again I dont expect him to have that problem next album either, but I'm sure people will make the contrived narrative that he didnt rap on Zaytoven or whatever.

 

[prophecypro]

Also at OP for pretty much providing evidence that lays the hot take to rest. Y'all need to go on twitter and toss them out to people

 

[DoomzdayzV]

whooo boy this jams