Does anyone else feel like solo comic book films are suffering from having universe building?

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Lets go down the list of shows people talk about as some of the greatest in recent history.

The Wire
The Walking Dead
The Sopranos
Breaking Bad
Mad Men
Sons of Anarchy
American Horror Story
Band of Brothers
Game of Thrones
True Detective

Its a clear pattern there, and those shows really catch the eye of the prime younger demographic. There are very few new hit episodic shows hitting the airwaves and the ones that remain popular like NCIS have a pretty substantial older viewing demographic.

Those are all dramas though.

There's drama in superhero stories but superheroes also aren't high drama. The allure was witnessing them in their weekly adventures.

There's enough depth or character for Daredevil to compete with The Wire or The Sopranos. You can try but if you want that kind of stuff there are better shows with better drama. Again to me it feels apologetic.
 

AnonymityX1000

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They are. Why else their animated shows and best storyline are among literature?

I'm objective as hell and said that BvS is a 7.5 out of 10 and talk about the few editing flaws That hampered the film.

You go around and say that Ironman 3 is a good film. :bryan:
"Why else their animated shows and best storyline are among literature?" :dahell: What are you even trying to say here?! Animation is not literature.

Ironman 3 made billion dollars + and most critics liked it. BatsvSupes did neither. Who looks more objective really?
 

Wild self

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"Why else their animated shows and best storyline are among literature?" :dahell: What are you even trying to say here?! Animation is not literature.

Ironman 3 made billion dollars + and most critics liked it. BatsvSupes did neither. Who looks more objective really?

Ironman 3, you said, is a good film. :dead:

Not even the MCU stans can say that with a straight face. You just hate DC so much, that you accept any crap from another company.
 

Wild self

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"Why else their animated shows and best storyline are among literature?" :dahell: What are you even trying to say here?! Animation is not literature.

Ironman 3 made billion dollars + and most critics liked it. BatsvSupes did neither. Who looks more objective really?

Ironman 3, you said, is a good film. :dead:

Not even the MCU stans can say that with a straight face. You just hate DC so much, that you accept any crap from another company.
 

wire28

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aside from being a veiled shot at MCU, this thread is hilarity being that universe building is the reason why the comic book genre is thriving in film right now when it was on life support before Marvel made it hot to universe build again (before @Prodigal Syndicate brings up Universal doing it decades ago)


They are. Why else their animated shows and best storyline are among literature?

I'm objective as hell and said that BvS is a 7.5 out of 10 and talk about the few editing flaws That hampered the film.

You go around and say that Ironman 3 is a good film. :bryan:
be "objective as hell" but get offended when people critique BvS, brehs
Ironman 3, you said, is a good film. :dead:

Not even the MCU stans can say that with a straight face. You just hate DC so much, that you accept any crap from another company.
the general audience says other wise. but keep on hating :salute:

the only people that think it sucks are random dudes on a sub forum of a hip hop messageboard. the majority of other people enjoyed themselves

He means the movies are following the format of a serialized TV show.

Why do you think these movies are categorised and broken down into "phases" i.e. "Phase 1" in the first place?. It's just another of way of saying "Season X".

There's no difference between Daredevil Season 1 and "Phase 1" of the movies other than the scale and number of main characters (1 v 4). Both operated as long continuous storylines to an eventual ending/conclusion over multiple episodes.
i think/hope he is just being intentionally obtuse
 

BXKingPin82

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aside from being a veiled shot at MCU, this thread is hilarity being that universe building is the reason why the comic book genre is thriving in film right now when it was on life support before Marvel made it hot to universe build again (before @Prodigal Syndicate brings up Universal doing it decades ago)



be "objective as hell" but get offended when people critique BvS, brehs

the general audience says other wise. but keep on hating :salute:

the only people that think it sucks are random dudes on a sub forum of a hip hop messageboard. the majority of other people enjoyed themselves
:mjlol:
 

lutha

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i disagree...they are trying to treat the movies like the comics, with the connection, entwined stories, etc. which is a beautiful thing...and with all the tangling they do, each movie can still be a self contained story that focuses on a specific character, just like the comics, which so far the movies have done...they just taking different approaches:

marvel is building up to the 'big event' that we know is going to happen...so while the individual movies focus on said character, they still tie them to that event that's yet to come....

dc is doing the 'big event' first and we'll see the fallout from said event in the individual movies...

fox is doing a mix of both...in fact, fox is doing exactly what you're asking for.....they treat each x-men movie like it's a 'big event' and the next movie is the continuation in that universe....and the side movies (wolvie movies), have been all self-contained stories....we'll see if and how their approach changes with the success of deadpool....i say that cause besides wolvie, the x-men dont have the solo star they can put out there like that, that's why fox promotes the x-men as a group & explains how they've treated the movies...deadpool now gives them another character outside the x-men name to play with...so we'll see what they do....

the issue i think you and others are having with it is knowing the end game already....yall already know 'infinity wars' is coming, so yall want to get to it...same with bvs..we know it's the prelude to jl, so people are like 'fukk it, just give me jl' already....while i understand why marvel/wb announced the future movies, i think in the future they not going to do that cause people are impatient...and instead of enjoying the ride, they gonna want to skip to the end....
 

