Always thought this came from Africa or Caribbean ...actually it was New Orleans

[TNOT]

But yeah it was the same for me with most of my dna cousins being in California as well. You should try the full version, it will show you your DNA cousins not only in the states but around the world, it's pretty dope.

Spoiler: Side note

yo this thread is all over the place compared to the first post

Yes it is I thought about starting a separate about my DNA test, but all the people who seem to have the best info are in this thread so fukk it


I think I have the full version. Lots of DNA relatives in Canada some in New Zealand, Italy, Spain, less Irish than I thought

Very interesting stuff

 

[Black Haven]

Yes it is I thought about starting a separate about my DNA test, but all the people who seem to have the best info are in this thread so fukk it

This thread in the root is the best place to get info from other posters who also DNA tested Ancestry DNA Matches from Africa - Are These Questions Ok to Ask Them or Nah?

 

[IllmaticDelta]

True indeed about southern AAs bringing their sound system culture up north
.Doc posted from the last debate even mentioned the differences between the southern systems and the ones that Caribbean immigrants brought up north


Heard the Whipper Whip interview before...if you read my last post....I said that the PRs that were fukking with hip hop elements then AGREED with Caz saying that they were rare, not non existent. What I said was, if Wiz was Caz's first DJ..... and if Whip was his first rap partner.... and then he was part of a multi ethnic rap crew either Caz had a latin magnet or the latino dudes he was fukking with were authentically part of the culture.


I remember the guy in the video from our last debates, I fukk with his videos he speaks straight from the heart. What confuses me about what he was saying is that I didn't say that Bam ended all the street violence...but LITERALLY every rap figure from that scene an era has said on camera that the Bam shows are where crews and cultures began partying together in peace(for a change). that the clubs downtown didn't want/allow b-boys and that the Bronx became the hot spot for partying. If you grew up watching Ralph McDaniel and VMB, you've seen them all say it camera Melle Mel, Herc, Rock Steady Crew members, other Zulu nation people , Flash, DST, Kool Moe Dee, Charlie Chase.
The story about him grabbing the mic and giving the speech has been repeated by a lot of them also. Dude in the video is calling a lot of people liars.

At any rate, I used Bam's parties as a marker of when some of the the crew and cultural exchange began happening more consistently and when the contributions of latinos became more visible.

as I said before, that's more like the early 1980's. For reference..

The Mighty Zulu Kingz was established in 1973. They were to be the official bboy crew for the Zulu Nation. This concept came about due to the fact that the five brothers, who helped Afrika Bambaataa organize The Zulu Nation, WERE ALL BBOYS! They were known as the Zulu Kings. The “FOUNDING 5″ of Zulu Kings helped Afrika Bambaataa start a small movement in his tenement housing projects called “The Bronx River Organization”, which in time was changed to “The Organization”, and eventually renamed to “Zulu Nation”, which is the name the organization still uses today. The “FOUNDING 5″ members of Zulu Kings are: AMAD HENDERSON, AZIZ JACKSON, SHAKA REED, KUSA STOKES, and ZAMBU LANER. Amad Henderson still helps lead the Zulu Nation global organization, now refer to as “Universal Zulu Nation”. He is still a huge influence on MZK, and how the group operates today. Also, he is 1 of 2 consultants to Alien Ness, who is the current President of MZK.

As time went on, Zulu Kings became bigger with a household name for the BBoy dance style that was known by many terms; “Boi-yoing”, “Breaking”, “Go Off”, “BBoying”, or “Breakdancing” (media term). Eleven members of Zulu Kings made this possible; they were known as the “FIRST 11″. In 1975, they help create the B-Boy boom in the Bronx. The streets were buzzing about the new dance form that the Zulu Kings were doing. They were a force to be reckoned with in an era of social parties known in the streets as “Jams”. The “FIRST 11″ Zulu Kings are: BEAVER, ROBBIE ROB, CHOLLY ROCK, SWANE, POW WOW, MARCUS, JAZZY JAY, SUNDANCE, LITTLE KEITH, AFRIKA ISLAM, and G.L.O.B.E. Out of the “FIRST 11″, Beaver was the most well-known member, and became the first BBoy to get the Ghetto Celebrity status. Many of the original moves that create the blueprint for the BBoy dance style started with these 11 members, including SPORADIC FOOTWORK STYLE, HEAD SPINS, BACK SPINS, CHAIR FREEZE, BABY FREEZE, BASIC TOP ROCK STYLES, and the ever so popular and most imitated, AROUND THE WORLD SPINS & ZULU SPINS.

