Cajuns And Creoles

[Poitier]

Not to mention sometimes people oddly downplay the influence of the hundreds of thousands of AA’s from the “old South” being force migrated into the region after the Louisiana purchase thus playing a major part in its cultural development. So something like Hoodoo gets attributed to Louisiana, when it really came out of the old Southeastern states.

Yup ''roots'' is practiced all over The South or at least during our grandparents time but is making a comeback.

 

[Sbp]

Creole in the islands and Creole in Louisiana does not mean the same thing.

These light brights in NOLA take that shyt serious. It's s way to separate themselves from black, even though they'll never admit it.

The younger generations are a lil different, you just got to live here to know what im talking about

Cajuns "real cajuns" trace their lineage to French speaking Canada. They were expelled and end up settling in South Louisiana. Cajuns werent respected by Anglo whites for a long time. An ol Cajun dude who grew up a long time ago told me "A c00nass and a black used to be looked at the same"

c00nass is a derogatory term, that they flipped, and now use it to refer to themselves.

In regards to Louisiana culture you have to look at new orleans as a island.
They don't listen to Zydeco in New Orleans
They don't second line in other parts of the state.

Cajun culture is basically all of south Louisiana, and a small part of central LA. Anything North of that might as well be Arkansas.

I will say this, our women are hands down the baddest I've seen with the exception of Cali. That's what really matters

Not one lie told fam

 

[Whogivesafuck]

Those trail rides seem interesting. I need to do research on the boucheries.

Trail rides are to preserve the history of creole cowboys and foster community. Louisiana cattle drives predate Texas,Kansas and Oklahoma. My family is originally from natchitoches La. It is the only place in Northern Louisiana that was francophone. It lost a lot of traditions after migration west to Texas and California and the expansion of the college.

 

[get these nets]

As a Louisiana Creole i think it's hilarious being analyzed like this lol

What is your take on the doc. that I posted above.? In fact I ask the question to anybody from that heritage.

I've noticed a lot of the non-AAs on this board, especially Islanders, have a weird and heavily misinformed view of AA history/culture. Its an interesting phenomena because AAs on this board do not reciprocate this odd interest.

A lot of stuff attributed to Louisiana and creoles don't even originate their but in other parts of the Deep South like Alabama/Mississippi, of course Lowcountry culture on the SE coast, and Haitian influence is minimal as most enslaved Africans from Louisiana came directly from Deep South ports.

Even the "white passing" phenotype wrongly associated with creoles is seen throughout the South with Boule/Jack+Jill types, melungeons, griffes, and lumbee peoples.

I think that we are all greatly uninformed about our own specific heritages, much less the histories of other Black folks. If you read topics about cultures here....this is pretty evident and NOT specific to one set of Blacks.
There are scholars and historians from each culture who have done work documenting roots,history, and culture of their people. We choose not to buy and read those books though. Those who are inclined to learn about themselves(and other Black people) will do so, but most won't.

I disagree with your point about cultural influences in LA. New Orleans is a port city...in fact was probably one of the largest ports in North America during slavery. Keep in mind

1) how long slavery existed in North america
2)the nature of the triangular slave trade
3)Louisiana territory was French territory until 1803

How can the Saint Domingue/Haiti influence be minimal in Louisiana when they were both French territory for over a century BEFORE the Louisiana Purchase?

 

[get these nets]

Boucherie must be a regional tradition because I always associated it with Cajuns and not Creoles.

 

[Poitier]

I think that we are all greatly uninformed about our own specific heritages, much less the histories of other Black folks. If you read topics about cultures here....this is pretty evident and NOT specific to one set of Blacks.

Difference being that I do not see AAs on here dictating conversations about say Maroon communities in Caribbean often with misinformation.

Not talking academics but just the dynamic on this forum.

I disagree with your point about cultural influences in LA. New Orleans is a port city...in fact was probably one of the largest ports in North America during slavery. Keep in mind

1) how long slavery existed in North america
2)the nature of the triangular slave trade
3)Louisiana territory was French territory until 1803

How can the Saint Domingue/Haiti influence be minimal in Louisiana when they were both French territory for over a century BEFORE the Louisiana Purchase?

This subject has been covered over and over again. Haitians have a connection to New Orleans, but it is not nearly as deep as people have been led to believe. Most Black people that ended up in New Orleans are descended from African Americans that were sold from plantations in the States of Virginia, North Carolina, Tennessee and Kentucky. That was called being sold "down the river" and it occurred when American slave owners expanded into the States of Mississippi and Louisiana mostly from the States of South Carolina, Alabama and Georgia. So those slave owners needed slaves to grow cotton and they mostly purchased slaves from plantations in the mid-south.

Cheapside Slave Auction Block | ExploreKYHistory
Slave trade in New Orleans was a thriving business

 

[Freedman]

Was in Lafayette last night for UL homecoming. So many red women

 

[get these nets]

Difference being that I do not see AAs on here dictating conversations about say Maroon communities in Caribbean often with misinformation.

