The Official Socialism/Democratic Socialism/Communism/Marxism Thread
- Thread starter Type Username Here
- Start date
Thats a well supported argument. Well done.The problem is it doesn't work.And it's anti liberty.
Its a unicorn.All failed attempts at it are tossed aside as not being socialism, Nazi Germany, which did nationalize industries, is considered in no way socialism. Communist Russia which leads all economies in death toll, is tossed in the bushes as not a form of socialism/central planning.
The corrupt South America Socialist states are tossed out as well.
Cuba tossed in the bushes.
Socialist China apparently never existed, only the capitalist model they have now is referenced in discussion.
Yet what we have now is "accurately" labeled capitalism
At this point it needs to be explained what exactly socialism is... Enlighten me, and rid me of my ignorance.
I agree with most of what you said. Not sure where you got the idea that I'm some raging socialist.
All failed attempts at it are tossed aside as not being socialism, Nazi Germany, which did nationalize industries, is considered in no way socialism. Communist Russia which leads all economies in death toll, is tossed in the bushes as not a form of socialism/central planning.
The corrupt South America Socialist states are tossed out as well.
Cuba tossed in the bushes.
Socialist China apparently never existed, only the capitalist model they have now is referenced in discussion.
Yet what we have now is "accurately" labeled capitalism
At this point it needs to be explained what exactly socialism is... Enlighten me, and rid me of my ignorance.
My bad.
Julius Skrrvin
I be winkin' through the scope
@Type Username Here
We will begin with short updates on major economic developments since December:
Obama's minimum wage policy,
the Federal Reserve's "tapering policy" and the new Janet Yellen leadership,
slowdowns in China and the emerging markets, and
Thomas Piketty's new book Capital in the 21st Century on capitalism and inequality.
We will devote major discussion to:
The chief causes and social effects of increasingly unequal wealth and income distributions
The myth of returning manufacturing jobs in the US
We will begin with short updates on major economic developments since December:
Obama's minimum wage policy,
the Federal Reserve's "tapering policy" and the new Janet Yellen leadership,
slowdowns in China and the emerging markets, and
Thomas Piketty's new book Capital in the 21st Century on capitalism and inequality.
We will devote major discussion to:
The chief causes and social effects of increasingly unequal wealth and income distributions
The myth of returning manufacturing jobs in the US
All failed attempts at it are tossed aside as not being socialism, Nazi Germany, which did nationalize industries, is considered in no way socialism.
Communist Russia which leads all economies in death toll, is tossed in the bushes as not a form of socialism/central planning.
The Nazi nationalization narrative is usually greatly exaggerated by Libertarians at mises.org and on Fox News, among other places.
Hitler promised the aristocratic and other elites of Germany that they'd get to keep their wealth in order to secure their support, and he wasn't lying- they remained wealthy. He nationalized specific industries, especially Jewish-dominated ones, and even then, not completely, in the "Socialist" way you cite in the example of Communist Russia. You can even look up the profit margins of Volkswagen, Audi, BMW, and Daimler-Benz during the Nazi years, since the auto industry is often cited as a target of German socialism- they were considerable. Furthermore, they quickly reprivatized in the 30s, which most other Capitalist countries did not:
http://www.ub.edu/graap/nazi.pdf
Abstract:
The Great Depression spurred State ownership in Western capitalist countries. Germany was no exception; the last governments of the Weimar Republic took over firms in diverse sectors. Later, the Nazi regime transferred public ownership and public services to the private sector. In doing so, they went against the mainstream trends in the Western capitalist countries, none of which systematically reprivatized firms during the 1930s. Privatization in Nazi Germany was also unique in transferring to private hands the delivery of public services previously provided by government. The firms and the services transferred to private ownership belonged to diverse sectors.
Try Sherri Berman's book The Primacy of Politics: Social Democracy and the Making of Europe’s Twentieth Century, it should be around Ch. 6.
OMG I BEEN TRYING TO FIND A BOOK LIKE THIS FOR YEARS
The traditional definition of fascism is usually along those lines. Combine socialist nationalization and forced collectivism with right wing nationalism and classical liberal modernism.
I always though fascism was a perverted form of nationalism that rejects traditional cultural conservatism as a way to fight increased left wing totalitarianism.
My point was that the negative and catastrophic results of central planning throughout history are largely cast aside and ignored. You need only look through this thread...
Its amazing.
If you step back and take look at the discussion objectively, what's really being debated are the virtues of socialism vs the faults of capitalism.
How anyone thinks the result of such a debate can be anything other than a lambasting of capitalism is beyond me.
I'm not saying any of the arguments(in this thread) are unfounded or wrong(though some are). I'm just making an observation.
As long as white supremacy exists, Socialism is just the new slavery. White people cant even stop being racist, so how are we going to look at socialism as the solution to societies problems. It isnt as long as the people with power hate people that are non-white because of their skin color.
Capitalism is a unicorn too. There aren't even any working examples in existence. All Western countries are some mix of capitalism, cronyism and communism.
All failed attempts at it are tossed aside as not being socialism, Nazi Germany, which did nationalize industries, is considered in no way socialism. Communist Russia which leads all economies in death toll, is tossed in the bushes as not a form of socialism/central planning.
The corrupt South America Socialist states are tossed out as well.
Cuba tossed in the bushes.
Socialist China apparently never existed, only the capitalist model they have now is referenced in discussion.
Yet what we have now is "accurately" labeled capitalism
At this point it needs to be explained what exactly socialism is... Enlighten me, and rid me of my ignorance.
Also,
@ hating socialism, and then asking for someone to explain what it is to you.
I agree.Capitalism is a unicorn too. There aren't even any working examples in existence. All Western countries are some mix of capitalism, cronyism and communism.
Also,
