Glaring black female hypocrisy on IR/LGBT representation.

[Supper]

even in that thread last week about BW cosigning bisexual black men i thought brehs like @Poitier was kinda reaching but then you see something like that Issa Rae deal with HBO and the reaction is crazy. idk how we're going to reverse this

Brother, I think you might be underestimating just how much malice SOME, very vocal, and prominent black women have for black men as a whole. I don't believe many, maybe most, of them who push so hard for black lgbt representation actually genuinely care about that. I believe they simply see it as an avenue to propagandize the humiliation & effemination of black men, and then turn around and attack & shame us for "homophobia" if we even so much as protest it, which conveniently serves in the interest of white male partriachal hegemony.

If not then why don't they practice as they preach and call for more black female lgbt role in major films, and campaign against the over representation of heterosexual interracial black women in film, which also affirms white males patriarchal hegemony. Instead what you seem them doing neglecting black female lgbt representation and celebrating & endorsing any and every film with a heterosexual BW/WM coupling.

I'm sorry to say, but it seems that most black women who are vocal about media representation are completely full of it.

 

[xoxodede]

For instance, did you know that BW/WM couples are more than twice as represented in movies as BM/WW couples despite being outnumbered more than 2:1 in real life? This comes straight from a website that complied all of the interracial couples in TV/movies up to 2015. If that's not a sign of the deliberate systematic propagandized attempt to celebrate and embellish white males as the ideal man then I don't know what is.​

Most of these movies are not written, produced or financed by Black women - maybe 30 out of the 200+ are but they are also made by Black men.

So, how is this on BW?

Can any black woman on this forum address these things for me:

1. Will you push for more of your sisters to be represented in lesbian relations in the media?

Not a Lesbian - but I push for BW and BM and Black children to be pushed for representation. More so hetero - as that is what I am and would like to see more of.

2. Will you push against the overrepresentation of black women in heterosexual interracial relationships in the media, which reinforces white male patriarchal hegemony for the reasons stated above?

We already do.

3. Will you push for an increase in the underrepresented heterosexual black men in interracial relations in the media?

No. As I won't for BW in IR as well.

 

[xoxodede]

Hey op you make one hell of a point with your question

It seems This is a question that no one has even thought of

But its a great point.

Issa ray comes of kinda gay to me as a matter of fact

Issa ray seems like she eats p*ssy its just sonething about her that seems masculine to me

Yet she is pushing her gayness onto black men

You are right black women want to see black men as gay but want to be under white male patriarchy

There is no real push for black women to be gay with each other

There should be more black lesbian couples in these tv shows that are coming out

Where are the black lesbian couples in media brehs?

White Supremacy. It's to come as Black men and the Black family. Black Lesbians - will never be pushed more than bi-sexual/Gay Black men - because MEN are supposed to be the leaders of their community. So, highlighting those types of relationships as common and the norm - it's going directly at BLACK MEN straight - and challenging BLACK MEN to take over and grab ahold of their images and narrative in media.

Only BLACK MEN can change this.

 

[Supper]

Once again, I thank you for taking the time to answer the questions honestly and candidly.

It really means a lot that I get down to the bottom of the black female perspective of this even if we vehemently disagree on some things. There's no hard feelings, malice, animosity here. Same to @Katey.

​

Most of these movies are not written, produced or financed by Black women - maybe 30 out of the 200+ are but they are also made by Black men.

So, how is this on BW?

Of course as I acknowledged to @Katey , the media in all of it's forms is mostly run by white men behind the scenes, not black women. So, yes I do hold them primarily responsible for the lopsided marginalization of black men, particularly our sexual/romantic representation being disproportionately asexual, homosexual, or toxic-sexual(rapist, abusers, harassers, etc.).

