Anybody a pilot or air traffic controller? Who's at fault here...

[jaydawg08]

I’m not a tower controller (I work in a enroute center as an ATC) so my knowledge is limited in this specific situation

But it def sounds like each planes are talking to different controller. One is ground control, the other is local. One handles the movement of planes from the taxiway the other clears people for takeoff snd landing

Sounds like there wasn’t communication from ATC and both were cleared on different frequencies

I’ve been told by pilots that’s they typically will listen to ANY mention of the runway they are cleared to takeoff from for this very situation. Normally if there is a problem or a pilot questions something, they will say something

Sounds like training was going on ( which isn’t that surprising since training is always going on in facilities) but could have been a contributing factor

 

[FaTaL]

subs

 

[null]

Mentour Pilot

 

[jaydawg08]

Here's another one that seems to happen ALOT

Random VFR aircraft that are literal magnets to any IFR aircraft.. it happens so often with me, and I've been burned in the past with this exact situation. A slow VFR target will be moving along, right in the middle of a "busier" smaller airport and you have a sequence going and sometimes vectoring planes for an approach and this random 2 seat plane will ALWAYS turn right into your traffic

It never fails.

I got extremely nervous once, where I had to have someone climb back up an extra 1000 feet and make a hard right 40 degrees but thankfully they didn't respond to an RA, but they were literally right on top of each other.. VFR targets will always seem to run right into an aircraft, or climb an extra 500-1500 feet out of nowhere or make an extreme hard left/right turn all without asking for flight following.

 

[BigMoneyGrip]

Not either. That was weird. The ground controller gave taxi clearance but the tower controller cleared for takeoff. my guess is the tower controller screwed up

she says 2937, the pilot was cleared to cross runway 4 and repeated the instruction. Pilots are trained to do that to confirm ATC directions for other posters. The tower controller then steps on the ground controllers instructor clearing 1554 to take off. I don’t know who was wrong, but had to be a controller. Either ground shouldn’t have given clearance or tower shouldn’t have cleared takeoff.

Tower and ground are on different channels.. ground suppose to hand over departing flights to the tower to line up for take off

 

[Blackrogue]

OK so the first guy by runway four had priority. He was cleared to get on runway four. Normally you do last minute checks before you get on the runway, you also wait for any traffic that's approaching to land and clear the runway. Once you get permission to get on the runway its a few engine checks and waiting for clearance to take off depending on traffic in the air.

I think ground thought southwest would have passed that spot before he was ready to go so cleared him to do so then mistakenly cleared the other guy for take off. A mistake southwest being on the same frequency should have noted since that information is relevant to them .

The south west plane at the bottom of the screen was also given permission to get on runway 1 and was told of his traffic on runway four on his left and I think another on approach I think six minutes out so he needs to get out before it gets there.. Those were his conflicts. Take off after the guy on four and before the approach plane gets there.

The other southwest plane on near collision was told about the plane closest to him passing near his initial spot. After which he was cleared to go cross runway four via Charlie taxiway.

He repeated the instructions including clear to cross and if there's any discrepancy ground would have corrected him which that he wasn't cleared to cross but they didn't.

Its grounds fault they didn't get the timing down but...

BUT.... South west was fukking up in their lack of awareness. First you are on the same frequency so if you are crossing runway four why aren't you paying attention to who's lined up on there and who's approaching? Why aren't you crossing it like an important intersection? Some guy could have radio failure and emergency landing. You look at your environment regardless for information. You have to have some sort of mental image of what factors might affect you. Furthermore its good practice to not just cross a runway blindly or follow instructions blindly. He could have slowed down short of runway four to Countercheck activity. He could have also heard the clear for take off prompt. Maybe ground thought he'd use common sense and stop short.
Ground could have done a better job. Southwest should operate with better safety protocol and with better perspective of what's going on around them.

 

[Blackrogue]

Nope wrong wrong wrong… Southwest 2830 was told to line up and wait to take off on runway 1… JetBlue was already cleared to take off… The fukk up came when Southwest 2950 thought the ATC told him to cross the runway thus putting him in the path of the JetBlue plane already going down the runway..

Seems like the pilots of Southwest 2950 wasn’t paying attention to the ATC , because the ATC was clearly talking to Southwest 2830..

So it was the pilots of Southwest 2950’s fault for both paying attention..

And yes I have my private pilots licenses

The other southwest was cleared to cross via charlie and relayed it. Dumb ass just crossed blindly and was not listening to the chatter on the radio.

 

[Blackrogue]

Nope wrong wrong wrong… Southwest 2830 was told to line up and wait to take off on runway 1… JetBlue was already cleared to take off… The fukk up came when Southwest 2950 thought the ATC told him to cross the runway thus putting him in the path of the JetBlue plane already going down the runway..

Seems like the pilots of Southwest 2950 wasn’t paying attention to the ATC , because the ATC was clearly talking to Southwest 2830..

So it was the pilots of Southwest 2950’s fault for both paying attention..

And yes I have my private pilots licenses

I have my commercial

Jet blue followed instructions perfectly. Was cleared to take off. Was told South west on his right is holding off waiting for him to go. South west on runway one was told about Jet Blue and another plane on six mile final.

South west on near collision didn't relay any other information so no he didn't act like they were talking to him. He was given instructions at the beginning of the whole mess and relayed them and they didn't make any changes.

Personally though he should have stopped short of runway four just to make sure. He should have also paid attention to oncoming traffic. Paid attention to the radio. Once tower gave him the initial clearance they stopped getting concerned with him and more concerned with the two guys on the runway and the person on a six mile final.

But that ground control lady cleared him to cross. I listened again to the instructions. He just should have been more mindful.

 

[RehReh]

I like Delta

 

[Blackrogue]

the coil is full of morons who can barely operate a vehicle.. ain’t no pilots in here

guess again.