As the years went by, all the original Zulu Kings started to fade. Afrika Islam started to DJ, as well as Jazzy Jay. Pow Wow, G.L.O.B.E., and Biggs became The Soul Sonic Force. Sundance and Trouble maintained Chapter 2 of the Zulu Nation, and of course BBoy was getting “PLAYED OUT” by 1979.

In 1981, Zulu Kings have a new life in the form of “Rock Steady Crew” (the third generation of Zulu Kings, or “Generation 3″ as MZK refers to them). This came about in the winter of 1981, when leading members of the infamous “Rock Steady Crew” asked Afrika Bambaataa if they could be members of Zulu Kings. Afrika Bambaataa granted them their wish, and sweetened the pot by allowing all members of Rock Steady Crew to represent Zulu Kings. Many older pictures of Rock Steady Crew show them wearing sweat suits with the words “ROCK STEADY ZULU KINGS”. RSC were part of the first Hip Hop Tour with Afrika Bambaataa, and were given the honor of carrying the tradition of Zulu Kings as a bboy squad, but this time “Boogie Boys” were included. This generation was short lived, and by the mid 1990’s only 4 people were honorably representing Zulu Kings. Those dancers were Frosty Freeze (R.I.P.), Pop Master Fabel, Mr. Wiggles, and the newly added member Alien Ness, who eventually went on to be the President of MZK. Pop Master Fabel is the second consultant to Alien Ness, and is referred to as “GodFather” to the 4th generation of MZK.

early 80's as the point when more latinos came in has been confirmed by Cholly Rock



and Beaver



2010 video from mr wiggles on him





2011 board post asking about Beaver

I'd really like to know what has happened to the legendary B-Boy Beaver from the Mighty Zulu Kings! In the movie "The Freshest Kids" Mr.Wiggles states :" You couldn't find any bigger name in B-Boying than Beaver, period!!! " From what I understand he was the first true King of B-Boying in the Mid 1970ies, even before Spy ( The Crazy Commanders )got in the game. Like 2 months ago I contacted a legendary bboy via MySpace and asked him a couple of questions on B-Boy History. I was so happy and surprised when he gave me his phone number and allowed me to have 3 extremely informative conversations with him.( Much blessings ) He told me about the special rank that the Mighty Zulu Kings hold in Hiphop History and also confirmed that Beaver was the first king of this dance. So now I am wondering what has happened to him. Is he still alive? Does anybody in this forum know what he is doing nowadays and wether there is a chance to contact him? Yo Ness, you know I got nothing but the deepest respect for you and your exalted crew...do you have any information on what Beaver is doing nowadays???? To me it's sad somehow that all these great B-Boys from the 70ies are being generally overlooked and each and everybody focuses only on RSC. Don't get me wrong I got mad love for RSC but I feel that people like Beaver, Robbie Rob,Vinnie, Bos, Trac 2, Batch, Abbey,Shorty, Spy, Lil Carlos etc. should definetely get more recognition from the worldwide Hiphop Community. Like KRS-One said in his book "Ruminations" it is definetely time that somebody steps up and preserves the true History of all the Hiphop Elements because otherwise there will soon be a day when the mass media and the entertainment industry tells us what our true history is and to which rules we should stick to. I'm sure that the above mentioned pioneers could still enlighten us all with their enormous wisdom and insight on the dance called B-Boying because back in their era the B-Boys actually lived this shyt to the fullest, back before it was all about artificial tournaments and acting like deaf retards with helmets on. So, pleaaaaaaaaaasee let us know what's up with Beaver!!!

WHERE IS BEAVER .. ORIGINAL BBOY FROM THE 1970'S

2017 video below





^^cholly rock, closer to 2nd generation talks about him above

actual Beaver interview from 2018 where he flat out says Ricans started coming more into Bboying by the early 80's right when he retired.

Beaver (The Little Zulu Kings)

NORIN RAD:"Oh, okay! But I have heard that you and a guy called Peanut once looked for a Puerto Rican B-Boy called Vinnie from the Sal Soul Crew at a swimming pool on Crotona Avenue back in 1975 and that you were defeated by him."

BEAVER:"That's been made up! I have never been defeated and I don't know who Vinnie is or who Peanut is and I have never danced against anybody by those names and again... most of those guys came in after...way after I stopped B-Boying in 1980. What I see in that is a lot of people want street credit. They feel if they mention my name and say they defeated me or taught me or what have you..they think that people will respect them and give them that credit that they think they deserve."

Castles In The Sky

 

[get these nets]

as I said before, that's more like the early 1980's. For reference..



[


early 80's as the point when more latinos came in has been confirmed by Cholly Rock



and Beaver



2010 video from mr wiggles on him





2011 board post asking about Beaver



WHERE IS BEAVER .. ORIGINAL BBOY FROM THE 1970'S

2017 video below



^^cholly rock, closer to 2nd generation talks about him above

actual Beaver interview from 2018 where he flat out says Ricans started coming more into Bboying by the early 80's right when he retired.

