If you condense ‘Reasonable Doubt’ down to an ‘Illmatic’ size track list … what tracks would you take off and would it be better than Illmatic?

[Whips-n-Chains]

There are many albums better than illmatic

For the sake of debate, I'm interested to know what you think is better?

 

[mikishere]

I have to vehemently disagree. The revisionist overrating of IWW is near the level of RD at this point. Lyrically IWW is incredible, but there are some lags, there's some over-produced songs (Nas is Coming) and some skips (Black Girl Lost). Trackmasters are meh, especially compared to Q-Tip, Premier, Pete Rock, Large Pro, etc.

 

[ThirdAct]

Illmatic is 9 tracks so here's the best 9 on RD I'd keep:

Can't Knock the Hustle
Brooklyn's Finest
Dead Presidents II
Feelin' It
D'Evils
Can I Live
Friend Or Foe
Bring It On
Regrets

That's a mean 9 songs but I wouldn't say it's better than Illmatic. Mostly because by 96 we had already heard music like this. We had Illmatic, we had Only Built, we had Ready To Die, we had The Infamous, we had Doe or Die, etc. That's what ultimately hurts RD's status, as good as it is and as lyrically sharp as Jay was on it. It just wasn't doing anything different than what came before it. Meanwhile Illmatic was like something no one ever heard before.

 

[2ATMsYouSteppinOrWhat]

Reasonable Doubt as is >>> Illmatic

but

Bring It On
Brooklyns Finest
DEvils
Dead Presidents
Can I Live
Friend or Foe
Cashmere Thoughts (soooo underrated)
Regrets
22 Twos
Can’t Knock the Hustle

 

[Tony D'Amato]

It sounds dated b/c it's a time capsule of 1992-93 when it was recorded.

Hip-Hop as a whole made huge jumps from 94 to 96, and even 95 to 96 sounds vastly different. By 1996, the production sound, cadences, delivery, etc. was much more refined across the board. Compare The Infamous to Hell On Earth, or Dah Shinin to Nocturnal, or the 95 Wu Solo's to Ironman, etc. That's a whole separate thread to discuss how fast the genre was evolving at the time. Stuff from 91 sounded ancient by 93, which then sounded ancient by 95, which then sounded dated by 96-97.

I disagree that RD is better than illmatic, again very strongly. Again, I love RD, one of my favorites, but it lacks a certain quality that some other albums have.

To each their own though.

You got me going back to listen to illmatic again. I swear every couple yrs this site makes me replay that album.

Jay had bars on reasonable doubt.

 

[seemorecizzy]

Thread should be closed for you even suggesting that the D'Evils should be taken off anything. One of the best songs ever

 

[RennisDeynolds]

All I know is I'm fukking sick of Illmatic . How many fukking orchestral concerts are we gonna get of this shyt



It Was Written , but that fukking bozo 6noz refuses to acknowledge and celebrate the greatness

 

[mobbinfms]

the product of an self-financed independent artist

Jay was not independent. He was signed to Priority. The same major label Ice Cube was signed to.
He wasn’t self-financed either. His biggest commercial breakthrough came from his single being included on the Nutty Professor soundtrack with a video including movie footage.
Please stop with the revisionist history.

 

[Bugzbunny129]

For the sake of debate, I'm interested to know what you think is better?

Cuban linx
The infamous
36 chambers
Life after death
Supreme clientele
Ready to die
Liquid swords
Etc

Then theres albums that might not be better per say cause of a few fillers, but could easily go classic for classic with it and still have plenty if heat in the chamber

Capital punishment
Idahih
Wu tang forever
Maybe RD
Maybe even IWW

Illmatic has 7/8 classics, 1/2 good songs and an intro. In the era of 20 track albums, id be hardpressed not to be able to name manu albums from the era having equal bangers at the very least if not more like cuban linx which is twice as long. Just as potent.

 

[Whips-n-Chains]

RD sounds sonically more modern

While IM sounds more classically boom bap and reflects something we almost lost in 1994-1995 as Hip-Hop production began to evolve sonically, what we lost has reemerged in recent times as like a throwback boom bap movement from acts like Griselda and those associated

This is probably a topic for @Art Barr

By I am right now @‘ing his crib and he didn’t even give me his number

That's what I'm saying in another post too. 1996 sound compared to 1994 is VASTLY different.

if anything RD and IWW should be compared.

2 years in the 90s, sonically, the way Hip Hop was evolving, is like 12 years in current day.

Compare Ready To Die (which had a more refined sound for a 1994 album) to RD, and RTD still sounds so much more dated.

 

[2ATMsYouSteppinOrWhat]

Reasonable doubt
Life After Death
It Was Written
Ready To Die
Hell on Earth
Infamous
OB4CL
Doggystyle
Dogg Food
Southernplayalistic
Ridin Dirty
Aquemini
ATLiens

just to name a few and thats from the 90s

 

[2ATMsYouSteppinOrWhat]

For the sake of debate, I'm interested to know what you think is better?

 

[⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐]

That's what I'm saying in another post too. 1996 sound compared to 1994 is VASTLY different.

if anything RD and IWW should be compared.

2 years in the 90s, sonically, the way Hip Hop was evolving, is like 12 years in current day.

Compare Ready To Die, which had a more refined sound for a 1994 album to RD, at it still sounds so much more dated.

Great ear, great observations

 

[⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐]

For the sake of debate, I'm interested to know what you think is better?

I was gonna say Makaveli but you can play Illmatic at a wedding or funeral and you can't do that with Makaveli

 

[Whips-n-Chains]

Cuban linx
The infamous
36 chambers
Life after death
Supreme clientele
Ready to die
Liquid swords
Etc

Then theres albums that might not be better per say cause of a few fillers, but could easily go classic for classic with it and still have plenty if heat in the chamber

Capital punishment
Idahih
Wu tang forever
Maybe RD
Maybe even IWW

Fair points. I will say all the albums you listed besides 36 Chambers, came out after illmatic, so they have a more evolved sound.

Cuban Linx is my all-time favorite album, Infamous is in my top 3. And I love all the albums you listed, although I don't necessarily think they're better than illmatic.

Life After Death has several songs that I skip every single time, for example. It's bloated and could've been condensed to 1 disc.