Africans sold Africans to Europeans, but to what extent?

[NZA]

Which makes you think maybe the hebrew israelites were right when they say the blacks in the Americas are not related to the blacks in west africa totally(since you will have some mingling going) and we are the true Israelites.

there is nothing to support that west africans are hebrews or even semites

 

[bouncy]

Ants have slaves also.

That was a good learn but, not true slavery. He said they take the ants when they are young and trick them into thinking they are a part of that society so the ant doesn't know it's a slave. Slavery as we know it, is not like that. The slave KNOWS his life sucks, and wants a way out. This is why there are always slave revolts.

 

[LionofJudah]

Which makes you think maybe the hebrew israelites were right when they say the blacks in the Americas are not related to the blacks in west africa totally(since you will have some mingling going) and we are the true Israelites.

I think anybody with common sense can see that Negroes in America and country-born Africans, and even Africans born in America, are two different types of people. The white man and many Negroes will claim race mixing has caused this difference, but nah...we just aren't African.

 

[bouncy]

there is nothing to support that west africans are hebrews or even semites

To me a lot of what they're saying does make sense when I put it all together. If I just go by mainstream learning yeah but, when you take into account the bible's version of history, and history written in mainstream books, they do have a valid argument.

I remember watching a show that came on in the middle of the night on the discovery channel, and they were tracking the true hebrews, which meant they had to listen to all the things that were being teached. This meant listening to some blacks who claimed they were the descendents of the jews. When the host asked the white guy in israel this he laughed and claimed it's not possible BUT, when the host took a trip to south africa to hear the people's claim he noticed they did have the same type of ways of doing things as the "jews" in israel. Mind you, this was in a remote part of south africa not in the city where they could have merged with other jews. They then did a DNA test and sure enough the south africans had the same genes as some of the whites who claimed to be the true jews. It was a shocker to everyone else accept the black jews. The white guy was acting funny, and didn't want to believe it. I say that to say, since africans did take slaves of people who weren't part of their group, and it is known the israelites left egypt some of them could have been captured and sent of to other lands. Then as time went on sent to the americas. This is why we are called the lost tribe of israel.

EDIT:Here's what I was talking about:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/israel/familylemba.html
"In an interview with NOVA, team member Dr. David Goldstein commented on the team's findings: "The first striking thing about the Y chromosomes of the Lemba is that you find this particular chromosomal type (Cohen modal haplotype) that is characteristic of the Jewish priesthood in a frequency that is similar to what you see in major Jewish populations. Something just under one out of every 10 Lemba that we looked at had this particular Y chromosomal type that appears to be a signature of Jewish ancestry. Perhaps even more striking is the fact that this Cohen genetic signature is strongly associated with a particular clan in the Lemba. Most of the Cohen modal haplotypes that we observe are carried by individuals of the Buba clan which, in Lemba oral tradition, had a leadership role in bringing the Lemba out of Israel."

What this study shows is that the Lemba, and more specifically some members of the Buba sub-clan, seem to have an ancestral connection to Judaic populations. Like an oral history, but written in the letters of their DNA, the Lemba Y chromosome hands from father to son a living record of the past."

 

[emoney]

To me a lot of what they're saying does make sense when I put it all together. If I just go by mainstream learning yeah but, when you take into account the bible's version of history, and history written in mainstream books, they do have a valid argument.

I remember watching a show that came on in the middle of the night on the discovery channel, and they were tracking the true hebrews, which meant they had to listen to all the things that were being teached. This meant listening to some blacks who claimed they were the descendents of the jews. When the host asked the white guy in israel this he laughed and claimed it's not possible BUT, when the host took a trip to south africa to hear the people's claim he noticed they did have the same type of ways of doing things as the "jews" in israel. Mind you, this was in a remote part of south africa not in the city where they could have merged with other jews. They then did a DNA test and sure enough the south africans had the same genes as some of the whites who claimed to be the true jews. It was a shocker to everyone else accept the black jews. The white guy was acting funny, and didn't want to believe it. I say that to say, since africans did take slaves of people who weren't part of their group, and it is known the israelites left egypt some of them could have been captured and sent of to other lands. Then as time went on sent to the americas. This is why we are called the lost tribe of israel.

EDIT:Here's what I was talking about:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/israel/familylemba.html
"In an interview with NOVA, team member Dr. David Goldstein commented on the team's findings: "The first striking thing about the Y chromosomes of the Lemba is that you find this particular chromosomal type (Cohen modal haplotype) that is characteristic of the Jewish priesthood in a frequency that is similar to what you see in major Jewish populations. Something just under one out of every 10 Lemba that we looked at had this particular Y chromosomal type that appears to be a signature of Jewish ancestry. Perhaps even more striking is the fact that this Cohen genetic signature is strongly associated with a particular clan in the Lemba. Most of the Cohen modal haplotypes that we observe are carried by individuals of the Buba clan which, in Lemba oral tradition, had a leadership role in bringing the Lemba out of Israel."

