"Death to the Pessimistic State of Mind" - Nas Voice: NYK '23 Pre-Season Thread

[ISO]

Lotta the analytical heads rooting for Hartenstein to take the starting spot

 

[ISO]

This really needs to be repeated. Utah and the Thunder have more picks than the Knicks. The Knicks can’t outbid either of them and Booker is worth it. It would have to be for a mix of young players and picks and that doesn’t really make sense either because the Knicks don’t have that market locked down either. If a mixed package was needed for Booker a team like the Pelicans could make the same offer but throw Zion or Ingram in with a bunch of picks.

The only way the Knicks have a chance at Booker is the kids all build up their value AND get bigger contracts because the next time Booker can be traded his contract is 50 Mil a year.

It’s wild to me that Booker is the worth it but Mitchell isn’t just because he’s 6’5?

If you wouldn’t do it for Mitchell, you shouldn’t do it for Booker.

Before CP3, Booker’s TO’s was among the league leaders and he was a bad defender before Monty came over with his schemes and they added these defensive oriented role players around him.

Mitchell applies more rim pressure and doesn’t turn the ball over despite heavy on ball usage and shot creation duties.

 

[Peter Popoff]

Lotta the analytical heads rooting for Hartenstein to take the starting spot

I went back and looked at a few of his games and I can see that. He has a few metrics which would help the offense especially with assistance from Brunson.

 

[Peter Popoff]

It’s wild to me that Booker is the worth it but Mitchell isn’t just because he’s 6’5?

If you wouldn’t do it for Mitchell, you shouldn’t do it for Booker.

Before CP3, Booker’s TO’s was among the league leaders and he was a bad defender before Monty came over with his schemes and they added these defensive oriented role players around him.

Mitchell applies more rim pressure and doesn’t turn the ball over despite heavy on ball usage and shot creation duties.

I would've given up any guard, center, plus Randle for Mitchell. Toppin would've been off the table. It's all about surrounding them with the right pieces and Utah would've fukked up the algorithm putting them in a fukked up situation that relied heavily on Brunson/Mitchell with no future.

 

[TOAD99]

I went back and looked at a few of his games and I can see that. He has a few metrics which would help the offense especially with assistance from Brunson.

His ability to pass the ball and shoot the 3 will be a nice wrinkle in our offense

We need thibs to hire an offensive coordinator in order to maximize each player’s strengths

 

[seemorecizzy]

Devin Booker is not better than Donovan Mitchell.

The two headed snake of Brunson and Mitchell specifically the way those two attack to me could have blitzed teams.

if steph and steve francis didn't work,
i don't see how mitchell and brunson would work.
mitchell makes sense if we didnt get brunson,
we would get destroyed on defense.



not to mention there is only 1 ball, and randle aint losin his touches to 2 midget newbies. even worse if we kept RJ in the deal cause he aint passin either lmao

 

[ISO]

if steph and steve francis didn't work,
i don't see how mitchell and brunson would work.
mitchell makes sense if we didnt get brunson,
we would get destroyed on defense.



not to mention there is only 1 ball, and randle aint losin his touches to 2 midget newbies. even worse if we kept RJ in the deal cause he aint passin either lmao

Them nikkas was on the verge of washing out the league and were never team guys and that was a different era today there’s multiple teams that run small backcourts. Knicks fans have to let go of the past whether it’s Marbury or Melo.

We have 48 minutes of rim protection and a defensive coach in Thibs I’m sure that backcourt size could be covered for.

Booker has improved defensively but so has the scheme and personnel around him at one point even being 6’5 he was a bottom tier defender in the league. Like Barrett and Randle he is a ball watcher who doesn’t generate many deflections or steals.

If we didn’t give up the haul for Mitchell, we shouldn’t do it for Booker.

 

[ProlificLurker]

I remember there was a rumor years ago while Phil was still President/GM that the Knicks were interested in swapping KP for Booker.

There were fears that due to KP's body composition that he would be injury prone for much of his career. Like a few months after that rumor circulated KP blow out his knee and the rest is history


I type all that to say this, we missed the boat on Booker years ago. Too late now.

The Mitchell saga is over, we couldn't get a deal done, mainly because Danny Ainge and Utah were acting in bad faith.

What we have is what we have, let's move on already!

 

[firemanBk]

if steph and steve francis didn't work,
i don't see how mitchell and brunson would work.
mitchell makes sense if we didnt get brunson,
we would get destroyed on defense.



not to mention there is only 1 ball, and randle aint losin his touches to 2 midget newbies. even worse if we kept RJ in the deal cause he aint passin either lmao

Steve Francis didn't even play a full season worth of games in his entire career after he got traded to the Knicks I swear some of you come up with the most bullshyt arguments
Booker did fukk all with the Suns before he got hooked up with a HoF PG that makes every team he goes to better

I can't imagine the amount of ammo some of you would try with Spida if he was on a team that was in the bottom tier of the league his first 4 seasons while he's putting up all star numbers

 

[Wargames]

It’s wild to me that Booker is the worth it but Mitchell isn’t just because he’s 6’5?

If you wouldn’t do it for Mitchell, you shouldn’t do it for Booker.

Before CP3, Booker’s TO’s was among the league leaders and he was a bad defender before Monty came over with his schemes and they added these defensive oriented role players around him.

Mitchell applies more rim pressure and doesn’t turn the ball over despite heavy on ball usage and shot creation duties.

So you’re going to waive away “short back court” issues and “a NBA first team” appearance, and Booker’s NBA Final run, and Olympic and all the other ways Booker has separated himself from the level Mitchell is on to try and make a point?

Spoiler

 

[ISO]

So you’re going to waive away “short back court” issues and “a NBA first team” appearance, and Booker’s NBA Final run, and Olympic and all the other ways Booker has separated himself from the level Mitchell is on to try and make a point?

Spoiler

Using circumstantial team accomplishments

Bro said the Olympics

 

[firemanBk]

I mean we've literally seen what Booker can accomplish without one of the best PG of all time by his side and that's first class tickets to lottery year after year

 

[Wargames]

Using circumstantial team accomplishments

Bro said the Olympics

Honestly I don’t even care enough about this rumor to go back and forth with you on Booker v. Mitchell. I don’t even think Booker is coming to NY, because there isn’t a way to get him that another team won’t just outbid the Knicks. I do think he would be a better piece to have in combination of Randle/Brunson or Brunson/RJ because he isn’t a midget backcourt. The only reason Mitchell was available was less teams had assets and the ones that did considered him small for SG.

It’s that simple. If Ainge had come to NY before they did all that work to get Brunson, Mitchell would be a knick and they would have got a different PG.


I do think the Knicks are going to trade Fournier and draft assets for one of Jerami Grant, Kuzma, or Harrison Barnes. Not even Wiggins because he will cost more than the prior three and mess up their long term maneuverability.

The conservative move (aka what this current Knicks FO stays doing) is for them to get another solid piece on an affordable long contract to go over the cap with this year before the cap goes up. If they can get all the current kids on slight overpay deals that age well based on future production or decrease overtime. They may actually be able to trade for a star without gutting the team later.

Also have a competitive team (treadmill team) outside of the luxury tax makes Dolan money every playoffs while maintaining the leeway to shed salaries if a star does decide to come in FA. I think based on the next few FA class and the salary cap raising that will be the move they go for unless a star demands to play for the Knicks. The Knicks have enough youth being a treadmill team isn’t a bad idea. The experience will pay off when the kids are in their prime and a lot of the better teams right now or exiting their own primes.

 

[Youhadasparkwhenustarted]

Last year was the first time Booker was on the same level as Spida imo. Switch Booker with Spida on those Suns teams and they don't lose a step, they'd probably be a slightly better team actually. Booker can't carry a team like Mitchell can, and we'd kill that man the moment he starts to fail to do so here. Spida is underrated while Booker is pretty overrated atp.

Let's just focus on development. In all likelihood a player as good as Mitchell isn't becoming available anytime soon, and if he does would he even want to play here? Is that player gonna cost more than Mitchell? Is he even gonna be as good as Mitchell is? I'm sorry but that Mitchell trade is gonna be the benchmark on how I gauge trades from here on, and I'm not giving up the farm for a guy that couldn't lead his team to a winning record before an All-Time pg helped him out.

 

[ISO]