Are We Willing To Admit That Backpack/Conscious/Alternative Rappers Are Graded On A Curve?

[Wacky D]

nah man I disagree for the most part... and Black On Both Sides was a bad example... lets be reality - Jay-Z wouldn't make an album like that, especially after Reasonable Doubt. Anyways I disagree because it's usually people who like the artist who is grading it. If you don't like the artist to begin with, chances are you won't grade it high even if it's good. So with Black On Both Sides being an example, hell yeah I believe it's classic. But if you don't like Mos Def vibe you're not gonna fukk with it.

Same thing goes for a "mainstream" rapper. You can't tell these people anything about for example Get Rich or Die Trying. I don't give a shyt about that album as a whole. They'll say it's 5 mics. It's graded on a curve from that perspective too. If your point is that people overrate the music they personally like.. obviously... but you can't expect a 50 fan to like a Mos Def album. People have preferences.

I'm not saying jay-z would make an album like "black on both sides" in terms of content. I'm saying jay-z in '96-03 making a dry album with wack beats, hooks, etc.

it wouldn't fly. same way it wouldn't fly for 50 cent. I don't know why youre acting like the only people critiquing jay-z & 50 cent albums are their fans. lets be reality, EVERYBODY critiques their music. I'm not talking about stans who will overhype everything that they do. I'm talking about the general rap fan. meanwhile, the general rap fan isn't even checking for a mos def album. that's why rappers like him don't have haters. its not because theyre so beloved or respected. its because nobody really cares. except their fans. and the annoying part is, the fans of these rappers are the ones holding the pen at these magazines and have clout behind the scenes in media/TV.

that's why I say, the source's bias wasn't necessarily east coast. it was stylistic. @mobbinfms @bigbadbossup2012 @DANJ!

 

[ZEB WALTON]

Yea. Its like they squeeze an extra mic into it cause its concious. A lot of the so called classics from 2000s that got great reviews are unlistenable right now.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Wacky D ur cool but you're tripping with this one

Illmatic was considered backpack and that's as good as it gets

And it's full of meh melodies,,meh hooks and it flopped yet is hailed as a "classic"

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

I'm not saying jay-z would make an album like "black on both sides" in terms of content. I'm saying jay-z in '96-03 making a dry album with wack beats, hooks, etc.

it wouldn't fly. same way it wouldn't fly for 50 cent. I don't know why youre acting like the only people critiquing jay-z & 50 cent albums are their fans. lets be reality, EVERYBODY critiques their music. I'm not talking about stans who will overhype everything that they do. I'm talking about the general rap fan. meanwhile, the general rap fan isn't even checking for a mos def album. that's why rappers like him don't have haters. its not because theyre so beloved or respected. its because nobody really cares. except their fans. and the annoying part is, the fans of these rappers are the ones holding the pen at these magazines and have clout behind the scenes in media/TV.

that's why I say, the source's bias wasn't necessarily east coast. it was stylistic. @mobbinfms @bigbadbossup2012 @DANJ!

And that's bullshyt.
The 5 mics (rerated etc) given to west coast albums
were all circled around deathrow or ruthless alumni
dre
snoop
cube
pac
D.o.c.
N.W.A.

Where as there is a wide array of east coast nikkas that got 5 mics.
artists like
e-40
too short
spice 1
dj quik


got overlooked,despite having albums better than a few 5 mic ny albums like BOREmatic are Only Built 4 getting sleep

 

[Wacky D]

It's the other way around

If you rap about drugs and pose with guns in your music you can do the following and not be considered a wack:

- Have no identifying content in your music. You can make songs about nothing your entire career if you pose with guns in the video. Meanwhile a conscious rapper needs "the hit song" "the uplifting song" "the storytelling track" "the song for the ladies" etc.
- Copying styles from other rappers
- Get no critical acclaim
- Have 0 social consciousness
- You can be a proud uncle tom and nikkas won't dare think less of your for it

- Lying on your past
- You don't have to enunciate (mumble rap)
- Your fans don't have to understand what the hell you're saying
- Don't have to even rhyme your lyrics (Future)
- Never battle on wax only subliminal or twitter.
- Go an entire career with no quoteables (future and his rap children)
- Have no versatility

narratives like this are why "conscious" rappers are overrated. yall give them brownie points & participation trophies.

and as for the bolded, mos def was the one posting up videos selling wolf tickets to "anybody that wanna battle", until lupe fiasco accepted his challenge and we aint heard chit from mos def since.

and why are you ranting about mumble rappers? you expect me to defend them wack dudes or something? don't nobody overhype them except young kids who don't know any better. i'd rather listen to overhyped "conscious" rap before some mumble jumble.

 

[Wacky D]

And that's bullshyt.
The 5 mics (rerated etc) given to west coast albums
were all circled around deathrow or ruthless alumni
dre
snoop
cube
pac
D.o.c.
N.W.A.

Where as there is a wide array of east coast nikkas that got 5 mics.
artists like
e-40
too short
spice 1
dj quik


got overlooked,despite having albums better than a few 5 mic ny albums like BOREmatic are Only Built 4 getting sleep

youre missing the point.

I can make a similar argument about the east & south albums that did & didn't get 5 mics.

and I'm sorry but e-40, dj quik and some of those guys didn't deserve 5 to begin with.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

youre missing the point.