What this study shows is that the Lemba, and more specifically some members of the Buba sub-clan, seem to have an ancestral connection to Judaic populations. Like an oral history, but written in the letters of their DNA, the Lemba Y chromosome hands from father to son a living record of the past."

The Lemba have Yemeni Y-DNA

The Lemba case actually doesn't help BHI argument IT HURTS IT.

One of BHI Main claims is that the Jews in Israel are fake, if this true.....they would be invalidating the Lemba who share genetic similarities with those same Jews (at least on their paternal side)

 

[bouncy]

The Lemba have Yemeni Y-DNA

The Lemba case actually doesn't help BHI argument IT HURTS IT.

One of BHI Main claims is that the Jews in Israel are fake, if this true.....they would be invalidating the Lemba who share genetic similarities with those same Jews (at least on their paternal side)

Ok but, the story is still the same in it's essence. Blacks are the lost tribe of isreal. WE WERE NEVER TAUGHT THIS IN MAINSTREAM SOCIETY. Maybe they have it wrong in some sense but, maybe most of them are fake. In every story there will be some truth to cover up the majority of it being lies. The point is if we were never taught this story imagine how much we aren't taught.

I think the bigger picture to this is someone can be related to you even though you look nothing alike(even though we know this), and this is a great blow to the way the world is ran. Religion is controlling this world, and race is the underlying current that moves it along. If people found out that blacks, orientals, and indians, all have a place in being a chosen people you can't separate people. Once you learn the true way this world is ran you would get why this is so big.

 

[LionofJudah]

The Lemba have Yemeni Y-DNA

The Lemba case actually doesn't help BHI argument IT HURTS IT.

One of BHI Main claims is that the Jews in Israel are fake, if this true.....they would be invalidating the Lemba who share genetic similarities with those same Jews (at least on their paternal side)

It doesn't hurt it at all. We've never claimed the Lemba.

 

[MostReal]

To me a lot of what they're saying does make sense when I put it all together. If I just go by mainstream learning yeah but, when you take into account the bible's version of history, and history written in mainstream books, they do have a valid argument.

the BHI have a valid argument but there is some holes in there as well.



The thing that bothers people about the BHI is their brash behavior combined with some of the truth telling. While I don't fully agree with everything they say...they have some points that is hard to refute with sound logic, bible understanding, and common sense. This is what makes people come up against them so hard because some of that stuff starts adding up & people get


on topic I love this convo and it needs to be had. I always wondered what native Africans say about us and learn about us in school. Is it cacology education or do they have their own African history version.

 

[Crakface]

Lemme say off top that I don't like or support c00ning, self-hate, or meaningless bickering.
This thread isn't about the Africans that were stolen by Europeans. This is referring to the Africans that were sold or traded by our own.
European Americans favorite phrase when the topic of slavery comes up is "Africans sold other Africans into slavery" like it's some veto for the all the destruction their ancestors inflicted. But I seriously doubt Africans realized how inhumane those Euros would treat slaves in the Americas.
I'd like to address us selling our own, and hopefully learn something from the different perspectives of HL.


African American descendants of the slave trade:
Why do you think we were "picked" out of all the Africans?
Were we criminals and captives of war?
Were we Hebrews with no real connection to the native Africans?
Do you feel any animosity towards our brothers and sisters across the atlantic?


Africans that maintained their family names:
What do your parents and grandparents say about slavery?
Do they feel any guilt for their direct ancestors supposed role in the Euro slave trade?
If you went to school in (West) Africa, what did they teach with regards to human history, and specifically the Euro slave trade?
What did Africans gain by selling their own? It isn't like they needed anything else...
Do you feel African American slaves and their descendants are tainted? Do you look down on us?



Links and references are also welcome

The first slaves were rounded up by Magellan and brought to the Pope at that time who liked the black slaves so much he mandated that it was ok to enslave black people in particular. Cacs went to the coast of Africa to round up slaves. It wasnt until Columbus found America for cacs that the Race began to colonize the Americas using the new labor theyd become accustomed to. With the church, heads of various cac nations and England allowing random cacs to setup franchises there was a boom. Obviously, it wasnt enough to just grab a few slaves around the coast so they setup deals with africans, raided weaker villages, setup division/wars among africans to obtain slaves from the losing side, etc, to get the demand for black labor which was going for around 25 dollars per slave. They'd expect them to work for a year (because they'd die after that typically) but many lived past this time, so even if they died the slave owner was because he got a return on his investment, PLUS some before his slave died.

