The “Islamic Dilemma” conversation on PIERS MORGAN?

[CrushedGroove]

Not a Piers Morgan fan. Wes Huff is a legit scholar and historian though.

 

[DoubleClutch]

In related news… the Mahdi is here!

New update to Islam

New Manmade ruler for a Manmade religion

@merklman will you bow to your new leader?

Notice this guy mentioned Paul in his speech

Paul really is the biggest threat to you non Christians

@2 Up 2 Down this is the cult your should be worried about

 

[merklman]

LMAOOO U WEIRDOS TRYNA SCHOOL ME ON MY OWN HISTORY WIT THE UTMOST CONFIDENCE WILL NEVER NOT BE FUNNY

U ARE TALKING ABOUT SEPHARDIC JEWS OF TODAY... BUT WHAT WE CALL SEPHARDIC NOWADAYS IS BASED ON CUSTOMS, BECAUSE MIZRAHI JEWS ARE LABELED SEPHARDIC BASED ON CUSTOMS ... SO IN TERMS OF RELIGION, WE SAY SEPHARDIC (MIDDLE EASTERN) OR ASHKENAZI (EUROPEAN) .... THATS LIKE THE JEWISH VERSION OF SHIITE VS SUNNI

YOURE NOT A VERY INTELLIGENT GUY, ARE U?

JEWS COME FROM JUDEA... ARABS COME FROM SAUDI ARABIA. NOT ROCKET SCIENCE HERE, MY PEDO PRAISING FRIEND.

EVERYONE KNOWS "PALESTINIANS" ARE JUST A BLEND OF DIFFERENT ARAB ETHNICITIES

THE ONLY NOTABLE "PALESTINIAN" IN HISTORY (YASSER ARAFAT) SERVED IN THE EGYPTIAN ARMY FOR FUX SAKE

YOUR SPECIAL NEEDS ASS DIDNT EVEN KNOW WHO SEPHARDICS WERE, OR WHERE THEY LARGELY ORIGINATED FROM WHEN I ASKED YOU YESTERDAY, AND YOU HAD TO RUN TO GEMINI TO LEARN HOW THEY WERE NOT EXTERMINATED BY CHRISTIANS IN SPAIN - THEIR BLOODLINE SURVIVED VIA PROTECTION FROM THE MUSLIM MOORS

Can you answer what Sephardi translates to in English? I repeat - its impressive how you make yourself look dumber with each passing reply


Seriously, I am happy to continue schooling your dumb zionist pea brain, clearly your rabbi sucked a lot brain cells out of your head during your circumcision- SAD

Everyone (including you) knows the majority of Jews/Zionists living in palastine are illegal terrorists (per international law) from across Europe and the Middle east. Literally no ties back to palastine.

 

[merklman]

LOOK AT U PLAYIN SEMANTICS NOW LMAO


HADITH ARE RECORDS OF THE SAYINGS, ACTIONS, AND APPROVALS OF MUHAMMAD


MUSLIMS FOLLOW HADITH AND THAT IS THE WIDELY ACCEPTED HADITH + THE ONLY ONE THAT MENTIONS HER AGE VERY CLEARLY


SO EITHER WAY, YOU DOIN YASELF EXTRA DIRTY HERE AND CLEARLY PROJECTING WIT ALL THE PEDO TALK


TIME 2 FALL BACK YOUNG'N

Semantics?

You said you'll quote from the Quran, I am asking you to share said quote from the Quran - you fukking dimwit .. I'll give you another chance- please share the evidence from the quran, you disgusting paedophile

Do you need to me to continue schooling you? I should start charging you

 

[DoubleClutch]

Oh so you are a QURAN ONLY type of Muslim?

Ducking and dodging what’s written by your most trustworthy scholars and “chain of transmission”?

You just buried yourself you know that….Right?

Now I see why you don’t talk about Islam

You’re a HALF MUSLIM

So are you “Quran only” or what?