Not talking academics but just the dynamic on this forum.

Thanks.
I have a long ignore list so I miss most of the tomfoolery that goes on here. I do recall seeing some threads about continental African topics and people making willfully ignorant comments there. I've read willfully ignorant comments by outsiders in topics about specific Black groups in all 3 directions.

If the @Akan comment was in this thread, going to respond to it .

 

[Poitier]

Thanks.
I have a long ignore list so I miss most of the tomfoolery that goes on here. I do recall seeing some threads about continental African topics and people making willfully ignorant comments there. I've read willfully ignorant comments by outsiders in topics about specific Black groups in all 3 directions.

If the @Akan comment was in this thread, going to respond to it .

The Akan quote is from another thread but stated what needed to be said succinctly.

And I'm not saying Haitian influence does't exist but it gets overblown precisely due to the French colonization of Louisiana.

Enslaved Black folk from the Islands were brought to various places in the South but the raw numbers were not high enough to leave some large genetic imprint.

And what if I told you the French influence in the States stretched much further than just Louisiana?

Boule and Melungeon (also called Atlantic creoles) are french-derived words for ffs and those are descriptors for folks in the mid Atlantic/NE/Appalachia.

There was also the "placage" system of miscegenation that stretched across the Southern coast.

That said, the overwhelmingly largest contributor to AA ancestry in LA/NOLA are Senegambia/Kongolese slaves who came from Deep South slave ports, not Beninese/Togolese Africans of which comprise the largest ancestry of Haitians.

 

[K.O.N.Y]

Originally they called all Blacks born in Louisiana creoles, Blacks not brought over from Africa or the islands, but born in Louisiana. Now Creole means having a mix of African, Native American and French Blood.

I'm from central Louisiana were there's a ton Creole and Cajun heritage. My girl is "Creole" with a the African, French and Native American lineage they can trace back to Old Louisiana. Most Louisianian have African, Indian and French blood and heritage, but our family didn't keep record or don't have the French Last name to trace the family roots. For some reason the last name is important, even thought you can have the bloodline and not the last name.


Cajun was always a culture to me. The way we talk, cook, our music, the lifestyle.

The whole french and cajun thing

Is simply a way for cacs to have access to Black LA/new orleans culture

To make them relevant in the conversation on some ancient egypt shyt

Particularly in Black LA cuisine and JAZZ

 

[R-Typ3]

I've been through almost every sub region of Louisiana and you speak the truth. I was in Shreveport this past April and it felt like North Texas a bit. The Casino Riverboat culture is the main thing that separated it from Texas. We went through Monroe and past grambling state also on our way to Dallas. The few times I've been to NO as a kid, it felt different too. Baton Rouge felt like a mix of both NO and Northern Louisiana. The "Bienvenue a Louisiana" state sign makes it feel like you're stepping into a whole new world all together the moment you crossover into Louisiana. Louisiana is such an interesting state. Folks speaking French and playing the accordian in the swamps. Folks in nola dancing with the casket of a loved one on their backs(they also do 2nd line funerals in Haiti and Africa. Those are NO's roots) little insular social clubs and fan clubs and creole communities. It's all very interesting and strange.

Crossing that bridge after Vicksburg MS is where it all starts..I wanna go back too

 

[get these nets]

The Akan quote is from another thread but stated what needed to be said succinctly.

And I'm not saying Haitian influence does't exist but it gets overblown precisely due to the French colonization of Louisiana.

Enslaved Black folk from the Islands were brought to various places in the South but the raw numbers were not high enough to leave some large genetic imprint.

And what if I told you the French influence in the States stretched much further than just Louisiana?

Boule and Melungeon (also called Atlantic creoles) are french-derived words for ffs and those are descriptors for folks in the mid Atlantic/NE/Appalachia.

There was also the "placage" system of miscegenation that stretched across the Southern coast.

That said, the overwhelmingly largest contributor to AA ancestry in LA/NOLA are Senegambia/Kongolese slaves who came from Deep South slave ports, not Beninese/Togolese Africans of which comprise the largest ancestry of Haitians.

Good post. I still disagree but to clarify.
The last link in your post (#66 post in the thread) seemed to confirm what I had assumed in an earlier post, the New Orleans was the largest port/slave market in North America.

As a port city, it follows logic that NO was an entry point for Africans brought into North America from the Caribbean and or slave ships. It makes more sense to believe that African arrived there and were brought inland to other parts of the territory and to mainland America..

Again Louisiana existed as French slave colony for over a century, and St Domingue was THE richest slave colony in the entire Western Hemisphere.

There was a distinct culture developed in SD with elements of different African ethnic & french parts.

There's no way that there wasn't tremendous cultural exchange between the African, mulatto and planter cultures between the French slave colonies in a hemisphere dominated by English and Spanish colonies.

