Alexandria Ocasio Cortez - "Not All Dems Are The Same"

[Secure Da Bag]

did you just quote yourself for some reason or did you forget to logoff your alias lol.

Hilarious.

either way, like i said

i'm glad you're starting to see how she's wired...she's a left leaning Trump, hopefully she tones this down , because she's a political disaster waiting to happen and has the potential to destroy moderate thinking democrats

She's not the first one to drop the "Jesus is refugee" line. Google showed me that much. I'm simply saying that she's a politician. She should know that other politicians can take that verse and what she said and twist it into something else.

Left-leaning Trump? Nah, she's hasn't shown 1/100 of the ineptitude Trump has. She's a novice. She's novicing.

EDIT: However, if we want to compare genders, then Trump is very much like a RINO Palin.

 

[AnonymityX1000]

did you just quote yourself for some reason or did you forget to logoff your alias lol.

either way, like i said




i'm glad you're starting to see how she's wired...she's a left leaning Trump, hopefully she tones this down , because she's a political disaster waiting to happen and has the potential to destroy moderate thinking democrats

 

[Perfectson]

Hilarious.



She's not the first one to drop the "Jesus is refugee" line. Google showed me that much. I'm simply saying that she's a politician. She should know that other politicians can take that verse and what she said and twist it into something else.

Left-leaning Trump? Nah, she's hasn't shown 1/100 of the ineptitude Trump has. She's a novice. She's novicing.

EDIT: However, if we want to compare genders, then Trump is very much like a RINO Palin.

I almost want to call her Palin but I don't think she's that inept as Palin was and wasn't as Twitter Fingery but she's definitely moving into that direction of "ineptness".

 

[Perfectson]

this is what i expect as well. I'm not arguing with some of you guys about government expansions that AOC favors

Yahoo is now part of Oath

 

[GnauzBookOfRhymes]

this is what i expect as well. I'm not arguing with some of you guys about government expansions that AOC favors

Yahoo is now part of Oath

Citing fox business news, which is basically gop
propaganda masquerading as objective financial news doesn’t help your cause.

 

[Secure Da Bag]

this is what i expect as well. I'm not arguing with some of you guys about government expansions that AOC favors

Yahoo is now part of Oath

I watched that. I'll concede on the point that you may be more well-read on the financial going-ons than I. Now, with that said,

• I think everyone knows that a New Green Deal is going to be expansive, both in gov't and deficit. There's no way it couldn't, especially in the short term.
  
• In terms of China and other countries not buying bonds, it could be that no one agrees with the direction the US is going in, under Trump. Therefore, countries are not buying bonds as they were.
  
• I agree that Pelosi isn't gonna champion a New Green Deal. She's not going to give AOC or Sanders anymore political steam than she has to.
  
• Giving $1T in tax cuts doesn't help bring down the interest on the debt. Of course, no one on that panel is mentioned that.
• As much as UBI, M4A, and student loan forgiveness may upset fiscal conservatives, it would do more good than harm for the people. They'd have more money to work with and more likely to spend, as oppose to save.
• Steve Forbes shytting on Germany's Green Economy is suspect. So I'll hold off commenting one way or the other way.

Honestly I think the only guy that was worth listening to was the guy in the top right corner talking about debt interest and the need for restructuring.

 

[Perfectson]

I watched that. I'll concede on the point that you may be more well-read on the financial going-ons than I. Now, with that said,

• I think everyone knows that a New Green Deal is going to be expansive, both in gov't and deficit. There's no way it couldn't, especially in the short term.
  
• In terms of China and other countries not buying bonds, it could be that no one agrees with the direction the US is going in, under Trump. Therefore, countries are not buying bonds as they were.
  
• I agree that Pelosi isn't gonna champion a New Green Deal. She's not going to give AOC or Sanders anymore political steam than she has to.
  
• Giving $1T in tax cuts doesn't help bring down the interest on the debt. Of course, no one on that panel is mentioned that.
• As much as UBI, M4A, and student loan forgiveness may upset fiscal conservatives, it would do more good than harm for the people. They'd have more money to work with and more likely to spend, as oppose to save.
• Steve Forbes shytting on Germany's Green Economy is suspect. So I'll hold off commenting one way or the other way.