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IMO, the only MCU film truly hurt by universe building is IM2
 

lutha

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It'll be interesting to see how WB tackles this since they're moving backwards and having most of the solo films after the team-up movie.

they're not moving backwards though...they are following the comics, just like marvel is following their comics...
 

lutha

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I'm talking about compared to Marvel, who made solo films before the team-up movie.

i understood that, was just saying that both studios are following their respective comics and how it tends to go in those, so it's not doing it backwards...they doing what we want them to do: stick to the source material...
 

Won Won

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I'm objective as hell

Brendan-Fraser-chuffed-clap-clapping-good-one-happy-laughing-LOL-spazzing-GIF.gif
 

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I don't think so. I think the influence of the others in the shared universe is exaggerated. Maybe the genre is starting to become stale to the casual. In general, I just don't feel like these movies are solely resting upon the shared universe. They are mostly contained stories with easter eggs, and but following their sequel format. The only one you can honestly say it rested upon the others was Civil War and this was shot more as a direct sequel to AOU. Actually it's only been the Avengers movies that are movie + set-up...and even the set-up is a 5 sec teaser. Plus, it's not like they're shoe-horning it. It at least feels organic...like the JL/Static Shock or Looney Tunes, Hanna Barbara.

Thor & Dark World were self-contained, Guardians, Ant-Man, Incredible, 1st Avenger (tells you right there that Cap movies will be Avenger movies), the TV shows were all self-contained with only nods to the others. Iron Man 2 I'll give you, but 3 wasn't. And the Avenger movies only rely upon the other Avenger movies, as sequels do. I do think it was forced in Bats vs Supes, though, and that's been the exception. But overall, I think they are self contained enough, with just a little to keep you interested for the next.

Shared universes aren't anything new. The whole Miller-Boyett TV was a shared universe, and Norman Lear's shows
 

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*Leave the stanning at the door*

This isn't about fox or marvel or DC.

From ASM2,to BVS to CW,all these comic films can't just be a self contained story anymore. They have to be something more.

But is it hurting the film's? Are they just becoming gimmicks?

I think so.

If you look at comics as a medium most of the greatest stories are self contained within their own hero's universe. But in film that's seemingly gone out the window. With Deadpools success I Garauntee fox has taken notice and once Singer leaves will be shoehorning in characters for the sole purpose of spin offs. Cough gambit cough.

It's not enough anymore just to be about the story and the hero. It has to contain other hero's and it has to be building towards something. It has taken all the suspense out of these films when you have the next 5 years laid out. They're now announcing which hero's are making appearances in each other's films years before. Before they even give you an idea of the plot.

I've said before that I enjoy having x men as its own franchise,and that most of the best spidey stories are self contained.

Stories can't even breath anymore. They've just become bridges to set pieces and the next film. There's few if any consequences just as a sneak peak to the next film.

Maybe it's just me. But. It's why after finishing DD season 2 I can firmly say that Marvel's Netflix shows are by far the best comic stories happening right now.

Thoughts?

Studios are carbon copying Marvel.

Marvels movies tie together but it's subtle.

They all have their own themes and stories.

And they've done it for so long to the point you care about the connections. And after 13 movies they have needed to do any reboots.

Marvels success has ushered in a new wave of carbon copy ass studios. But at the end of the day, the fans and critics will ultimately decided. This year has been a moment of truth.
 
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Naw. We live in an era where we can see Black Panther kicking Captain America's Ass while Spider-Man zips through the sky battling Giant Man. That's Godbody shyt right there:banderas:

Like anything in film, when it's done RIGHT it's amazing but when it's done wrong it's terrible. Sony trying to make an expanded universe using the goddamn Sinister Six is a disaster waiting. To happen, and they KNEW it that's why they took the "Can't beat em so join em" route and joined forces with Marvel.

Fox could've had a nice expanded universe set up if they weren't total and utter jackasses and fukked up Fantastic Four. Those ass clowns made Galactus a cloud....fukking GALACTUS:wtf: they had THREE GOODAMN ATTEMPTS and STILL fukked up on Doom, the second most popular Marvel villain of all time:snoop:


DC fukked up by making a subpar Batman Vs Superman movie, with the WORST depiction of Lex Luther ever put to film and the flimsiest reconciliation of two battling heroes ever put to film. They can still recover given that Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman are hits
 
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