Making Melo a lifer and waving at Felton in Rikers: Knicks offseason thread

[Bone$]

Yall about togget Kerr to coach Ehh, interesting

 

[Shogun]

Kerr ‘absolutely expects’ Knicks coaching offer

Phil Jackson’s first real imprint on the Knicks organization will come when he names a new head coach or stuns the basketball world by retaining Mike Woodson. Among those waiting on the news is Steve Kerr, the former player and general manager-turned-broadcaster for TNT.

According to a source close to the situation, Kerr “absolutely expects” to be offered the job. “And if he’s offered the job, he’s definitely going to do it,” the source told The Post.

The Post has learned Kerr has had conversations with his bosses at Turner Sports about adjusting his schedule as an analyst during the upcoming playoffs should he be named the Knicks’ head coach.

Kerr’s name emerged as a top candidate based on his ties with Jackson. He was part of the Bulls’ three straight championship teams from 1996 to 1998 and the two have remained close. His knowledge of the triangle offense is said to be an asset.

Kerr might seem an unlikely choice considering he has no coaching experience. But that is becoming more common in the NBA. Mark Jackson went from broadcaster to first-time coach at Golden State, where the Warriors have made two straight playoff appearances. Go back a few years and Doc Rivers made a successful transition from analyst to coaching. Jason Kidd, who had no previous coaching experience, led the Nets to the playoffs in his first season.

Fellow TNT analyst Charles Barkley, though, didn’t exactly give Kerr a ringing endorsement and questioned what impact he could have.

“I just feel bad the way they treated Mike Woodson,” Barkley told The Post. “The Kerr thing could be interesting, but I don’t know what the player situation is. This league is about players, so it’s going to depend on what he has to work with. He’s not going to do anything better with this team.”

Woodson is expected to be fired with one year left on his contract after the Knicks failed to make the playoffs following a 54-win season last year. Everyone knows 37-45 wasn’t all his fault. The injuries and subpar performances have been well-chronicled.

But it’s troubling to hear Tyson Chandler talk on Thursday about how the Knicks need to establish a “winning culture” and Amar’e Stoudemire say some Knicks didn’t totally buy into the game plans and defensive strategies.
“Whatever it is, we have to stick to the game plan and try to master it,” Stoudemire said. He also said some players need to become more of “a pro.”

 

[JMurder]

Here's the thing D, I just think Murry never took full advantage of the opportunites given to him. Keep in mind I was one of his biggest advocates when Felton was playing like shyt. He was ok defensively, but he turned the ball over a lot, never seemed capable of running the offense and had poor decision making. Even Clyde was getting on him last night. Compare that to Cole Aldrich, who took advantage and made a name for himself when guys went for down.

My thing is I'm praying we can get a competent point guard next year. If that happens and Felton is somehow not in jail we will still have him and Pablo. Even if Felton goes to jail or is traded we are going to need veterans on the team. Either way it's :dabush: for Murry.

I said this back when people were clamoring for Murray to start

 

[Mr. Jack Napier]

Steve Kerr

 

[Victim of Racism]

You also don't seem to understand that the game has evolved AWAY from mid-range basketball. LeBron mainly around the basket or from 3pt BY DESIGN. And he's improved his long distance shooting immensely as a result. There is nothing less valuable in basketball than a 19-23 foot jumper. Nothing.


Why don't you understand the game... and why do you keep responding to me? We're not equals. You clearly don't understand how the game works.

You're asking "what's going to happen to lebron when he loses his athleticism" WHEN HE'S BEEN IN THE LEAGUE FOR 11 YEARS AND HE'S STILL AN ATHLETIC FREAK.

There's no reason to assume that will change in the next 2-3 years, and if it does diminish, I'm sure he'll adjust his game... as he has every year since he entered. Becoming more efficient, becoming a better shooter, working out of the post when he has a size advantage... those are improvements year over year for more than a decade. And you're waiting for him to break down?

LeBron has always been better than melo.
LeBron is better than melo now.
He'll be better than Melo next season.
And he'll be better than melo three years from now.

What is your argument? Melo has never facilitated an office consistently or willfully in his life. I'm a fan of his, I was excited to sign him. But his game is his game.


I'm with whatever Phil does... but stop responding to me, because fans like you make us all look stupid.

How is his handle worse than Lj's when 'Melo turns it over 0.9 less than Lj (that's almost a full turnover less per game) and only 0.3 more times per game than CP3? 'Melo doesn't even control the ball, yet his assist-to-bad pass-ratio is only 0.6 worse than Lj. That said, this isn't an Lj's passing vs 'Melo's passing discussion. You said his timing was great and it isn't. Lj's vision is elite, not his accuracy and not his timing.

