We back.. MLB Thread
- Thread starter THASTUNNA
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NYChase718
Veteran
Since this seems to be the offseason thread:
I dont really give a shyt about this but I thought the name of the team was the Tampa Tampons
Scandals and locker room fukkery on deck
https://gamerant.com/mlb-the-show-22-lockout-impact-possible-delay-cancelation/amp/
I kinda dont mind tho,I need more time on my '21 Franchise wit The O's
I kinda dont mind tho,I need more time on my '21 Franchise wit The O's
NYChase718
Veteran
THASTUNNA
All Star
WAR is a counting stat that is very good at accounting for player value. It's not perfect but it is better than traditional box scores.
In a given year, the player with the highest WAR value won't always win the MVP. You could understand a gap of a few points. Maybe consider narrative as part of the voting process.
But there are some years where the difference between the top WAR player and the actual MVP are bordering on egregious, if not outright robbery.
1984 stands out as probably the worst of all time. That season, the AL MVP was Detroit Tigers reliever Willie Hernandez. Hernandez posted a 9-3 record with a 1.92 ERA and 32 saves, striking out 112 in 140.1 innings. A fantastic season for a reliever. But his actual WAR value was just 4.8. Certainly All-Star level. But typically a far cry from MVP caliber.
What makes it worse is that the 2nd place AL MVP wasn't particularly deserving of the award either. Kent Hrbek slashed .311/.383/.522 with 27 HR and 107 RBI. Again, quite good. He posted a WAR of 5.6 -- more deserving of the award than Hernandez. But that's still not the worst part of this.
All the way down at the bottom of the AL MVP voting...literally the bottom vote-getter, is Cal Ripken Jr. In 1984 Ripken slashed .304/.374/.510 with 27 HR and 86 RBI. But Ripken as a SS was so good defensively that his WAR value was 10.0.
Ten point zero. More than double Hernandez. And it is somewhat odd that voters did not recognize Ripken's greatness as an overall better player since they voted him as the AL MVP in 1983.
I haven't looked at every MLB season but I cannot imagine there has ever been an instance where someone was literally HALF as deserving of an MVP award as another player and yet still actually won it.
Other gaps in the 1980s include:
1985 -- Don Mattingly took the AL MVP with 6.5 WAR even though Rickey Henderson (his teammate) posted 9.9/
1985 -- Willie McGee took the NL MVP with 8.2 WAR (usually hard to argue against that epic season) but Dwight Gooden posted a fukking insane 13.3 WAR.
1987 -- George Bell took the AL MVP with 5.0 WAR. Roger Clemens posted 9.4.
1987 -- Andre Dawson won the NL MVP with 4.0 WAR. Tony Gwynn posted 8.6.
1989 -- Robin Yount won the AL MVP with 5.8 WAR. Bret Saberhagen posted 9.7.
**I can understand not choosing Clemens in 1987 and Saberhagen in 1989 if you believe that pitchers should not be eligible for MVP. Even with that argument, neither Bell in 1987 or Yount in 1989 led in WAR among position players. Those leaders would have been Wade Boggs and Rickey Henderson, respectively.
In a given year, the player with the highest WAR value won't always win the MVP. You could understand a gap of a few points. Maybe consider narrative as part of the voting process.
But there are some years where the difference between the top WAR player and the actual MVP are bordering on egregious, if not outright robbery.
1984 stands out as probably the worst of all time. That season, the AL MVP was Detroit Tigers reliever Willie Hernandez. Hernandez posted a 9-3 record with a 1.92 ERA and 32 saves, striking out 112 in 140.1 innings. A fantastic season for a reliever. But his actual WAR value was just 4.8. Certainly All-Star level. But typically a far cry from MVP caliber.
What makes it worse is that the 2nd place AL MVP wasn't particularly deserving of the award either. Kent Hrbek slashed .311/.383/.522 with 27 HR and 107 RBI. Again, quite good. He posted a WAR of 5.6 -- more deserving of the award than Hernandez. But that's still not the worst part of this.
All the way down at the bottom of the AL MVP voting...literally the bottom vote-getter, is Cal Ripken Jr. In 1984 Ripken slashed .304/.374/.510 with 27 HR and 86 RBI. But Ripken as a SS was so good defensively that his WAR value was 10.0.
Ten point zero. More than double Hernandez. And it is somewhat odd that voters did not recognize Ripken's greatness as an overall better player since they voted him as the AL MVP in 1983.
I haven't looked at every MLB season but I cannot imagine there has ever been an instance where someone was literally HALF as deserving of an MVP award as another player and yet still actually won it.
Other gaps in the 1980s include:
1985 -- Don Mattingly took the AL MVP with 6.5 WAR even though Rickey Henderson (his teammate) posted 9.9/
1985 -- Willie McGee took the NL MVP with 8.2 WAR (usually hard to argue against that epic season) but Dwight Gooden posted a fukking insane 13.3 WAR.
1987 -- George Bell took the AL MVP with 5.0 WAR. Roger Clemens posted 9.4.
1987 -- Andre Dawson won the NL MVP with 4.0 WAR. Tony Gwynn posted 8.6.
1989 -- Robin Yount won the AL MVP with 5.8 WAR. Bret Saberhagen posted 9.7.
**I can understand not choosing Clemens in 1987 and Saberhagen in 1989 if you believe that pitchers should not be eligible for MVP. Even with that argument, neither Bell in 1987 or Yount in 1989 led in WAR among position players. Those leaders would have been Wade Boggs and Rickey Henderson, respectively.
He hasn't played in a couple years anyway but one of the great tragedies in MLB history, imo. His '06 season was unbelievably dominant. Had to get Tommy John surgery before guys fully recovered like they do today. Wonder if his career woulda played out different if he came up today.
His injury mighta robbed @TrillaMonsoon of a World Series title.
Spring Training ain’t happening
Doctor Wily
CapcomSwag
I really hope the season gets canceled at this point & this sport undergoes a major reset.
They've broken what didn't needed to get fixed & they continuously lose premium athletes to Basketball & Football more than ever. I say this even as a Yanks fan that I wouldn't miss baseball in 2022.
They've broken what didn't needed to get fixed & they continuously lose premium athletes to Basketball & Football more than ever. I say this even as a Yanks fan that I wouldn't miss baseball in 2022.
I don't think they can afford to lose a season, this isn't 1994, the have isn't as popular, there is no Ripken game steak, or HR chase a few years later to get the fans to return. That said baseball does need done sought of reset. In my 30 years of watching the game has never been more boring. From the pace of play to the all or nothingness of the way the game is played now, it's boring
Saysumthinfunnymike
VOTE!!!
Couple NYY fans "baseball boring" cause they team trash 
Doctor Wily
CapcomSwag
1)Hardly anyone pitches to contact
2) Pure Contact hitters are unicorns In today's game as is
3) Running game is all but dead & only situational
4) as great as the shift is to save a lot of wear & tear from long innings ... it's all but killed the pull hitters in baseball.
Doctor Wily
CapcomSwag
It's more than that.Couple NYY fans "baseball boring" cause they team trash
Anyone paying attention 10+ years ago knew this was coming.
Francisco Liriano looked special when he came into the league.
Unfortunate that injuries got to him early.
It's applicable to a lot of guys but MLB pitchers throw way too many sliders in my view.