Honestly I think the only guy that was worth listening to was the guy in the top right corner talking about debt interest and the need for restructuring.

Good points. The German green deal (and free education) are researchable and have failed in that country for the most part .

Full loan forgiveness imo does not help, someone is footing the bill. Perhaps reducing the amount of interest but I dont agree with taking out $20k utilizing it and then not paying it back

I appreciate the sensible reply. Understand it was a fox business panel but it was a very clear economic discussion.

 

[Secure Da Bag]

he German green deal (and free education) are researchable and have failed in that country for the most part .

Germany’s green energy shift is more fizzle than sizzle

After reading that article, they were too early and implemented it badly. Shutting down nuclear power plants was a terrible move. And most of their emissions are coming from cars. They didn't switch or push electric, hybrid, or high mpg cars.

So Forbes' critique on Germany as a reason to not do an American Green Deal is :sheiksuspect:

 

[Perfectson]

Germany’s green energy shift is more fizzle than sizzle

After reading that article, they were too early and implemented it badly. Shutting down nuclear power plants was a terrible move. And most of their emissions are coming from cars. They didn't switch or push electric, hybrid, or high mpg cars.

So Forbes' critique on Germany as a reason to not do an American Green Deal is :sheiksuspect:

I think we all agree green is the way to go, the massive extreme move to it is I believe what everyone is discussing . You mentioned implemented badly ,you really trust a first time Congress woman with no education in the field to get it right when the freaking half robot half humans and Germany couldn't ? Ready to risk the world's largest economy on that ?


Of course AoC is, her divine plan is to create a communist society except there will still be uber rich that will still control everything. I'm not happy going through life basically given everything, I want my incentive to grow and move beyond my current economic caste...

 

[Secure Da Bag]

I think we all agree green is the way to go, the massive extreme move to it is I believe what everyone is discussing . You mentioned implemented badly ,you really trust a first time Congress woman with no education in the field to get it right when the freaking half robot half humans and Germany couldn't ? Ready to risk the world's largest economy on that ?

She has enough education to suggest it, push it, and demand it. I think she has enough education to get a committee of people who do specialize in that area to give her a thorough report on how to do this. We both know AOC is not going to be the lead environmentalist on the panel. She would be in a committee. They all would be making that decision. That decision would come from a group (scientists and engineers) that would inform the committee on what to do and maybe even how to do it.

As I said before, comparing Germany of 2010 to America of 2019 is comparing apples to oranges. People, even from a different country, are able to learn from other people's mistakes.

 

[Perfectson]

She has enough education to suggest it, push it, and demand it. I think she has enough education to get a committee of people who do specialize in that area to give her a thorough report on how to do this. We both know AOC is not going to be the lead environmentalist on the panel. She would be in a committee. They all would be making that decision. That decision would come from a group (scientists and engineers) that would inform the committee on what to do and maybe even how to do it.

As I said before, comparing Germany of 2010 to America of 2019 is comparing apples to oranges. People, even from a different country, are able to learn from other people's mistakes.

She will be a key decision maker, and that's where im coming from . She's touting something that isn't wholly created yet. I use the same comparison as a student president promising free vending machines snacks if elected. She currently doesn't know what she's talking about and how her initiatives will further in debt the nation and reduce our economic strength.

There needs to be a push to green , through solid initiatives and regulations. Which is where we were headed before Bernie and his supporters decided to destroy America, allow Trump to take office and destroy the path we were on. Now they are back looking to do insane proposals through AOC . This requires a moderate approach and hopefully Pelosi keeps AOC in line and gives her the attention of the limelight that AOC wants. aOC is an agent

 

[Secure Da Bag]

She will be a key decision maker, and that's where im coming from .

She certainly will be a leading voice.

She's touting something that isn't wholly created yet.

I'm not sure what that means exactly. How is such a thing "wholly created"?