BUT, there's the issue of black women who happened to be very vocal, constantly badgering and pushing for more black male lgbt representation, and shaming & attacking black men for our supposed nonacceptance of it. Surely you saw the viral thread a couple of days ago where Amanda Seales attacked black men for not accepting black male lgbt, which had a lot of black female regular posters who are known to champion heterosexual black female IRRs in the media, co signing her message also going on to attack and brand black men as 'homophobics', while failing to address their own 'lesbophobia' and pro-white cis male patriarchal hegemonic apologetics for BW/WM interracialism. So, I had to of course call them(black women) out on it.

Not a Lesbian - but I push for BW and BM and Black children to be pushed for representation. More so hetero - as that is what I am and would like to see more of.

Awesome, and I definitely understand where you're coming from with wanting more representation for healthy black family units over just throwing a bunch of random lgbts on screen just for the sake of satisfying societal 'diversity' obligations. And I don't mean that as a knock towards individuals of that lifestyle.

But, what I don't understand is how black women can neglect black female lgbt representation, and then turn around and push so hard for black male lgbt representation, and shame black men as homophobics for not accepting every single contrived, distorted version of it handed to us by black women or white men in the media.

2. Will you push against the overrepresentation of black women in heterosexual interracial relationships in the media, which reinforces white male patriarchal hegemony for the reasons stated above?

We already do.

I'm sorry, but I'm just not seeing it. Everywhere I turn I see black women doing the exact opposite by celebrating, endorsing, and patronizing any and every black female heterosexual interracial pairing, especially with white men, on film. Actress Nia Long even went so far as to specifically request a white male love interest in "The Best Man Holiday". When have you ever heard of a black actor specifically requesting a white female love interest in a movie, despite the pairing be underrepresented as it is.

But, maybe you, being a black woman, have some insight into something I might be unaware of. Please do share.

3. Will you push for an increase in the underrepresented heterosexual black men in interracial relations in the media?

No. As I won't for BW in IR as well.

I completely understand why you take this stance.

But you do acknowledge that over representation of hetero IRBW and under representation of hetero IRBM in the media plays into the hands of white male patriarchal hegemony pushed onto our community, though right? Wouldn't it at least fair if we had more healthy, virtuous, admirable hetero black male love interest whether intra or interracial to counter act that? Why not have hetero IRBM represented proportionally to their numbers in real life or even AT LEAST represented in the same amount as hetero IRBW in films to get rid of the imbalance?

 

[xoxodede]

Once again, I thank you for taking the time to answer the questions honestly and candidly.

It really means a lot that I get down to the bottom of the black female perspective of this even if we vehemently disagree on some things. There's no hard feelings, malice, animosity here. Same to @Katey.



Of course as I acknowledged to @Katey , the media in all of it's forms is mostly run by white men behind the scenes, not black women. So, yes I do hold them primarily responsible for the lopsided marginalization of black men, particularly our sexual/romantic representation being disproportionately asexual, homosexual, or toxic-sexual(rapist, abusers, harassers, etc.).

BUT, there's the issue of black women who happened to be very vocal, constantly badgering and pushing for more black male lgbt representation, and shaming & attacking black men for our supposed nonacceptance of it. Surely you saw the viral thread a couple of days ago where Amanda Seales attacked black men for not accepting black male lgbt, which had a lot of black female regular posters who are known to champion heterosexual black female IRRs in the media, co signing her message also going on to attack and brand black men as 'homophobics', while failing to address their own 'lesbophobia' and pro-white cis male patriarchal hegemonic apologetics for BW/WM interracialism. So, I had to of course call them(black women) out on it.




Awesome, and I definitely understand where you're coming from with wanting more representation for healthy black family units over just throwing a bunch of random lgbts on screen just for the sake of satisfying societal 'diversity' obligations. And I don't mean that as a knock towards individuals of that lifestyle.

But, what I don't understand is how black women can neglect black female lgbt representation, and then turn around and push so hard for black male lgbt representation, and shame black men as homophobics for not accepting every single contrived, distorted version of it handed to us by black women or white men in the media.