Beaver (The Little Zulu Kings)



Castles In The Sky

Thanks.

When I posted the receipt for the Jelly Roll Morton comment about Spanish tinge, and it wasn't acknowledged I stopped reading the updates to this thread. I figured if dudes called B.S. on something that was proven to not be B.S., that they would concede the point.

That's neither here nor there , though....I'm back.

Thank for the clips. Though if Cholly rock is considered second generation B-boy, then what year would you say that b-boying started.?

I have two clips in the spoilers, I'd like you to view them and comment . both from a documentary about NY latinos and their music.
First Grand Master Caz keeps it 100 and cosigns what your point in this thread is about P.R.s, b- boying and dates....though he says something at the end that confirms their history in hip hop culture.

Spoiler

4 minute clip

Second clip talks about spread of gangs in NY...and the Bronx.......and Bambaatta's role in trying to stop the violence. Guy who was a baby gang member repeats the stry that several othe rpeople have about Zulu Nation having a hand in gang stopping the violence

Spoiler

8 minute clip

so, the 3 questions
1. when do you say b boying started if a Baby Zulu of Cholly's age is considered 2nd generation?
2. Do you agree with the last part of what Caz says?
3. Why are so many people repeating the same story that Cholly Rock called BS on? (that he said that KRs-one was wrong about?) I believe everything Cholly says, BUT again..multiple people (fans, artists) have said the EXACT same thing that the Puerto Rican guy says here

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Thank for the clips. Though if Cholly rock is considered second generation B-boy, then what year would you say that b-boying started.?

cholly rock is 1st generation zulu king (more like74 or 75) but bboying was around since 1971 according to herc and many of the bboys that would go to herc, disco king mario, dj smokey and other dj's jams.

I have two clips in the spoilers, I'd like you to view them and comment . both from a documentary about NY latinos and their music.
First Grand Master Caz keeps it 100 and cosigns what your point in this thread is about P.R.s, b- boying and dates....though he says something at the end that confirms their history in hip hop culture.

Spoiler

4 minute clip

Second clip talks about spread of gangs in NY...and the Bronx.......and Bambaatta's role in trying to stop the violence. Guy who was a baby gang member repeats the stry that several othe rpeople have about Zulu Nation having a hand in gang stopping the violence

Spoiler

8 minute clip

so, the 3 questions
1. when do you say b boying started if a Baby Zulu of Cholly's age is considered 2nd generation?

earliest bboys was like 71 ever before Herc which he acknowledges but they were dancing the the whole record before breakbeat specific, djing caught on

next were between 71 and 73 between Herc's and Dj Smokey's crowd since they had many of the same dancers (nikka twins, OG Clark kent)





disco king mario's chuck chuck city crew bboys







then 74-75 you had the Zulu Kings

2. Do you agree with the last part of what Caz says?

the last part is mainly true so I agree. Most of the original black bboys had stopped bboying by the early 80's which is why most people who learned hiphop from the 80's mainly saw Ricans doing it and then thought they created it

3. Why are so many people repeating the same story that Cholly Rock called BS on? (that he said that KRs-one was wrong about?) I believe everything Cholly says, BUT again..multiple people (fans, artists) have said the EXACT same thing that the Puerto Rican guy says here

they're mainly repeating what was going in hiphop by the time the early 80's arrived and then 1980's myths on hiphop history. Plus there was ameeting Between Zulu Nation and some of these Rican crew because the Rican crews wanted to know how they could be down with the bubbling hiphop culture

read below

SIR NORIN RAD:"Willie Will (legendary Puerto Rican B-Boy from Rockwell Association) told me about how we was introduced to that original Black B-Boy Style of dancing which you referred to as The Go Off in 1976 by a B-Boy called Chopper that was down with the Zulu Nation. What was the relationship between TBB and the Zulu Nation? Was there any kind of contact at all?"


ABY:"Again, I was younger. I was too young to even understand the difference between Black and Puerto Rican. But to my brothers...to the older guys there was a barrier....there was a line between Blacks and Latinos. I mean look at the gangs back then...the Black Spades were all black and then you had the Ghetto Brothers which were all Latinos....so there was a division at first. I remember the Zulu Kings only from late 1976/77 that's when we really got involved. That's also when Batch had his meeting with the Zulu Nation..1977. TBB and members of the Zulu Nation they used to have rumbles.....they would fight against each other. Whatever jam they went to they would rumble. If there was a jam and TBB was chilling there and all of a sudden some one threw hands Batch would summon TBB Joe's division who was known as the warlord division meaning thay handled all the rumbles or one on one fight make sure no one jumped in !! . One of the first black DJs that I ever met was Lay Lay. He was from Fun PM City Crew and they was all black but they was kool cause they were from the block.We never had problems in 129 Mapes Pool. Lay Lay would get cutting and we would start dancing !! Back then we danced more with the girls than against each other .. But when we heard "It's Just Begun" or Babe Ruth "Mexican" or "Bongo Rock"... forget about it! Floor rockers hit the flooooorrrrrrr,!!! Cypher set and battles was for respect not money .. You had to be there to truly understand and smell the air and feel the excitement when the cat you was battling burned you the last time and you been practicing all week long for the moment you let it all out on the concrete ... Damn miss em days ."


