Brexit Is Teaching Britain A Lesson In Humility; Boris Johnson finalizes EU Exit Deal!

jj23

jj23

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TENET said:
the dog and pony show WWII triumph redux bedtime stories, created around this thing is the objectionable part. lets the courts decide :hubie:
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Never read that in any of the stories I have looked at, but I don't get my news from the Mail, the Sun or the Mirror.
 
the next guy

the next guy

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EU is looking silly with all this vaccine nonsense. Get it together folks, this virus knows no boundaries.
 
88m3

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I think it's a bad look for the EU, they looked very demonic with this article 16 ploy

They should sort out their issues with AZ separately or after the issue is resolved
 
jj23

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88m3 said:
I think it's a bad look for the EU, they looked very demonic with this article 16 ploy

They should sort out their issues with AZ separately or after the issue is resolved
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Or work with the UK to see what can change with vaccine distribution. Folks in the EU need the vaccine as well, but somehow in all this they manged to give the moral high ground to Boris Johnson and the brexiters, who are now on their soapbox calling for a radical change to the NI protocol for Brexit.

:martin:
 
merklman

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jj23 said:
I disagree. This is all political posturing, despite the spin.

This needs to be handled by politicians, and it will involve negotiation and compromise. It will not be fixed by pressuring AZ.

If you try to press AZ, and stop vaccines coming out of Belgium, then the UK stops vaccines being exported from the AZ factories in the UK. Considering the issues the factory in Belgium has had that would actually make things worse for the EU.

People need the vaccines. There aren't enough to go around, but there is a reason for that, if we want to really break things down to simple business.

You are AZ. You have a product. Company A reviews the product and commits to 100 units of the product, company B says they will review and dependant on the review, they would need 200 units of the product.

The question then becomes when company B expected the product vs when AZ expected to begin production for company B. That's what's in dispute.

Considering company B could have said no thanks to the product after review, it isn't unreasonable for AZ to supply their product to the company that gave them a guarantee. It is also not unreasonable to expect, unless the contract stipulated otherwise, that AZ would have prepared the product for company B on point of approval.

So whether or not the EU would like to show or not, it is in a bind.

You can take AZ to court for breach of contract, but that won't guarantee you your vaccines in the timeframe you expected.

You can stop exports of the vaccine, but that also gives you no guarantees

Where does all of this tie back into Brexit? Because the country you now have to negotiate with is the UK; which is a bit shyt after the way you dragged them with Brexit.

That's why they triggered article 16. If you think it's business and not desperation because they made a fundamental mistake and now need to spin this for their member countries who NEED and EXPECTED the vaccine by now, is amazing to me.

I have criticized the UK relentlessly for Brexit, but the EU dropped the ball here. They need to own it.
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The bolded bit is a bit disingenuous, AZ submitted to the MHRA in the UK weeks before they submitted their data to the EMA. MHRA received 23rd Dec and approved in 7 days (stupidly quick), EMA received on 12th Jan and approved on 28th Jan i believe. I work in drug development and get involved in submissions, generally you're looking at about 90days just to receive comments back for EMA/FDA submissions, let alone approvals. Its good the regulators have put all resources towards getting these vaccines approved.

However good/bad the AZ vaccine is/was, i think the UK were approving the AZ vaccine. This whole debacle was clearly forseen by the UK govt and probably some skullduggery behind the scenes with AZ. The timeline fits very much: Around mid Dec, out of nowhere the UK vaccine rollout was updated to:
"First and second dose can be different vaccine brands"
"Gap between doses at 12 weeks, not 4 weeks"

Already deciding to use the vaccines off label even before they'd hit the shelves (though scientifically, it seems reasonable to me). Whats the point of rules and regulations? Brexit: de-regulate and hope on a wing and a prayer right?
 
merklman

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TENET said:
Those are the statements that have been made in public and which have not been challenged by the other side but you ignore that to repeat more tabloid-esque fantasies. AZ / UK have been asked to produce export figures and contracts. By not doing so they are playing hard ball. Yet true to form, they byatch when the other party takes their gloves off. If AZ and the UK have nothing to hide just produce the numbers, show the contract, show you are being fair and be done with it.

Instead of facts we get more waffle.

"Britain and AstraZeneca have said the two British plants, in Staffordshire and Oxford, can supply the EU – but only once the UK order of 100 million jabs was fulfilled. "

"Brussels was infuriated after AstraZeneca said it would only be able to supply a quarter of the 100 million jabs it had promised to the EU, which negotiated as a bloc, for the first quarter of the year. On Friday, it rejected an offer from AstraZeneca to supply eight million more doses, which was aimed at defusing the row. "

"With the EU lagging far behind Britain in its vaccination rollout, and amid fears that EU vaccine stock had ended up in the UK or been sold to countries paying a higher price, the commission doubled down on its demand that supplies be diverted from Britain. "

"It also demanded that suppliers provided details of the last three months of vaccine exports from the EU, and officials have called on Britain to publish its contract with AstraZeneca. "

Treat AstraZeneca's UK Covid vaccine factories as though they are part of EU, Brussels says



:mjlol: the "non emotional" part is not sinking in right.
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Facts are there in my opinion. I think the EU even published an excerpt of their AZ contract which states that plants including the 2 UK facilities will be part of the "suppliers" to the EU. If the premise which the AZ CEO was trying to push was true (UK facilities for UK shipments, and EU facilities for EU shipments, then AZ should have no issue with showing them receipts of where previous EU production (if any) has gone :mjgrin:)The saltiness from the EU is that AZ have basically said the supply for the UK is cool, but not for the EU. I can sympathise with EU here :yeshrug:
 
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