I'm sorry, but I'm just not seeing it. Everywhere I turn I see black women doing the exact opposite by celebrating, endorsing, and patronizing any and every black female heterosexual interracial pairing, especially with white men, on film. Actress Nia Long even went so far as to specifically request a white male love interest in "The Best Man Holiday". When have you ever heard of a black actor specifically requesting a white female love interest in a movie, despite the pairing be underrepresented as it is.

But, maybe you, being a black woman, have some insight into something I might be unaware of. Please do share.



I completely understand why you take this stance.

But you do acknowledge that over representation of hetero IRBW and under representation of hetero IRBM in the media plays into the hands of white male patriarchal hegemony pushed onto our community, though right? Would it at least fair if we had more healthy, virtuous, admirable hetero black male love interest whether intra or interracial to counter act that? Why not have hetero IRBM represented proportionally to their numbers in real life or even AT LEAST the same amount as hetero IRBW in films?

No problem. I love mature and respectful threads.

Issa Rae, Amanda Seales are both actors and have interest in making money and making sure they are able to get it. They don't represent Black women -- and both have a parent or parents who are not Black American. Amanda is Caribbean and Issa's father is African.

Also, co-signing online is not real life -- we have to stop thinking online represents what real Black people think.

But, what I don't understand is how black women can neglect black female lgbt representation, and then turn around and push so hard for black male lgbt representation, and shame black men as homophobics for not accepting every single contrived, distorted version of it handed to us by black women or white men in the media.

I can't help you with this. I don't see a push - you see what you want. If you want to see a push - you will think this. I don't see it - in Black women spaces.

But you do acknowledge that over representation of hetero IRBW and under representation of hetero IRBM in the media plays into the hands of white male patriarchal hegemony pushed onto our community, though right? Would it at least fair if we had more healthy, virtuous, admirable hetero black male love interest whether intra or interracial to counter act that? Why not have hetero IRBM represented proportionally to their numbers in real life or even AT LEAST the same amount as hetero IRBW in films?

I really don't care about either. I think we need to continue to highlight and support the love and representation of BM and BW.

 

[TNOT]

Excellent point.

Twitter and message board discourse is not a great way to gauge black peoples feelings.

A Lot of mirroring going on, that doesn't carry over to real world situations

 

[Supper]

Issa Rae, Amanda Seales are both actors and have interest in making money and making sure they are able to get it. They don't represent Black women -- and both have a parent or parents who are not Black American. Amanda is Caribbean and Issa's father is African.

I gotta hand it to you. THIS I didn't know. Still I can't overlook the amount of support from African-American women that they receive.

(I wonder if you ladies take guy's like Tommy Sotomayor's Panamanian heritage into account when citing him as a representative of black/AA men lol)

I can't help you with this. I don't see a push - you see what you want. If you want to see a push - you will think this. I don't see it - in Black women spaces.

lol I'm almost tempted to start quoting and tagging black female users from the other thread who were very ardent in their attacks and shaming of black men as homophobic for not supposedly not supporting black male lgbt in films enough. One even went as far as saying that this is the reason black men deserved to be called the "white people of the black community" meanwhile that same chick is an apologist for white males and white male patriarchal hegemony in the form of heterosexual BW/WM representation in film.

I really don't care about either. I think we need to continue to highlight and support the love and representation of BM and BW.

Maybe I should present the question a different way.

If you had to, just for the sake of discussion, theorize a reason as to why hetero IRBW in film is so over represented while hetero IRBM is under represented what would it be, IYO?

 

[xoxodede]

I gotta hand it to you. THIS I didn't know. Still I can't overlook the support from African-American women that they receive.

(I wonder if you guys take guy's like Tommy Sotomayor's Panamanian heritage into account when citing him as a representative of black/AA men lol)



I'm almost tempted to start quoting and tagging black female users from the other thread who were very ardent in their attacks and shaming of black men as homophobic for not supposedly not supporting black male lgbt in films enough. One even went as far as saying that this is the reason we deserved to be called the "white people of the black community" meanwhile that same chick is an apologist for white males and white male patriarchal hegemony in the form of heterosexual BW/WM representation in film.