 

[Sccit]

YOUR SPECIAL NEEDS ASS DIDNT EVEN KNOW WHO SEPHARDICS WERE, OR WHERE THEY LARGELY ORIGINATED FROM WHEN I ASKED YOU YESTERDAY, AND YOU HAD TO RUN TO GEMINI TO LEARN HOW THEY WERE NOT EXTERMINATED BY CHRISTIANS IN SPAIN - THEIR BLOODLINE SURVIVED VIA PROTECTION FROM THE MUSLIM MOORS

ROFLMFAOOOOOOOOO

YOU ARE EXTREMELY STUPID IF U THINK I DONT KNOW WHAT SEPHARDIC JEWS ARE HOMIE.

I AM PART SEPHARDIC AND HAVE SPOKEN ON SEPHARDIC JEWS MANY MANY TIMES ON THIS FORUM

MIZRAHI CLASSIFIES UNDER SEPHARDIC BECAUSE THEY USE THE SAME RELIGIOUS CUSTOMS WHICH DIFFERS FROM ASHKENAZI CUSTOMS

IM THE TEACHER HERE, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND

DO BETTER U DUNCE

 

[2 Up 2 Down]

Same with Micah 5:2 calling out Bethlehem as the Messiah’s birthplace.

Micah 5:2 -

Nativity of Jesus - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Spoiler

According to some scholars, the two Gospel accounts of the Nativity are historically accurate and do not contradict each other,[155] with similarities such as the birthplace of Bethlehem and the virgin birth. George Kilpatrick and Michael Patella state that a comparison of the Nativity accounts of Luke and Matthew show common elements in terms of the virgin birth, the birth at Bethlehem, and the upbringing at Nazareth, and that although there are differences in the accounts of the Nativity in Luke and Matthew, a general narrative may be constructed by combining the two.[156][157] A number of biblical scholars have attempted to show how the text from both narratives can be interwoven as a gospel harmony to create one account that begins with a trip from Nazareth to Bethlehem, where Jesus is born, followed by the flight to Egypt, and ending with a return to Nazareth.[158][159][160][161][162]

Neither Luke nor Matthew claims their birth narratives are based on direct testimony.[163] Raymond E. Brown suggested in 1973 that Joseph was the source of Matthew's account and Mary of Luke's, but modern scholars consider this "highly unlikely", given that the story emerged so late.[164]

Roman Catholic scholars, such as John L. McKenzie, Raymond E. Brown, and Daniel J. Harrington express the view that due to the scarcity of ancient records, a number of issues regarding the historicity of some Nativity episodes can never be fully determined, and that the more important task is deciding what the Nativity narratives meant to the early Christian communities.[165][166][167]

Critical analysis
Many scholars do not see the Luke and Matthew Nativity stories as historically factual,[4][1][2] regarding them as laced with theology and presenting two different accounts and genealogies.[168][169][170][171] For instance, they point to Matthew's account of the appearance of an angel to Joseph in a dream; the wise men from the East; the massacre of the innocents; and the flight to Egypt, which do not appear in Luke, which instead describes the appearance of an angel to Mary; the Roman census; the birth in a manger; and the choir of angels appearing to the shepherds in the fields.[172][168][169][4][1][170][171][2] Sanders considers Luke's census, for which everyone returned to their ancestral home, not historically credible, as this was contrary to Roman practice; they would not have uprooted everyone from their homes and farms in the Empire by forcing them to return to their ancestral cities. Moreover, people were not able to trace their own lineages back 42 generations.[1] More generally, according to Karl Rahner the gospels show little interest in synchronizing the episodes of the birth or subsequent life of Jesus with the secular history of the age.[5] As a result, modern scholars do not use much of the birth narratives for historical information.[168][170] Nevertheless, they are considered to contain some useful biographical information: Jesus being born near the end of the reign of Herod, during the reign of Emperor Augustus and his father being named Joseph are considered historically plausible.[168][173]