Rape and race mixing occurred elsewhere of course but in French territories, there were at times legal distinctions and inheritance rights for mixed race people.I'm going to look up placage, but I'm not aware of US territory recognizing legal rights of mulattoes during slavery. Legally recognized and property owning freemen in the South seems to have been a distinctly French thing. (with perhaps exceptions here and there)

Finally..similar to how modern day Miami has been permanently influenced by the influx of white elite Cubans who fled Castro's revolution in Cuba over 50 years ago.....the hundreds ofFrench planters and mulattoes fleeing St.Domingue during the Haitian revolution with their servants and slaves to New Orleans has to have permanently influenced New Orleans.

 

[Poitier]

As a port city, it follows logic that NO was an entry point for Africans brought into North America from the Caribbean and or slave ships. It makes more sense to believe that African arrived there and were brought inland to other parts of the territory and to mainland America..

Again Louisiana existed as French slave colony for over a century, and St Domingue was THE richest slave colony in the entire Western Hemisphere.

Charleston, Savannah and Baltimore all had larger slave ports than NOLA.

And there was not a constant influx of enslaved Africans being brought into America. Unlike in the West Indies, the AA population grew by reproduction.

Once again, if you look at records it will show that most of the enslaved Africans in LA/NOLA were locally born or from Senegambia and Kongo not Benin or Togo like Haiti.

Rape and race mixing occurred elsewhere of course but in French territories, there were at times legal distinctions and inheritance rights for mixed race people.I'm going to look up placage, but I'm not aware of US territory recognizing legal rights of mulattoes during slavery. Legally recognized and property owning freemen in the South seems to have been a distinctly French thing. (with perhaps exceptions here and there)

You do realize that the Spanish and Portuguese ran damn near the same system? Its a Latin thing, not a French thing. Placage gave legal rights to mixed race peoples and that stretched across the coast and the Atlantic Creoles were free mixed people who predate Louisiana creoles and they were from the Mid Atlantic.

You know whats funny? I've watched ancestry videos for a lot of Louisiana creoles and I've seen Spanish/Iberian ancestry pop up at a higher volume than French ancestry.

 

[get these nets]

Charleston, Savannah and Baltimore all had larger slave ports than NOLA.

And there was not a constant influx of enslaved Africans being brought into America. Unlike in the West Indies, the AA population grew by reproduction.

Once again, if you look at records it will show that most of the enslaved Africans in LA/NOLA were locally born or from Senegambia and Kongo not Benin or Togo like Haiti.

Again, the post you included cited NO as the largest slave market in the USA....as a port city, I'm going to figure that it literally means largest slave port. It sounds right, and I was going by that assumption in earlier posts.

The nature of the triangular slave trade and the severity of conditions of the west indian chattel system made the lifespan of the enslaved Africans shorter in WI. Also contributed to the frequency of rebellions. But I will disagree with your point about the AA population. I think the records and logs indicate that the number of Africans brought to 13 colonies/USA was constant throughout the decades. It wasn't until the actual slave trade across the Atlantic was outlawed did the population of AAs increase rapidly through reproduction.

Haitian Revolution occured during the full slave trade and halted it. With very few exceptions..the gene pool in the left side of the island, Haiti ,was undisturbed Benin/Togo elements for over 200 years . Contrast that with NO which became part of the USA and a gene pool mixed with Africans from US slave territory....for another 60 years of slavery..and another 150 years of migration to and from other parts of the USA. And also include the race mixing that has occurred there for over 200 years. Contrast that to Haiti where there is a large Black majority and a tiny mixed race population who generally do not inter marry.

You do realize that the Spanish and Portuguese ran damn near the same system? Its a Latin thing, not a French thing. Placage gave legal rights to mixed race peoples and that stretched across the coast and the Atlantic Creoles were free mixed people who predate Louisiana creoles and they were from the Mid Atlantic.

You know whats funny? I've watched ancestry videos for a lot of Louisiana creoles and I've seen Spanish/Iberian ancestry pop up at a higher volume than French ancestry.

It's a Catholic thing..as opposed to the Protestant system of the United States. For the sake of this discussion..I pointed out the system of French colonies as opposed to the US. I thought perhaps placage meant something different in the US, but what you described is what I noted....the recognition of legal rights of mulattoes in FRENCH territory. I will look up what you wrote, but I'm not aware of mixed race people having legal rights in the USA. In fact If I recall, the "one drop" rule specifically comes from court ruling which barred a mixed race man from inheritance rights in the USA ......because he was 1/16th African.

The man who did the documentary I put up above is from New Orleans...I assume he is of Creole background...and his name happens to be Dr. Maurice Martinez. Elite Catholic families probably married each other across national lines during slavery..so there will be french,spanish,portuguese blood and last names across former slave colonies claimed by those countries.

 

[Onigumo]

Tina Knowles, Beyonce, and Solange apparently possess both Creole and Cajun ancestry.

Beyonce's grandmother and my great great grandmother are sisters yet I've never got to meet her