ESPN and Beyond the Buzzer aren't Lj and Ira. But I'll indulge you. Google “espn lebron james primary facilitator miami heat” and you'll see ESPN saying things like:

James emerged not as a scorer, but the Heat's primary facilitator

. That being said, is this not true...

Fit is important to the Heat. Unlike many teams, the point guard isn’t guaranteed to be on the floor at the end of games or even orchestrate the offense on many possessions

Now, if you get a Lowry or a player looking to re-establish himself, he might not be as willing to sacrifice playing time, shots or even play-making opportunities. To a degree, Chalmers is a fit for this team because he can appreciate his place.

How does the main PG not lead in orchestrating the offense, play-making opportunities, and not guaranteed to play late in games? That isn't the case for Felton.

There's a reason you're not dealing with those statements directly and Lj's own admission that he functions in Miami as the PG with leading the team in touches/possessions per game and referring them as his shooters.

If you're arguing that Woodson's system isn't designed to defend on 'Melo to score, then that's ridiculous. He doesn't average as many assists because he plays off the ball and doesn't control the ball like Lj. Felton does, which is why he averages almost as many assists and he was on the Bobcats for most of his career. Actually it's Lj that would rather shoot. He averages only 8.3 less passes per game and more fga's for their career. Lj even said his first choice is to shoot. He said:

It's pick your poison. If you're going to double me, I'll find my shooters; if you're going to play me one‑on‑one, I'm going to be aggressive and look for my shot. I'm an unselfish guy. If they try to come on the post and take the ball away from me, I'm going to look weak side -- try to find my shooters, try to find my bigs on the baseline. If not, I'm going to go to work.

And this from the guy that functions as the PG. In game 5 of the ECF when he took 26 shots and gave Bosh and Wade 15 to share. He averaged 20 fga's per game to Wade's 13 and Bosh's 9 in that series. Which is why Wade called him out in a nice way. Windhorst of ESPN noted:

Dwyane Wade thinks he knows what is causing his Miami Heat team to become a shell of itself against the Indiana Pacers. And it is not his bad knee or Chris Bosh's sore ankle. After the Pacers' 91-77 Game 6 victory Saturday night, Wade said he feels he and Bosh are having their touches and shots cut and it's hurting the team. "We've got to do a good job of making sure me and Chris have our opportunities to succeed throughout the game," Wade said. "That's something we're going to have to look at as a team."

Here is what Wade is talking about: He averaged 15 shots and 16.8 points over the first four games of the Eastern Conference finals. He has gotten a total of 19 shots and scored a total of 20 points in the past two games. Wade was 3 of 11 for 10 points in Game 6. Bosh averaged 16.3 points on 11 shots in the series' first three games. In the three games since, he's averaging just 6.3 points on seven shots a game. Bosh was 1-of-8 shooting for just five points in Saturday's loss. It's the first time since Bosh's rookie season in 2004 he's had three consecutive games where he's failed to score 10 points.

Meanwhile, LeBron James' shots are up and his efficiency is down. In the first four games of the series, James averaged 19.8 shots and 28 points. In the past two games, James has averaged 24 shots and 29.5 points. Wade implied James is trying to do too much. "We've got guys individually who want to play better," Wade said. "But we've got to try to help each other out in this locker room and not leave it up to the individual to self-will it." Wade has been passively referring to his dwindling role in the Heat's offense for some time. Prior to Game 6, Wade blamed his struggles earlier in the series on not being a bigger part of the offense. "I get a little more rhythm defensively, I get to defend every play," Wade said. "Offensively, I don't get the ball every play. So it comes a little different. You know, the rhythm is a little different."

Folks was sayin' he “carried” them. He didn't carry nothin' but the fga's, just like he's doing to Ray who is the worst he's been in 5 years. Of course the big 3 depended on Rondo to get the ball because he always had it. They weren't on the court without him much.

Felton has the most touches with 'Melo. Russell has them with KD. Rondo had them with the big 3. You dismissed Bleacher but didn't address Ira's statements and Ira was the source of the Bleacher Report article.

Actually you're the simple one, so I will repeat. Felton has the most touches with 'Melo. Russell has them with KD. Rondo had them with the big 3.

Paul George averages the exact amount of touches as George Hill and they both lead the team in that category. Lance is just slightly better at it. What has 19-23ft have to do with 15-19ft? The shots that he's attempted 178 of. Why do I keep responding to you? If you keep responding to me, why wouldn't I. Claims that we're not equals is just another assertion. It's not a rebuttal and it's certainly not proof. So, because he's been athletic for all or most of his 20's, that means he will be for most of his 30's? I don't know why you're sure he'll adjust his game because he's still struggling with his mid-range game at almost 30. Again, Jordan, Kobe, and 'Melo came in the league with a solid mid-range game along with their solid drive, layup, and dunk game. He became more efficient because of who he plays next to. Before that, his FG% was pathetic for a person who's shots are so close to the basket, mostly within 5ft feet. His post game is very weak, which is why he doesn't use it much and that's pathetic. It took him 8 years to develop what little of it he has.

