Is Paolo Banchero good enough to dig the Magic out the grave?

NotAHotep

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Like I said, special player on his own, but I don't really think that heliocentric play style wins championships.

Basically, still not that player who is enough to win a championship on his own without a really good #2, not in this era at least. Franz may very well be that guy dude needs.

LeBron won 4 Championships playing that heliocentric style.
 

manyfaces

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That muthafukka is big and can move. Offensively I don't know if there are many weaknesses. I don't know if it was Dukes offense or moreso his mentality, but he played too much on the outside for my liking last year when any time he was in our around the paint he was unstoppable. He doesn't have to be the bruiser Zion is, as he has a better outside game, but I don't want to see him camping out there like he some kind of 3 pt specialist. He looks like the type of centerpiece they can build around. Maybe now they can work on some semblance of pieces that compliment each other to actually build a team.
 
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IIVI

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LeBron won 4 Championships playing that heliocentric style.
Not by himself though? There were some terrific 1a~1b players on every single one of those teams.

Also times done changed. Luka ain't beating stacked teams like the Pelicans dolo in a series.

Warriors basically easily exposed that play style three times (Jokic, Ja, Luka) last post season by playing team, motion offense ball and basically shut down everyone else (because nobody else on those teams could create for themselves or their team). All those cats were basically exhausted by game 4 and nowhere close to beating GS.
 
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Osmosis

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Not by himself though? There were some terrific 1a~1b players on every single one of those teams.

Also times done changed. Luka ain't beating stacked teams like the Pelicans dolo in a series.

Warriors basically easily exposed that play style three times (Jokic, Ja, Luka) last post season by playing team, motion offense ball and basically shut down everyone else (because nobody else on those teams could create for themselves or their team). All those cats were basically exhausted by game 4 and nowhere close to beating GS.
Nobody wins championships by themselves. Lebron's teams have rarely lost because of diminishing returns from his style of play. The Cavs in 2017, for example, were the best offense in the league despite the Warriors adding Kevin Durant. The Warriors might have had a more aesthetically pleasing style but the Cavs still produced a historic offense on the same level.. They just didn't have a prayer of stopping that Warriors offense.

None of those teams had the talent, pedigree, or experience to beat the Warriors, though. Jokic's team was undermanned, the Mavs overachieved by even making the conference finals, and the Grizzlies lacked experience. The Warriors had a talent advantage in every one of those series... that had more to do with their victories in those series than style of play.
 

IIVI

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Nobody wins championships by themselves. Lebron's teams have rarely lost because of diminishing returns from his style of play. The Cavs in 2017, for example, were the best offense in the league despite the Warriors adding Kevin Durant. The Warriors might have had a more aesthetically pleasing style but the Cavs still produced a historic offense on the same level.. They just didn't have a prayer of stopping that Warriors offense.

None of those teams had the talent, pedigree, or experience to beat the Warriors, though. Jokic's team was undermanned, the Mavs overachieved by even making the conference finals, and the Grizzlies lacked experience. The Warriors had a talent advantage in every one of those series... that had more to do with their victories in those series than style of play.
But that's what I'm saying, dude ain't enough to win it by himself. I think Banchero can be on that level as those guys mentioned, but the GM's nor fans should expect that player to carry a team to their first title as the one premier guy. I'm not talking about a good 1b either because nowadays it takes multiple 1a's (not even simply 1a's and 1b's) to make it happen.

You look at some of the potential lottery teams for next draft: OKC, Houston, etc. those guys already have players who are potential 1a-tier (Giddey, Green, Chet, etc.) and are about to add on another monster like Wemby/Scoot/Baba because that Western Conference is too stacked at the right time for them. Next few after that you got D.J Wagner, Aday Mara, Cooper Flagg, Carlos Boozer's kid, etc. but each of these teams are already stacked like a mf.

This basically the result of international talent getting really good and now are pouring into the league. Some people even say the overseas leagues are better than the state-side colleges. League is basically like having a school full of geniuses now.
 
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An apt comparison has already been made - the Good version of Julius Randle. They're pretty much identical twins. One good, one evil.
Randle at his absolute best was last year 25/11/5 i dont think banchero gets there....i like the David Lee comp a decent scorer with limited range who will score on mismatches,bad defender but wont be the m ain guy on an elite team...when you think about thats a perfect comp...
Banchero doesn't need to get to 25, 11 and 5 to be better than Julius, as those are meaningless box score numbers that were an anomaly, played during a season with no crowds (there's a reason why he hasn't been able to replicate them in any manner, in any other season). I say he's the good to Julius' evil because he plays in a more impactful manner - he's not selfish by purely accumulating volume stats to make himself look better on paper than he does irl. Julius has managed to fool a lot of folks who look at his surface stats and mistake that for him being a good player, when he doesn't expend energy for actions that aren't in the box score.

He's incapable of playing winning basketball. That's why he's evil.

Their size, athleticism and styles of play are nearly identical:

- They're both big body tweeners (6'9"-6'10"; 240lbs-250lbs)
- Their primary diet of offense is under-the-rim bully ball (while both have above-average athleticism, they're not explosive athletes)
- Awkward touch (neither are particularly creative at finishing)
- Limited footwork
- Inconsistent jumpshots
- Dissonant defensive effort.

The only real notable difference is Banchero has a far greater feel for the game, which is only going to lead him to being a more impactful player. Again, that's why he's the good.

The David Lee comparison doesn't make sense because he wasn't a power player. He didn't overwhelm his opponent by trying to physically dominate them, hunting for the mismatch at every opportunity. That's where Julius and Banchero are eerily similar; they force themselves down on the block and bully their matchup to get to the rim, and their respective perimeter games are only complementary to that.
Paolo is already better than Julius.

:wow:
 

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Magic lost today but Banchero put up 33 points, 16 rebounds, 4 assists on 14-26 shooting.

I didn't get a chance to watch the game but it sure seems like from an offensive standpoint, Banchero is off to probably the best start of any #1 overall pick since maybe Blake Griffin.

It remains to be seen just how high Banchero's ceiling is. And granted, we're talking box score numbers here so keep that in mind. But early on anyway, it seems there's a super high floor here.
 

Th3G3ntleman

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Watched every game this season. He doesn't even really know what to do yet on a consistent basis to "win" against defenders and he is still putting up points just off skill and touch. Once he figures out what works in the NBA he should be one of the better scorers in the entire league. I actually expected him to be much more selfish considering what you would presume his archtype would be...the Beasly/Melo scoring forward type but he isn't at all.
 

threattonature

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Watched every game this season. He doesn't even really know what to do yet on a consistent basis to "win" against defenders and he is still putting up points just off skill and touch. Once he figures out what works in the NBA he should be one of the better scorers in the entire league. I actually expected him to be much more selfish considering what you would presume his archtype would be...the Beasly/Melo scoring forward type but he isn't at all.
Yeah I like that it'll take a couple of dribbles to see if he has anything and then come off the ball and get back into the offense. There are times he gets too caught in pumpfaking and trying to create that opening. His footwork for his age is insane. He has turnarounds, the step backs, that old Kobe move where he's spin left and pump fake and then completely spin the other direction on the same pivot and step through. And he has the court vision and has shown some playmaking chops. Add in the size and the touch. Orlando got one.
 
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