Social Democracy, yeah. The rest of it? No, it's not mutually exclusive. It's heavily influenced by Marxism.
The Official Socialism/Democratic Socialism/Communism/Marxism Thread
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Social Democracy, yeah. The rest of it? No, it's not mutually exclusive. It's heavily influenced by Marxism.
Therefore, post New-Deal America is a largely Socialist nation.
Marxists hated Social Democrats, and saw them as traitors/collaborators. Anyone claiming to be a Marxist should pick up a weapon and start their bloody revolution. That's precondition #1.
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Well, almost. There was definitely some highly progressive policies, some groundbreaking, in that period. A lot of it has been undermined post 1980 though, there is no denying it.
But post New-Deal America had a lot of animosity towards Socialism/Marxism too. McCarthyism, a new Red Scare, and crushing of the counter revolution movements during the 60s were significant, as well as stomping out the spread of socialism through proxy wars around the globe.
Madvillain
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Not to mention these sweeping reform policies were compromised and didn't always hit everyone (I think I remember for example rural Blacks losing out on some New Deal reform in order to get the legislation through)
I mean, I'm pretty Rawlsian in how I see things and in the end he saw property-owning democracy and democratic socialism as perhaps the only two ways for his conceptions of a just society to work. I think what gets lost in the fact that many people on here are definite and obstinate in their stances is that I'm probably more left than most people on this board, and in life generally. I'm just more willing to empathize with perspectives than my own and my critiques come from what I think is feasible because I think you and others cover saying what should be. Somebody's gotta be somewhat contrarian because the Coli conservatives are
.
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Will someone please think of those poor Scandinavian children? Poor kids over there will go to bed hungry tonight because the rations were low today and the universal healthcare death panel has put them on a mandatory death diet.
#savethesweedishkids
#savethesweedishkids
Broke Wave
The GOAT
I think I've given out more daps in this thread than any other thread save for Lakers/Pats ones 
Julius Skrrvin
I be winkin' through the scope
This sums up where I'm at for the most part when it comes to the socialist spectrum as well, generally. Reading Rawls Senior Year was
to me, perfect compromise for me as far as a relatively 'realistic' social goal in the near future
Broke Wave
The GOAT
How did you guys come to your current political views? @ everyone in this thread not just the socialists... we're you like this in college/highschool etc?
I used to be what you would call a "conservative" when I was young... like 11-12-13-14-15 (I was a braniac kid so I followed politics)... I rooted for Bush over Kerry in 2004 and supported the Iraq war (again I was a kid)
As I got older in highschool I fell into conspiracy theories... 9/11 stuff (
) and became a Ron Paul stan like heavy in the game from like 16-18... I still didn't really care about economics or how things like that worked so I thought Libertarianism was very rational, and it is at face value.
From like the financial crisis onward, I really wanted to understand what happened and I think that single event taught me more about anything than my years at college ever will. I formed my entire ideology based off really what happened in those few months and from then the missing pieces of the puzzle started to all fill in. I still am very hawkish probably because of my conservative leanings of the past and I am very pro liberty but I think the reality of the true workings of the world were made clear by the Lehman Collapse.
I used to be what you would call a "conservative" when I was young... like 11-12-13-14-15 (I was a braniac kid so I followed politics)... I rooted for Bush over Kerry in 2004 and supported the Iraq war (again I was a kid)
As I got older in highschool I fell into conspiracy theories... 9/11 stuff (
) and became a Ron Paul stan like heavy in the game from like 16-18... I still didn't really care about economics or how things like that worked so I thought Libertarianism was very rational, and it is at face value.From like the financial crisis onward, I really wanted to understand what happened and I think that single event taught me more about anything than my years at college ever will. I formed my entire ideology based off really what happened in those few months and from then the missing pieces of the puzzle started to all fill in. I still am very hawkish probably because of my conservative leanings of the past and I am very pro liberty but I think the reality of the true workings of the world were made clear by the Lehman Collapse.