I use the same comparison as a student president promising free vending machines snacks if elected. She currently doesn't know what she's talking about and how her initiatives will further in debt the nation and reduce our economic strength.

That comparison is quite inaccurate. She's promoting creating jobs. That's a plus. Creating more industry for green tech. Again, plus. Moving us off a volatile commodity that's control by a cartel and by which way the winds of war blow. Again, plus. Though our deficit will increase in the short-term, so will the number of jobs, and therefore tax revenue (federal and state).

There needs to be a push to green , through solid initiatives and regulations. Which is where we were headed before Bernie and his supporters decided to destroy America, allow Trump to take office and destroy the path we were on. Now they are back looking to do insane proposals through AOC . This requires a moderate approach and hopefully Pelosi keeps AOC in line and gives her the attention of the limelight that AOC wants. aOC is an agent

I'm beginning to think that MLK line about incrementalism is applicable to every damn thing. Sanders takes no credit in "destroying America". The two parties did that all on their own. With the GOP taking the majority of the credit. The approach is not an issue of moderation, but an issue of understanding and foresight. When Congress does anything in moderation, it's a sign of giving away breadcrumbs hoping that will sate the national hunger for change and allow the gov't to kick the can down the road another 60 years. We know better at this point.

 

[Perfectson]

She certainly will be a leading voice.



I'm not sure what that means exactly. How is such a thing "wholly created"?



That comparison is quite inaccurate. She's promoting creating jobs. That's a plus. Creating more industry for green tech. Again, plus. Moving us off a volatile commodity that's control by a cartel and by which way the winds of war blow. Again, plus. Though our deficit will increase in the short-term, so will the number of jobs, and therefore tax revenue (federal and state).



I'm beginning to think that MLK line about incrementalism is applicable to every damn thing. Sanders takes no credit in "destroying America". The two parties did that all on their own. With the GOP taking the majority of the credit. The approach is not an issue of moderation, but an issue of understanding and foresight. When Congress does anything in moderation, it's a sign of giving away breadcrumbs hoping that will sate the national hunger for change and allow the gov't to kick the can down the road another 60 years. We know better at this point.

1) wholly created in the fact there's no " new green deal" details...its an idea and a dream all at once right now, with very little substance


2) .you don't rebuild something that is working #1 nation in all regards and AOC proposal is to bring in a socialist system...that is not how we got to where we are. It could be a quick and hasty fall from the top if we embark on this journey. Perhaps some are happy with that , which I can understand since many don't have national pride.

3) congress does things in moderation with regards to the economy because an economy is fragile and they understand that. Look at Africa nations who said let's kick out white people without any sort of strategy or incrementalism...it looks good on paper but in reality you need stepping stones or risk destroying your countries economy . There's very few nations that were able to make major changes overnight and the outcome was positive (except clearly accepting a technological advance with superior use case economically)

You believe that reducing coal and starting more green energy jobs will create more jobs? At best it would create equal to the jobs being lost, again I'd like to either talk facts or common sense. The nations who embarked in this path full steam are hurting . The ones who attempted to go socialist are having riots in the streets, lack of jobs, the population cannot be sedated. Again you're saying a lot of things now that simply go against facts or economic common sense.

 

[ineedsleep212]

Nice to see this thread is going how I should've expected it to turn into .

Out here shytting on that loser McCaskill who is still yapping instead of disappearing and these Republican clowns .

 

[Secure Da Bag]

1) wholly created in the fact there's no " new green deal" details...its an idea and a dream all at once right now, with very little substance

You watched the same video I did. The guy says clearly that Pelosi would create the new committee for the New Green Deal initiative. The committee's job is to work out the details and vote on them before it goes out to the whole of congress. So of course, there's no details, right now. No details, doesn't mean no vision. And it never has.

2) .you don't rebuild something that is working #1 nation in all regards and AOC proposal is to bring in a socialist system...that is not how we got to where we are. It could be a quick and hasty fall from the top if we embark on this journey. Perhaps some are happy with that , which I can understand since many don't have national pride.

