AOC & Congressional Progressives push back on Jimmy Dore and premature Medicare For All floor votes

[AnonymityX1000]

What's the end game of forcing a vote? You already know who sponsored and didn't sponsor the bill, you can use that to primary those who did not. I don't see the point of these theatrics other than to satisfy the holier than though puritans on the left.

• Maybe some co-sponsors read the moment incorrectly and vote no thus identify more people to primary.
• You get dumb quotes and excuses from 'no' voters you can hang around their neck/beat them over the head with in later elections.
• Hell, AOC indicated she thinks Pelosi would rather lose the speakership than put this up for a vote. You don't think that would be a news story covered for weeks in MSM with M4A as THE topic?

The only case against it is you don't want Dems exposed, fukk that let's do politics and not just shoot the breeze about what we would like to happen on social media. That's going to wear thin eventually.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

People are naive to think Dems are afraid to go against m4a because there’s a pandemic.

IF they did you personally what would you think of that politician?

 

[PoorAndDangerous]

I doubt that. He said that shyt on stage more than once.

Well according to exit polling in the primary I think it was roughly 70%+ of Biden voters thought he supported m4all. Obviously that number would likely decrease in the actual Presidential election but

 

[King Kreole]

OK if you are a Progressive and see 50-30 thousand people needlessly die annually due to a lack of health insurance what's the plan? Just, "Oh well, American sentiment isn't there yet. Let's just wait until it is and do nothing to help along the process." That's worse and even less productive than forcing a vote.

How about removing bad committee chairs and instituting good ones so that whatever public option health care expansion Biden actually does enact will be as robust as possible? M4A is not the only way to get those people covered. Progressives/Leftists seem seduced by political spectacle while eschewing the inside-game that conservatives are so good at. If you're in the kitchen while the sausage is being made, you get to influence the flavor. Otherwise, you're consigning yourself to banging on the kitchen door from the outside, waiting for the rest of the diners to join you in revolution, but they're all just sitting down eating their meals.

 

[King Kreole]

• Maybe some co-sponsors read the moment incorrectly and vote no thus identify more people to primary.

This would be a fukking disaster. Headlines would be "M4A has less votes than co-sponsors, showing it's a fanciful idea even the people sponsoring it don't want to enact."

This hidden, mass leftist army ready to burn down the Democratic Party and put Biden's head on a pike is a myth. It doesn't exist. It's a small group of electorally inconsequential people on twitter. And I'm one of them.

The only case against it is you don't want Dems exposed, fukk that let's do politics and not just shoot the breeze about what we would like to happen on social media. That's going to wear thin eventually.

My case against it is that I don't want M4A exposed.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

How about removing bad committee chairs and instituting good ones so that whatever public option health care expansion Biden actually does enact will be as robust as possible? M4A is not the only way to get those people covered. Progressives/Leftists seem seduced by political spectacle while eschewing the inside-game that conservatives are so good at. If you're in the kitchen while the sausage is being made, you get to influence the flavor. Otherwise, you're consigning yourself to banging on the kitchen door from the outside, waiting for the rest of the diners to join you in revolution, but they're all just sitting down eating their meals.

Oh who decides who is in or gets removed from bad committee chairs?

 

[King Kreole]

Oh who decides who is in or gets removed from bad committee chairs?

Madam Speaker.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

This would be a fukking disaster. Headlines would be "M4A has less votes than co-sponsors, showing it's a fanciful idea even the people sponsoring it don't want to enact."

This hidden, mass leftist army ready to burn down the Democratic Party and put Biden's head on a pike is a myth. It doesn't exist. It's a small group of electorally inconsequential people on twitter.


My case against it is that I don't want M4A exposed.

OK and at the same time we will shyt on all those who vote no. The most recent election where the House lost what 9 seats? Eight of them were lost by Dem candidates who didn't support M4A, while only one who did lost. No one is saying there will be, "mass leftist army ready to burn down the Democratic Party and put Biden's head on a pike" but our recent elections show a trend. Dems who don't support M4A lose.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

Madam Speaker.

So Progressives have no avenue to that. So why propose that as a solution for Progressives?!

 

[Robbie3000]

People are naive to think Dems are afraid to go against m4a because there’s a pandemic.

Very naïve. The fact is most people are covered. I personally think M4A is the way to go in the long run, but I believe the majority of people in the Dem party are agnostic about how the uninsured get covered. Further, I believe majority of people don't want the consequences that come with disrupting 17% of the GDP. Thus why they keep electing people who will maintain the status quo.

Most people are small c conservative by nature and averse to change.

 

[Armchair Militant]

IF they did you personally what would you think of that politician?

I prefer the public option, so it’s fine with me.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

I prefer the public option, so it’s fine with me.

Not what I asked but OK if you prefer a public option I'm sure Americans generally feel similar. Promoting the concept of M4A wouldn't be some death sentence for a pol or the party. Most people like the idea of publicly funded healthcare. It's worth doing.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

Why doesn't the criticism of Trump during a pandemic apply to all apathetic pols regarding healthcare coverage? They are letting 30-50K people die needlessly due to a lack of coverage. If we don't pass it in the next decade that's 300-500K dead for no reason than politicians don't have intestinal fortitude to do what's right, and you can even fairly apply that concept to the last 30-40 years that's millions dead. No biggie? Then Trump not doing all necessary to stop deaths during the pandemic isn't either.

 

[King Kreole]

OK and at the same time we will shyt on all those who vote no. The most recent election where the House lost what 9 seats? Eight of them were lost by Dem candidates who didn't support M4A, while only one who did lost. No one is saying there will be, "mass leftist army ready to burn down the Democratic Party and put Biden's head on a pike" but our recent elections show a trend. Dems who don't support M4A lose.

I hope you're right, I'm just very skeptical that the progressive movement has the ability to meaningfully shyt on anybody, with the end goal of immediately turning M4A into a reality. I have no doubt that some primaries could be won, but it's marginal at the moment. We agree there is a trend, where we differ is at what point in the trend we are right now.

So Progressives have no avenue to that. So why propose that as a solution for Progressives?!

Progressives do have avenues. The Speaker is the leader of their caucus, if there is a fracture in the caucus, the speaker loses power. Pelosi has a pretty thin margin of control, so she has to walk that tightrope and is susceptible to pressure from a coherent, disciplined bloc. No one was saying "Don't pressure the speaker" they were saying "pressure her for meaningful things instead of a spectacle show-vote".

 

[wtfyomom]

this is who nap is using for arguments ?