Sweden is a Social Democratic country. They actually are not as "Socialist" as people think. What you guys really want is Social Democracy. Yet, you guys keep rambling on about marxist nonsense.
Julius Skrrvin
I be winkin' through the scope
I was pretty apathetic until college, but up till that point I certainly wouldn't call myself anything but a democrat. My mother is liberal (former socialist activist) and my dad is pretty moderate. Either way, it's impossible to be a conservative if you're a minority in the midwest/mid south unless you're a total fukk boy... You learn early off that these types of people are diametrically opposed to you early on because of your race, culture, or religion. Then I went to college and started reading more. Initially encountered that same Libertarian/Ron Paul conspiracy trap, but disengaged from it quickly within a couple of months. After a while I took pretty heavy political philosophy (from a libertarian dept) and science courses and got to where I am now.
"Marxist nonsense" was a key influence in the development of Social Democracy, as were other forms of Socialism. I think you're trying to paint an unrealistically narrow picture of what qualifies as Socialism.
This sums up where I'm at for the most part when it comes to the socialist spectrum as well, generally. Reading Rawls Senior Year was
Indeed, I need to re-read a lot of his stuff because I had a full course load at the time so I don't think I got as much out of it as I should have. I'd also like to read Sen's 2009 critique of some of Rawls' ideas. It's funny though, most of the people I feel like I agree with were students of Rawls at some point. But I get why people think I'm some corporatist on here is because I have a very moderate orientation about how I see things. I don't form opinions quickly and I'm more prone to criticism of institutions vs. people and I balance that out with what I think is feasible given the set of options in front of us. I like to know all the options someone has in front of them before I criticize them, I want all the facts I can get. I view elections as a means to determine the options that will be available once we have to govern. So I'm more likely to make a pure ideological critique during an election than when a government is set. It can lend to the idea of being protectionist over an administration.
I can't help that.
For whatever reason my grandfather was a Reagan Republican and all of his children were more to the left by different degrees to the than he was. It made for interesting Thanksgivings, but at the end we were all family and they are all good people. So that, the Rawlsian Difference Principle (among other things), and just life in general makes it so it so I'm hesitant to use loaded language like "good v. evil, etc." I think someone can mean well and just be entirely wrong.With that said, in a lot of ways this thread is a socialist propaganda thread lol, and I think to be fully balanced we should talk about where socialist societies are failing (if you consider them socialist that is, and if not then why), and where they can improve and what they should improve. I think that's something @The Real or @Type Username Here would have to do because I'm not the expert there (and I just don't feel like playing contrarian this time) and you seem to be the biggest proponents of socialism.
African-Americans were denied numerous New Deal benefits. Southerners did not want them empowered.
Type Username Here
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How did you guys come to your current political views? @ everyone in this thread not just the socialists... we're you like this in college/highschool etc?
I used to be what you would call a "conservative" when I was young... like 11-12-13-14-15 (I was a braniac kid so I followed politics)... I rooted for Bush over Kerry in 2004 and supported the Iraq war (again I was a kid)
As I got older in highschool I fell into conspiracy theories... 9/11 stuff (
From like the financial crisis onward, I really wanted to understand what happened and I think that single event taught me more about anything than my years at college ever will. I formed my entire ideology based off really what happened in those few months and from then the missing pieces of the puzzle started to all fill in. I still am very hawkish probably because of my conservative leanings of the past and I am very pro liberty but I think the reality of the true workings of the world were made clear by the Lehman Collapse.
I used to be a big Che stan back in the day, but I didn't really fully realize what I was stanning. I became a bit more moderate in the early 2000s. I had my Socialist awakening in the the latter stages of my Marine Corps enlistment, but it really took off after I volunteered for and voted for Obama. I was naive and fell for it. It was one of the greatest lessons I have ever learned my life. It opened my eyes to a lot of blatant shyt, and I realized that standing for principles was more important than defending a politician or succumbing to the fear of the other side winning.
Thanks Obama