Maybe I should present the question a different way.

If you had to, just for the sake of discussion, theorize a reason as to why hetero IRBW in film is so over represented while hetero IRBM is under represented what would it be, IYO?

The support they receive is because we are just happy to see Black women and Black men get some shine. Especially, a show representing all shades of Black. Also, Black Americans tend to group everyone under the Black/AA umbrella - even when it's not in our best interest alot of times.

And yes - I always take that in account for all forms of media. I can tell what is created by Black american who is DOS when looking at art/creative outlets/images/art-form. I also can pick up when it's not.

I'm almost tempted to start quoting and tagging black female users from the other thread who were very ardent in their attacks and shaming of black men as homophobic for not supposedly not supporting black male lgbt in films enough. One even went as far as saying that this is the reason we deserved to be called the "white people of the black community" meanwhile that same chick is an apologist for white males and white male patriarchal hegemony in the form of heterosexual BW/WM representation in film.

Feel free, but again it's online. I think BW and BM have a issue with someone calling LGTQ derogatory names -- but they are not super supportive of seeing it on tv and art forms to represent Black people - especially when we are trying to just get accurate representation first.

A lot of time when BM make comments they are derogatory as hell - they can't just say nah - i'm not cool with this. They throw in unnecessary slurs and terms -- and all that is not needed to disapprove of something.

If you had to, just for the sake of discussion, theorize a reason as to why hetero IRBW in film is so over represented while hetero IRBM is under represented what would it be, IYO?

To antagonize BM and weaken BM/BW relationships.

 

[Blessings]

subs for later

 

[Supper]

The support they receive is because we are just happy to see Black women and Black men get some shine. Especially, a show representing all shades of Black. Also, Black Americans tend to group everyone under the Black/AA umbrella - even when it's not in our best interest alot of times.

And yes - I always take that in account for all forms of media. I can tell what is created by Black american who is DOS when looking at art/creative outlets/images/art-form. I also can pick up when it's not.

I meant support for them on those particular issues or projects that they put out, not just them or their work in general.

Feel free, but again it's online. I think BW and BM have a issue with someone calling LGTQ derogatory names -- but they are not super supportive of seeing it on tv and art forms to represent Black people - especially when we are trying to just get accurate representation first.

A lot of time when BM make comments they are derogatory as hell - they can't just say nah - i'm not cool with this. They throw in unnecessary slurs and terms -- and all that is not needed to disapprove of something.

The thing is, that the black men in the thread disputing Amanda Seales weren't using pejorative slurs or attacking homosexual individual. They were disputing the idea that just because black men take issue with the way homosexuality is used to distort our image in an effeminzing and humiliating manner in the mass media that it means that we're homophobic.

But, even if they did take issue with bigoted slurs, then why not make THAT the point of contention, instead of using it as an intellectual justification to push acceptance of any and every black male homosexual representation in the media. They are two VERY different issues that shouldn't be conflated.

I'd be like me say that because there's black women who use slurs like "dyke bytch" or "bedbuck/c00n" that means, black women are homophobic and racial-misandrist, and we should shove black female lgbt and hetero IRBM couplings down black women's throat as a way to bully them into accepting it, as punishment for using those slurs?

If you had to, just for the sake of discussion, theorize a reason as to why hetero IRBW in film is so over represented while hetero IRBM is under represented what would it be, IYO?

To antagonize BM and weaken BM/BW relationships.

Ahh, so the hetero interracial disparity IS detrimental to BM/BW relationships, probably because it sows the seeds of resentment and distrust, particularly when we see many black women celebrating and pushing for the FURTHERING of the unfair hetero interracial disparity in film at black men's expense, right? So, would the solution not be to campaign for the increase hetero IRBM representation and decrease of hetero IRBW representation down to more equitable levels to clear up that imbalance that causes so many issues.