What's working exactly? Everyone knows the recession is coming. Ripping up regulations was a mistake. Tax cuts were a mistake.
In terms of how we got to where we are today, let's not pretend capitalism got us here all on its lonesome. This country is about democracy and not being economic slaves (oh, the irony). It's not about being the bastion of capitalism. If capitalism is where people place their national pride, then we are truly in the sunken place.

3) congress does things in moderation with regards to the economy because an economy is fragile and they understand that. Look at Africa nations who said let's kick out white people without any sort of strategy or incrementalism...it looks good on paper but in reality you need stepping stones or risk destroying your countries economy . There's very few nations that were able to make major changes overnight and the outcome was positive (except clearly accepting a technological advance with superior use case economically)

Those African nations had no one skilled or qualified enough to take over those farms or industries. That's why they failed. If there were as many black people equally as experienced as their white counterparts, those African nations would have been fine. The issue there was there wasn't. We clearly don't have that problem here in the US. Also, AOC or anyone else progressive has made any statements on transitioning the country overnight. They've only said the transition has to be done, be done thoroughly, and needs to take priority. You assume too much on how Dems or Progressives will proceed on this.

You believe that reducing coal and starting more green energy jobs will create more jobs? At best it would create equal to the jobs being lost, again I'd like to either talk facts or common sense. The nations who embarked in this path full steam are hurting . The ones who attempted to go socialist are having riots in the streets, lack of jobs, the population cannot be sedated. Again you're saying a lot of things now that simply go against facts or economic common sense.

More jobs in manufacturing, maintenance, support, and operation in green jobs. Yes. Equal to or more than coal jobs. Yes. Germany went full steam with a bad rollout and being an early adopter. Other countries are doing fine in their green jobs/tech initiatives. Norway, Sweden, Finland, and Denmark aren't rioting because of socialism. But because of immigration. France is rioting because of Macron pushing more capitalist economics and those capitalists getting tax breaks while making everyday products in France more expensive.

The New Green Deal is not the arbiter of death (or anything bad for that matter) you make it out to be. Certainly not at this nascent stage.


EDIT: Green New Deal: what is the progressive plan, and is it technically possible?

How would it work?
The Sunrise Movement’s Green New Deal would eliminate greenhouse gas emissions from electricity, transportation, manufacturing, agriculture and other sectors within 10 years. It would also aim for 100% renewable energy and includes a job guarantee program “to assure a living wage job to every person who wants one”. It would seek to “mitigate deeply entrenched racial, regional and gender-based inequalities in income and wealth”.

Other groups have floated a more flexible vision. Greg Carlock, an energy expert writing for the group Data for Progress, proposed reaching 100% clean or renewable energy in 15 years, allowing more time to decarbonize other sectors.

Demond Drummer, founder of the New Consensus thinktank, said it was working on a plan that will require a reimagining of the whole US economy.

“You can’t address the climate crisis without these other issues being addressed as well,” he said. “The entire economy is built around fossil fuels. The same economy that creates rampant poverty and wage stagnation is the economy that’s built around fossil fuels.”

Is it technically possible?
With enough money and political will, the US electric grid could make major changes. Currently, the US gets 17% of its power from renewable energy and less than half of that is from wind and solar, the quickly growing renewable sources, according to the Energy Information Administration. Nuclear power, which uses mined uranium but is carbon free, makes up 20% of the grid.

Turning to all-renewable power would require large amounts of battery storage, for when the wind isn’t blowing and the sun isn’t shining. The technology is not available but it is advancing.

Christine Tezak, an analyst at ClearView Energy Partners, said decarbonizing electricity in 10 to 15 years would be “practically overnight in infrastructure terms”, even if policymakers allowed low-polluting technologies too. A mid-century goal would be more reasonable, she said.

Decarbonizing the rest of the economy would be “an even heavier lift, particularly given what we consider to be the absence of a bipartisan catalyst of any sort in the next two years”, she said.

This is ambitious. 10 years? It could be done, yeah. But how is very important. I'm hopeful, but not completely convinced. Although, I'm not as pessimistic as you are @Perfectson . But I see your concern.