Of course I'm not waiting for him to break down. I like him. I enjoy his athleticism. I like the watch him run and dunk. I like a lot things about his personality (not everything). That's why I know so much about him. I couldn't tell you all this about players I dislike. That has nothing to do with nothing. We're discussing his ability to adjust and he hasn't shown any. He still relies on his athleticism and size. If you can't handle it without getting so emotional you're welcome to . You haven't proven that Lj is better than 'Melo. Lj's vision is probably better, his passing is only better by 0.6 per game. His ball-handling is worse, his defense is atrocious, while 'Melo's is solid, his rebounding is not as good because although he averages 0.7 more rpg, he's always in the paint; has always controlled the paint and 'Melo is the better offensive rebounder (the ones that don't just come to you, the ones that are more valuable because they're 2nd chance points. By the time they're both done, that 0.7 gap will likely dissipate with 'Melo leading. His shooting is below average, while 'Melo's is incredible.

 

[Victim of Racism]

TOTAL passes don't mean shyt to me, find me a stat that records assists per pass and/or hockey assists, or perhaps GOOD PASSES, then talk to me.

Also, passing the ball to the closest person because you're in a bad spot, lost your dribble, double covered, etc. and then immediately asking for the ball back does not count as a pass IMO.

I wouldn't doubt that Lj's vision is better because his vision is great. His ball-handling is atrocious. He averages 3.5 turnovers per game. 'Melo is 0.9 turnovers better at 2.6. That's almost a full turnover better. Lj's overall passing is only better by 0.6 per game and 'Melo doesn't even control the ball (lead in touches/possessions) or play PG. Lj's assist-to bad pass-ratio is 4 to 'Melo's 3.4. Pierce is only 1.1 better at 4.5 and 'Melo has never been on a team like the one Pierce was on in Boston for so many years of his career.

That said, that wasn't the argument. You claimed that he doesn't “get his teammates involved”. That means, he doesn't pass. I proved he passes as much as anyone.

As for your second comment, at the notion that he he does that even close to the 40 passes per game that he makes.

 

[Money!!]

for some reason I like Kerr. Rather him then the same old suspects.

 

[MR. Conclusion]

JORDAN???? He was the one of the most athletically gifted players the league had ever seen when he showed up.

Are you serious?

This is what I said:

"Take away his athleticism and is he skilled enough to dominate like pierce (2 yrs ago), Melo, Kobe, Jordan? I dunno"

As Jordan's athleticism declined, he established a more complete offensive game, with the ability to dominate without extreme athletic moves. Why would you think anybody would compare Melo and Pierce to a young dunking from the free throw line Michael Jordan? What part of take away his athleticism did you not understand?

 

[I.V.]

Are you serious?

This is what I said:

"Take away his athleticism and is he skilled enough to dominate like pierce (2 yrs ago), Melo, Kobe, Jordan? I dunno"

As Jordan's athleticism declined, he established a more complete offensive game, with the ability to dominate without extreme athletic moves. Why would you think anybody would compare Melo and Pierce to a young dunking from the free throw line Michael Jordan? What part of take away his athleticism did you not understand?

When MJ was in his prime, he was still among the best athletes in basketball....


I don't understand this "take his athleticism away" shyt. Where did it come from? You can't do it. MJ in the mid 90's was still one of the best athletes in the game.


shytty sports analysis

 

[I.V.]

You haven't proven that Lj is better than 'Melo.

I don't have to prove that.

It is understood.

fukk are you writing me essays for to argue something that is common fact?

Had to neg her with the message "Everything about your is horrible."

brand-new basketball fans :FOHsanka:

 

[I.V.]

TOTAL passes don't mean shyt to me, find me a stat that records assists per pass and/or hockey assists, or perhaps GOOD PASSES, then talk to me.

Also, passing the ball to the closest person because you're in a bad spot, lost your dribble, double covered, etc. and then immediately asking for the ball back does not count as a pass IMO.

Do you see what I have to put up with in here?

She's googling "miami heat" and trying to argue her search results with me.

shyt is astounding.

 

[MR. Conclusion]

When MJ was in his prime, he was still among the best athletes in basketball....