 

[SupremexKing]

Oh, trust me. I was never one to tug at the jeans of mainstream hollywood, and beg them for more representation of black people/men. In fact I'd rather them NOT have them in control of the black male image in the mass media for them to malign, humiliate, & distort as they please, and then call that "diverse representation". Better for them to leave black men/boys out of their works altogether, and we focus on building our own entertainment/news media to represent us. I'll leave the mainstream begging up to black women.

I'm just tired of this issue of lgbt representation being used as a weapon for black women to attack and shame us with, while they neglect black female lgbt, and prance up & down for black female heterosexual interracialism. It's almost as if they want us, black men solely, to shoulder the burden of lgbt representation, while they enjoy the table scraps white male patriarchal hegemony via heterosexual IR black female representation, and they need to be called out on it.

like someone else said, they're just fighting for a better position in the system of white supremacy

 

[xoxodede]

Ahh, so the hetero interracial disparity IS detrimental to BM/BW relationships, probably because it sows the seeds of resentment and distrust, particularly when we see many black women celebrating and pushing for the FURTHERING of the unfair hetero interracial disparity in film at black men's expense, right? So, would the solution not be to campaign increase hetero IRBM representation and decrease of hetero IRBW representation down to more equitable levels to clear up that imbalance that causes so many issues.

I don't know. I am one woman and I don't watch either. But, to me I would think betrayal - not resentment or distrust. But, I find it weird cause BW and WM relationships in media is almost like they are trying to rewrite or re-tale a disgusting demonic history of which BW were assaulted and raped by WM for hundreds of years in the U.S.

BM and WW relationships (most) had agency --- of agreeing to sex with with each other. This was not how BW/WM were.

They are trying to rewrite their story in media making them (WM) this good guy when they are far from it.

 

[Supper]

I don't know. I am one woman and I don't watch either. But, to me I would think betrayal - not resentment or distrust. But, I find it weird cause BW and WW relationships in media is almost like they are trying to rewrite or re-tale a disgusting demonic history of which BW were assaulted and raped by WM for hundreds of years in the U.S.

BM and WW relationships (most) had agency --- of agreeing to sex with with eachother. This was not how BW/WM were.

They are trying to rewrite their story in media making them (WM) this good guy when they are far from it.

I agree that gaslighting and covering up their horrific crimes in the past AND present, may be an element as to why the mass media portrays black women with white male love interest so much in film. But, I think much of it just boils down to classic good ol' white boy narcissism of living out their fantasies of having access to any and every woman they desire, especially non-white women, while their own white women only have eyes for them. Because to be fair it's the same with white males and all ethnic women in the media. Those types of couples vastly outnumber those involving white women and ethnic men in the white male-dominated TV and movie industry.

Here's more on the blatant attempt of the white male-dominated media at advertising white men to non-white women, while shielding white women from non-white men, especially black men, by clutch magazine no less.
http://clutchmagonline.com/2013/09/women-color-allowed-white-love-interests-network-tv/
(I think the site may be down right now.)

 

[xoxodede]

I agree that gaslighting and covering up their horrific crimes in the past AND present, may be an element as to why the mass media portrays black women with white male love interest so much in film. But, I think much of it just boils down to classic good ol' white boy narcissism of living out their fantasies of having access to any and every woman they desire, especially non-white women, while their own white women only have eyes for them. Because to be fair it's the same with white males and all ethnic women in the media. Those types of couples vastly outnumber those involving white women and ethnic men in the white male-dominated TV and movie industry.

Here's more on the blatant attempt of the white male-dominated media at advertising white men to non-white women, while shielding white women from non-white men, especially black men, by clutch magazine no less.
http://clutchmagonline.com/2013/09/women-color-allowed-white-love-interests-network-tv/
(I think the site may be down right now.)

Clutch is not like that. They are updating the server. They also have a host of writers - it's not representative of all BW.

 

[Draje]

Good topic. People think I'm a feminist and I kiss black female Ass but I just like to point out shytty logic and hypocrisy.

Good points, actual logic, and an actual attempt to have a dialogue gets rep from me