DJ Lay Lay & The Fun City Crew rocking with The L-Brothers and The Mercedes Ladies in 1979


SIR NORIN RAD:"So you're saying there was a lot of tension between TBB and members the Zulu Nation?"

ABY:"There was! There was a lot of tension out there."

SIR NORIN RAD:"And all that beef was squashed at that meeting?"

ABY:"Batch had his meeting with Bam at the Webster projects on Zulu Nation turf in 1977. After that meeting they squashed it. I don't know how come Bam never spoke of this because it's such an important part of the history. It identifies with unity between Latinos and Blacks. So I don't know why he never acknowledged it."

Castles In The Sky

so, Rock steady crew is the one group that really put Ricans into the mix (1980s) but before that, you had the TBB Crew in the late 70's that first tried to get Ricans into the mix through Bambaatta.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Wrong as hell

It’s the other way around

Ska was R&B soul to a different time signature which turned into Reggae / Dancehall

I forgot to mention that the skank of reggae and herky jerky beat of ska was in early recorded jazz too


this is reggae skank in jazz in the 1920s




here you have full blown ska in jazz of the 1930s

 

[Knuckles Red]

FACTS.
I think people have written Puerto Ricans out of hip hop history because they think hip hop just means rappers .
If they looked at old flyers, old footage, album covers, pictures of graff artists next to their burners(or tags)..they'd see Puerto Ricans there.

But, yes.....people participating in all the elements were from all those backgrounds.
It started here., was cultivated here...the base is CLEARLY AA, but the African diaspora in the Western Hemisphere is HUGE...and hip hop is really distinct elements of that diapora coming together and birthing something new.

Very interesting. Its crazy how this debate has changed over the years. Now, posters here, say Puerto Ricans had nothing to do with the creation of hip hop. Either way, this entire thread is so informative and interesting!

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Very interesting. Its crazy how this debate has changed over the years. Now, posters here, say Puerto Ricans had nothing to do with the creation of hip hop. Either way, this entire thread is so informative and interesting!

It didn't change...both the black originators and the early Rican pioneers that followed been admitted to how things actually played out in the 1970s.















The narrative about Ricans being there from the start was a product of outsiders trying to document history through the lens of when they showed up circa 1980-1985. What they saw didn't actually represent the demographics of the foundational years of hiphop from 1970-1974. The Rock Steady Crew (mainly Puerto Ricans) being seen and questioned is what skewed the actual history and created the modern and often repeated perceptions that the OGs knew were false but kept mostly quiet about because it would create unnecessary drama between two groups who were now (1980s) super close as far as relations went

Spoiler

Now, the myth was addressed because Fat Joe was out here making ridiculous, unfounded and easily debunked, claims

 

[Knuckles Red]

It didn't change...both the black originators and the early Rican pioneers that followed been admitted to how things actually played out in the 1970s.















The narrative about Ricans being there from the start was a product of outsiders trying to document history through the lens of when they showed up circa 1980-1985. What they saw didn't actually represent the demographics of the foundational years of hiphop from 1970-1974. The Rock Steady Crew (mainly Puerto Ricans) being seen and questioned is what skewed the actual history and created the modern and often repeated perceptions that the OGs knew were false but kept mostly quiet about because it would create unnecessary drama between two groups who were now (1980s) super close as far as relations went

Now, the myth was addressed because Fat Joe was out here making ridiculous, unfounded and easily debunked, claims

Very interesting. I'm going to continue to read through your post. The history of hip hop is fascinating. That these black people were able to create something, that has become so universally loved, out of nothing is truly amazing.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Very interesting. I'm going to continue to read through your post. The history of hip hop is fascinating. That these black people were able to create something, that has become so universally loved, out of nothing is truly amazing.

Check this thread. All the answers to your questions are to be found there

https://www.thecoli.com/threads/rican-hiphop-pioneers-giving-the-dates-of-when-they-entered-first-saw-hiphop-being-done-they-were-not-there-from-the-start-by-their-own-admissions.936245/post-46974624