I can make a similar argument about the east & south albums that did & didn't get 5 mics.

and I'm sorry but e-40, dj quik and some of those guys didn't deserve 5 to begin with.

And that's why you're just another one of THEM masquerading as some hiphop awakened nikka.

 

[Tflasha]

im sorry but talib got away with murder with them wack songs and wack flows. ran into him in atl at an A3C festival - trash is not the word to describe this winey ass artist on stage - voice so terrible he got mad at himself because he didnt like how he sounded on stage

 

[Kenny West]

facts black on both sides outside a couple tracks is wack as shyt. From the beats and flows to the hooks. Talib is trash as a rapper wit no flow

what does this have to do wit skills, most these backpack artist beats, flow, lyrics are trash and they get praised for rapper about smart dumb nikka shyt

Not much. yet every single thing I mentioned I've seen people shyt on alternative rappers based on that. Conscious rappers are the only one judged by skills and irrelevant shyt simultaneously, yet street rappers in my generation get passes for being trash on the mic.

Remember when people on here and twitter when people were mad at Kendrick because he refused to make political statements in the media? Or when they were trying to shyt on TPAB because Kendrick's girl wasn't black enough? 1000% serious. Meanwhile Wayne and Kodak can swear off black women publicly and nobody blinks. Dead ass saw someone here try to discredit chance the rapper because "he portrays a good guy in his music but he does drugs so he's a hypocrite", I lie to you not.


Average trap rapper is judged based on follower count, how rough his old hood is, how many of your friends think they're cool, his outfits etc.

 

[Ineedmoney504]

Not much. yet every single thing I mentioned I've seen people shyt on alternative rappers based on that. Conscious rappers are the only one judged by skills and irrelevant shyt simultaneously, yet street rappers in my generation get passes for being trash on the mic.

Remember when people on here and twitter when people were mad at Kendrick because he refused to make political statements in the media? Or when they were trying to shyt on TPAB because Kendrick's girl wasn't black enough? 1000% serious. Meanwhile Wayne and Kodak can swear off black women publicly and nobody blinks. Dead ass saw someone here try to discredit chance the rapper because "he portrays a good guy in his music but he does drugs so he's a hypocrite", I lie to you not.


Average trap rapper is judged based on follower count, how rough his old hood is, how many of your friends think they're cool, his outfits etc.

Why not expect Kendrick to make a statement. Stand behind what u rapping about. Same way street are looked to perform in a street manner if a confrontation comes to them. If they make a statement, snitch, back down from a situation a lot of times they career will be over

 

[Kenny West]

Why not expect Kendrick to make a statement.

Because

what does this have to do wit skills,

.

Stand behind what u rapping about. Same way street are looked to perform in a street manner if a confrontation comes to them. If they make a statement, snitch, back down from a situation a lot of times they career will be over

And the bold is some terrible lying Nothing happened to rick ross after he was exposed, nothing happened to TI after "snitchin", nothing happened to wayne soulja boy or chris brown for being pretend bloods.


Future admitted he doesn't do the drugs he raps about which would make him a liar either inside or outside his music. yet nobody's opinion will change


But if you wanna rap about pyramids, consciousness or skateboards we're gonna need to see your report card, a background check and a brown paper bag test on your girlfriend

 

[Mr. Negative]

you my dawg and all....


but what the hell are you on about!?

There really ARENT too many "conscious/backpacker" records that are lauded as 5 mic classics.

For one, like everything else.... shyt is subjective. nikkas call it "classic" don't mean you got to like it or even consider it a classic

For two, how many "modern" classic backpacker/social conscious albums we really got? Does "backpacker" mean it's not mainstream and talking about selling drugs, fukking hoes and hanging out at the club?

Black on Both Sides.....

What else?

Midnight Marauders, maybe?
ATLiens, possibly?
Soul Food?
Kendrick's first two albums, possibly?


Straight Backpacker you might have .... what, MadVillainy?

You can't claim shyt is "overrated" just because you don't like it.

Hell, it's some gay nikkas on this board. They SWEAR p*ssy is overrated.

Does that make women/p*ssy overrated to you, cause THEY don't like it?

 

[CrimsonTider]

It's the other way around

If you rap about drugs and pose with guns in your music you can do the following and not be considered a wack:

- Have no identifying content in your music. You can make songs about nothing your entire career if you pose with guns in the video. Meanwhile a conscious rapper needs "the hit song" "the uplifting song" "the storytelling track" "the song for the ladies" etc.
- Copying styles from other rappers
- Get no critical acclaim
- Have 0 social consciousness
- You can be a proud uncle tom and nikkas won't dare think less of your for it

- Lying on your past
- You don't have to enunciate (mumble rap)
- Your fans don't have to understand what the hell you're saying
- Don't have to even rhyme your lyrics (Future)
- Never battle on wax only subliminal or twitter.
- Go an entire career with no quoteables (future and his rap children)
- Have no versatility

Y'all call these rappers wack every hour of everyday tho

 

[bordeaux]

the mention of bobs ruined your argument--its a great album. but there is some truth to this. it was especially prominent in the early 2000s that if one did conscious or "real hiphop" they were automatically better or somehow deserving of being brought up in convo of rappers out their league.

 

[spliz]

This thread is flawed. Street rappers been gettin away wit all kinda bullshyt for years. A lot of these different sections of hip hop has certain shyt that the others can't get away with.