I don't understand this "take his athleticism away" shyt. Where did it come from? You can't do it. MJ in the mid 90's was still one of the best athletes in the game.


shytty sports analysis

You don't understand what take away his athleticism means? It's when good players get old and they can't run and jump like they used to.

Earlier in the thread someone made a statement that Melo is the type of all star player that will perform at a higher level because of his style of play.

Eventually the question of whether or not Lebron can still produce as his body slows down came up.

This is really not that hard to follow.

And for the record MJ went to the next level when he developed the back to the basket game, along with a deadly mid range jumper.

 

[Sampson]

New York Knicks coach Mike Woodson is not interested in having a face-to-face meeting with team president Phil Jackson until he gets further clarification on his status, a league source said.

"He just wants to know one way or the other," the source said.

The Knicks' subpar performance this season has led to widespread speculation about Woodson's future with the team.

On Wednesday, the coach said he'd like a resolution on whether or not he will return next season as soon as possible.

"I think it's been enough said about my job all year with you guys," he said. "Hopefully, soon I'll know my destination in terms of where I'm going to be."

Earlier Friday on "SportsCenter," ESPN's Stephen A. Smith said Woodson would prefer that Jackson reach out to his agent if he's going to fire him rather than having a face-to-face meeting to inform him that he's being let go.

The New York Daily News reported Thursday night that Jackson and Woodson will talk on the phone Friday to either plan a meeting or work out the terms of Woodson's departure. The paper also reported that Woodson informed the Knicks recently that he doesn't see a reason to meet formally if he's going to be fired.

Woodson has coached the Knicks for the past two seasons after taking over on an interim basis in 2011 following Mike D'Antoni's resignation. He guided the Knicks to a 54-win regular season and a division title in 2012-13. The Knicks also won a playoff series for the first time in 13 seasons under Woodson's stewardship.

:knicksdafuq:

 

[I.V.]

You don't understand what take away his athleticism means? It's when good players get old and they can't run and jump like they used to.

Earlier in the thread someone made a statement that Melo is the type of all star player that will perform at a higher level because of his style of play.

Eventually the question of whether or not Lebron can still produce as his body slows down came up.
This is really not that hard to follow.

But it IS hard to follow, because MJ - right up until he retired the second time - was an ELITE NBA athlete. "When he can't run and jump like he used to" HE'S BEEN IN THE LEAGUE MORE THAN A DECADE! 11 years, and he's still one of the best athletes in basketball.

Next year it'll be 12 years in the league and the same story.

Eventually ALL players degrade. Melo's game seems to have a longer shelf-life to kids, because he shoots more jumpshots. But his long-midrange jumpers are the WORST part of having him on your team. And people say he'll be better because he can rely on those skills. Nah. Without the threat of a blow-by Carmelo's game becomes useless. He's never passed well, he can't post up bigger players consistently.

When LeBron's athleticism goes away... he'll be retiring. You shouldn't be depending on a player "who's athleticism goes away" in the first place, so who cares?

Did all of you idiots sign up at once? Or has there been a slow leak we're not aware of...

And for the record... MJ went to the next level when he got Pippen and Phil Jackson.

Sorry to the actual fans putting up with my posting back and forth... but I'm setting a precedent: This is the offseason therad, and I'm not having any fukking idiots running around here trying to pretend they root for this team, or know what's best, especially some brand-new teenagers that just got the internet.

Nah. Keep it moving, go root for the Bobcats.

 

[Mr. Jack Napier]

New York Knicks coach Mike Woodson is not interested in having a face-to-face meeting with team president Phil Jackson until he gets further clarification on his status, a league source said.

"He just wants to know one way or the other," the source said.

The Knicks' subpar performance this season has led to widespread speculation about Woodson's future with the team.

On Wednesday, the coach said he'd like a resolution on whether or not he will return next season as soon as possible.

"I think it's been enough said about my job all year with you guys," he said. "Hopefully, soon I'll know my destination in terms of where I'm going to be."

Earlier Friday on "SportsCenter," ESPN's Stephen A. Smith said Woodson would prefer that Jackson reach out to his agent if he's going to fire him rather than having a face-to-face meeting to inform him that he's being let go.

The New York Daily News reported Thursday night that Jackson and Woodson will talk on the phone Friday to either plan a meeting or work out the terms of Woodson's departure. The paper also reported that Woodson informed the Knicks recently that he doesn't see a reason to meet formally if he's going to be fired.

Woodson has coached the Knicks for the past two seasons after taking over on an interim basis in 2011 following Mike D'Antoni's resignation. He guided the Knicks to a 54-win regular season and a division title in 2012-13. The Knicks also won a playoff series for the first time in 13 seasons under Woodson's stewardship.
:knicksdafuq:

:woody: