Inspect Her Deck
Skins of all colours come together as brothers
ODB's album can definitely be debated altho for me there's no question.
The first 2 Wu albums must be set in stone, there's no reason to argue against them.
Classics Discussion: Wu-Tang Clan & Ol' Dirty b*stard
- Thread starter Inspect Her Deck
- Start date
ODB's album can definitely be debated altho for me there's no question.
The first 2 Wu albums must be set in stone, there's no reason to argue against them.
Wu-tang are not polished. That's a massive aspect of their appeal and even hip hop in general. You add polish and you kill the vibe. Polish in general kills soul. and I'd argue that Wu as a whole are some of the most soulful rappers ever.
M.E.T.H.O.D Man is better than ANY track on Wu Forever. Better beat, more personality, catchier and more memorable rhymes... (Fading mothafukkas like bleach! -- That shyt had me
back in the day. It's still a fantastic simile)shytty sounding? How exactly does a gritty aesthetic wear off when it's the founding aspect of this whole hip hop shyt? Grit defines hip hop.
Da Mystery of Chessboxin is also better than most tracks on Forever.
Forever marked the fall-off of the Wu. and listening to it in retrospect, it's easy to see why. That's why Ghost had to take it back to the rawness with Supreme Clientele, and we mark it today as one of the best rap albums ever made.
so you're saying the content on Wu Forever is more diverse? can you provide receipts?
And even if it were more diverse, that's good and I can give a point for that but not much more than that.
It's not that subjective anymore. It's been 20+ years since 36 came out. There is a noticeable consensus that says 36 is better than Forever. And it's not a forced consensus. It came about naturally.
what are peak tracks on Wu Forever and AEOM?
Inspect Her Deck
Skins of all colours come together as brothers
Wu-tang are not polished. That's a massive aspect of their appeal and even hip hop in general. You add polish and you kill the vibe. Polish in general kills soul. and I'd argue that Wu as a whole are some of the most soulful rappers ever.
M.E.T.H.O.D Man is better than ANY track on Wu Forever. Better beat, more personality, catchier and more memorable rhymes... (Fading mothafukkas like bleach! -- That shyt had me
shytty sounding? How exactly does a gritty aesthetic wear off when it's the founding aspect of this whole hip hop shyt? Grit defines hip hop.
Da Mystery of Chessboxin is also better than most tracks on Forever.
Forever marked the fall-off of the Wu. and listening to it in retrospect, it's easy to see why. That's why Ghost had to take it back to the rawness with Supreme Clientele, and we mark it today as one of the best rap albums ever made.
so you're saying the content on Wu Forever is more diverse? can you provide receipts?
And even if it were more diverse, that's good and I can give a point for that but not much more than that.
It's not that subjective anymore. It's been 20+ years since 36 came out. There is a noticeable consensus that says 36 is better than Forever. And it's not a forced consensus. It came about naturally.
what are peak tracks on Wu Forever and AEOM?
Not super polished, but more polished. Plus what's wrong with the group evolving and expanding their sound? Yes, of course, we all love that gritty lo-fi shyt but tbh man you sound like one of those fans reluctant to let go of 36 Chambers, and won't accept a different sound. Wu Forever isn't A Better Tomorrow (album) level of fukkery. It still had a gritty undertone and some songs straight up sound like 36 Chambers extras e.g. Deadly Melody.
You gonna pretend that OB4CL was 36 Chambers level of gritty? Hell nah. Ironman was smooth and soulful as fukk. You don't complain about those. Wu was just the culmination of all these things into a grander sound that OB4CL and Ironman were working towards. Then you STILL had the grungy shyt like ODB and Meth solos and GZA has a perfect marriage of both avenues, but mainly the gritty and dark sound of 36.
Na bruh grit doesn't define hip-hop, it defines a section of hip-hop. Let's just erase ATCQ, De La Soul and all them from the history books then, right?
Forever wasn't the fall-off. It was everything after RZA's 5-year plan that was poor in comparison, especially Bobby Digital shyt, Tical 2000 (good stuff but not nearly to THAT level of 93-97 Wu material) etc. UNTIL Supreme Clientele came out, and truth be told Ghost has carried the name on his back ever since.
Wu Forever has not necessarily more DIVERSE stuff, but the ratio of brag/other songs is more equal than on 36.
So let's say CREAM, Can It Be and Tearz are the 'focused/non-brag/battle' songs of sort (loose term but you know what I mean). Forever has Older Gods, Maria, Impossible, A Better Tomorrow, Bells of War, The M.G.M., The City, The Projects etc. That's also to be expected with a double album of more tracks mind you, but it remains true regardless.
It is subjective. That 36 is a better album is down to the impact it made, the reception it got, the appreciation for production that gave the Wu a certain appeal and character, the whole 9 MC's (we've never seen this before) shyt. Plus not to mention, it has NO filler that is even questionable because every track bangs and is close to perfect. Wu Forever is a double album, immediately sets it as a disadvantage.
Now in terms of ranking tracks, when I get to the library soon I'll do a tier list of Wu Forever tracks, just so you get an idea of what I'm thinking and how it compares to AEOM.
African Peasant
Veteran
@patscorpio no fukking kidding bruh, especially about RZA on Wu Forever
on arguably one of the best constructed songs of all time, A Better Tomorrow, he probably had the best verse
Y'all bytches love dances, and pulling down your pants
While your man's on tour, your spending up his advances
Your friends ain't shyt, all they do is drink, smoke, and suck dikk
The whole projects is trapped in stench
You either high school drop-outs, one to three cop-outs
Fifteen years old, shorty ass and top out
Ninety-nine cent beer drinking p*ssy stinking
fukking so much your ass and titties start shrinking
New World Order slave trade, minimum wage, Medicaid
Can a devil fool a Muslim nowadays
Inside my lab, I'm going mad
Took two drags off theblunts, and started breaking down the flag
The blue is for the Crips, the red is for the Bloods
The whites for the cops, and the stars come from the clubs
Or the slugs that ignites, through the night, by the dawn
Early light,why is sons fighting for the stripe
The energy's not there. It's not just polish. Those RZA beats don't have that captivating, off-kilter energy Wu are known for.
Respectfully, that Deadly Melody beat is trash. Listen to that and compare it to "What The Blood Clot" and "Shimmy Shimmy Ya", the classic RZA with the offtune piano sound. It ain't even close. The rhythm, drums, the energy...
It was. Just in a different way. In fact, what makes OB4CL, LS and SC so brilliant is that they come from that gritty school set up by 36 Chambers. Just expanded into different 'realms'. OB4CL is cinematic, sad and more orchestral.... LS is more reflective and ambient and SC is 80s old-school party vibe shyt. Mighty Healthy is the son of Divine Force Holy War type shyt.
It absolutely defines all of hip hop. We have a history of people trying to water hip hop down and claim some alternative shyt is also hip hop, and sometimes, 'better than the real shyt.' Nah bruh. Without grit, there is no hip hop.
Look at how Kurtis Blow defines hip hop. Hip hop is mutated soul/funk/disco. Raw shyt.
http://www.thecoli.com/threads/the-beat-is-the-foundation-of-hip-hop-ask-kurtis-blow.395948/
breh... they were raw.
They fit right in with the Wu, Mobb Deep, Nas, Rakim, etc. They just had their own wavelength. I'm not saying you have to be super raw all the time. That shyt gets played out. But there has to be rawness there, period. I saw Premo about 2 months ago, and he played this De La joint. and he specifically said: "you know what I love about De La? They were positive and all, but they were raw."
Raw doesn't mean violent, either. It's a feeling. There's very little feeling in Wu Forever, especially on the production side. It might have been a technical triumph for RZA but people forget that hip hop, and I'd argue Black music by extension, is not really about technical shyt. It's about feeling. We use technical shyt to enhance the feeling, to serve the song. Not the other way round.
I think we should do a poll on this. Forever is definitely the fall-off imo. Is it really a coincidence that people stopped giving a fukk about the Wu right after that?
Looking forward to it breh
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That was one of the songs that radio got before release date. I remember catching it one time (in the middle of the day mind you) and being blown away.
criminology
hearse initiator
ODBs debuts impact was huge. He took the crazy fun hip hop clown style and laced it with dust and mental illness. At the time the widest range of people liked that album. It's got fun tracks about raw sex and dark 
shyt like snakes and rawhide. It's the best example that a classic album doesn't have to be perfect.
shyt like snakes and rawhide. It's the best example that a classic album doesn't have to be perfect.
ODBs debuts impact was huge. He took the crazy fun hip hop clown style and laced it with dust and mental illness. At the time the widest range of people liked that album. It's got fun tracks about raw sex and dark
receipts?
also, an album can make waves at a certain point in time and be forgotten 5 years later. Are people still bumping Return to 36 like that? I'm gonna say "nah" Shimmy Shimmy Ya and Brooklyn Zoo are super classics, but the other tracks might as well not exist.
@Inspect Her Deck , you're a dope poster and I love your classics threads but you consider N!gga Please a classic but not Stillmatic? 
He was@Inspect Her Deck , you're a dope poster and I love your classics threads but you consider N!gga Please a classic but not Stillmatic?
JayBaldacci
All Star
one true classic.
one arguable.
one arguable.
Which one is arguable?
roxxthe96er
Emcee
I got 36 Chambers tatted that's how confidant I am in that one lol
Inspect Her Deck
Skins of all colours come together as brothers
@Inspect Her Deck , you're a dope poster and I love your classics threads but you consider N!gga Please a classic but not Stillmatic?
lol you can see my actual poll votes, I was just playin!