 

[Crakface]

Ants have slaves also.

Thats just how cacs justify their mistreatment of the people they exploit. Now that they're pulling away from religion to justify their guilt they have to come up with more scientific reasons why its ok to enslave powerless people.

 

[emoney]

1) Who cares about 90% of the shyt we talk about on here? This place is for discussion and nobody is forcing you to reply. I could be wrong, but your posts suggests that you're angry that this is even a discussion. If I'm wrong and you would like to contribute:

Whos an afrocentric and why is that negative? We live in a eurocentric society where we revere Alexander the Greek, Caesar, Napoleon, and I can go on. I'd like to know what the brothers and sisters of HL know about OUR leaders and how slavery differed.

Again, if you'd like to contribute:
What do your parents and grandparents say about slavery in West Africa?
What did Africans gain from Europeans? I keep seeing "money", but Africa was/is the richest continent in the world and Africans were doing just fine without Europeans.
Do you feel African American slaves and their descendants are tainted? Do you look down on us?
Did you go to school in west Africa? If so, what do they teach with regards to the history of Euro Slave trade?

Any books, lectures, links would be appreciated.

I'm not angry I think it's just a foolish thread, It seems like your trying to make African slavery seem more humane and I have a problem with that. It's not only disengenous but it's also racist because your basically saying Africans can't be as savage as Europeans. I wan't to be equal with Europeans in ALL THINGS...even in barbarity.

How can you ask me who is Afrocentric and why it's negative and then follow that up with pointing out that we live in a Eurocentric society. If you know what Eurocentricity is then understanding and identifying Afrocentricity should be an easy task.

To answer your questions
1. It was bad and humane
2. The only Africans that gained were elites who were dealing with Moors (Arabs, Berbers) and Europeans.
3. Tainted? how can humans be tainted? I only look down on stupid people.

 

[NZA]

To me a lot of what they're saying does make sense when I put it all together. If I just go by mainstream learning yeah but, when you take into account the bible's version of history, and history written in mainstream books, they do have a valid argument.

I remember watching a show that came on in the middle of the night on the discovery channel, and they were tracking the true hebrews, which meant they had to listen to all the things that were being teached. This meant listening to some blacks who claimed they were the descendents of the jews. When the host asked the white guy in israel this he laughed and claimed it's not possible BUT, when the host took a trip to south africa to hear the people's claim he noticed they did have the same type of ways of doing things as the "jews" in israel. Mind you, this was in a remote part of south africa not in the city where they could have merged with other jews. They then did a DNA test and sure enough the south africans had the same genes as some of the whites who claimed to be the true jews. It was a shocker to everyone else accept the black jews. The white guy was acting funny, and didn't want to believe it. I say that to say, since africans did take slaves of people who weren't part of their group, and it is known the israelites left egypt some of them could have been captured and sent of to other lands. Then as time went on sent to the americas. This is why we are called the lost tribe of israel.

EDIT:Here's what I was talking about:
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/israel/familylemba.html
"In an interview with NOVA, team member Dr. David Goldstein commented on the team's findings: "The first striking thing about the Y chromosomes of the Lemba is that you find this particular chromosomal type (Cohen modal haplotype) that is characteristic of the Jewish priesthood in a frequency that is similar to what you see in major Jewish populations. Something just under one out of every 10 Lemba that we looked at had this particular Y chromosomal type that appears to be a signature of Jewish ancestry. Perhaps even more striking is the fact that this Cohen genetic signature is strongly associated with a particular clan in the Lemba. Most of the Cohen modal haplotypes that we observe are carried by individuals of the Buba clan which, in Lemba oral tradition, had a leadership role in bringing the Lemba out of Israel."

What this study shows is that the Lemba, and more specifically some members of the Buba sub-clan, seem to have an ancestral connection to Judaic populations. Like an oral history, but written in the letters of their DNA, the Lemba Y chromosome hands from father to son a living record of the past."

so are you saying that black people are the "true" israelites because a small subsaharan ethnic group is related to a white jew? does that then make the white jew a "true" israelite as well?

 

[emoney]

It doesn't hurt it at all. We've never claimed the Lemba.

"We've" who exactly are you speaking for? I thought you didn't belong to any particular sect.

 

[emoney]

I always wondered what native Africans say about us and learn about us in school. Is it cacology education or do they have their own African history version.

why would you care? You claim to not have any kinship to continental Africans then why would their affairs be of concern to you?

 

[LionofJudah]

"We've" who exactly are you speaking for? I thought you didn't belong to any particular sect.

Anybody who claims to be a Hebrew Israelite, otherwise known to people like you as a Black Hebrew Israelite. If you refute this, post proof of one of them claiming the Lemba. The Lemba are Hamites like the rest of the Africans.