Most modern scholars accept the Marcan priority hypothesis, that the Luke and Matthew accounts are based on the Gospel of Mark, but that the birth narratives come from the evangelists' independent sources, known as the M source for Matthew and the L source for Luke, which were added later.[174]

While Géza Vermes and E. P. Sanders dismiss the accounts as pious fiction, Raymond E. Brown sees them as having been constructed from historical traditions which predate the Gospels.[175][176][177] According to Brown, there is no uniform agreement among scholars on the historicity of the accounts, e.g., most of those scholars who reject the historicity of the birth at Bethlehem argue for a birth at Nazareth, a few suggest Capernaum, and others have hypothesized locations as far away as Chorazin.[178] Bruce Chilton and archaeologist Aviram Oshri have proposed a birth at Bethlehem of Galilee, a site located 7 mi (11 km) from Nazareth at which remains dating to the time of Herod the Great have been excavated.[179][180] Armand P. Tarrech states that Chilton's hypothesis has no support in either the Jewish or Christian sources, although Chilton seems to take seriously the statement in Luke 2:4 that Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, to the city of David, which is called Bethlehem.[181]

Many view the discussion of historicity as secondary, given that gospels were primarily written as theological documents rather than chronological timelines.[182][183][184][185] For instance, Matthew pays far more attention to the name of the child and its theological implications than the actual birth event itself.[186]

Historical reliability of the Gospels - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Spoiler

Matthew and Luke​

[edit]
The consensus of scholars dates Matthew and Luke to 80-90 AD.[101][note 5] The scholarly consensus is that Matthew originated in a "Matthean community" in the city of Antioch, located in modern-day Turkey;[102] Luke was written in a large city west of Judaea,[103] for an educated Greek-speaking audience.[104] Scholars doubt that the authors were the apostles Matthew and Luke: it seems unlikely, for example, that Matthew would rely so heavily on Mark if its author had been an eyewitness to Jesus's ministry,[105] or that the Acts of Apostles (by the same author as the gospel of Luke) would so frequently contradict the Pauline letters if its author had been Paul's companion,[103][106] though most scholars still believe the author of Luke-Acts met Paul.[107] Instead, the two took for their sources the gospel of Mark (606 of Matthew's verses are taken from Mark, 320 of Luke's),[108] the Q source, and the "special" material of M and L.

 

[2 Up 2 Down]

Same with Psalm 22 describing hands and feet being pierced and lots being cast for his clothing.

Psalm 22 16-18

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 22:16-18 - English Standard Version

For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; they have pierced my hands and feet— I can count all my bones— they stare and gloat over me; they divide my garments among them, and for my clothing they cast lots.

www.biblegateway.com

16 For dogs encompass me;
a company of evildoers encircles me;
they have pierced my hands and feet[a]—

17 I can count all my bones—
they stare and gloat over me;

18 they divide my garments among them,
and for my clothing they cast lots.

footnote reads:
Psalm 22:16 Some Hebrew manuscripts, Septuagint, Vulgate, Syriac; most Hebrew manuscripts like a lion [they are at] my hands and feet

so it should read

For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; like a lion they are at my hands and feet

IMO, that makes more sense.

 

[Sccit]

Semantics?

You said you'll quote from the Quran, I am asking you to share said quote from the Quran - you fukking dimwit .. I'll give you another chance- please share the evidence from the quran, you disgusting paedophile

Do you need to me to continue schooling you? I should start charging you

YOU EMBARRASSED YOURSELF AND MAKE YOURSELF LOOK BAD DENOUNCING KEY ASPECTS OF YOUR OWN RELIGION

MUSLIMS HAVE FAR LESS HISTORY IN ISRAEL THAN JEWS. THATS AN INDISPUTABLE FACT.

DNA EVIDENCE 100% POINTS TO ALL
JEWS BEING FROM ISRAEL.. THAT EVEN INCLUDES THE MINORITY OF JEWS IN ISRAEL WHO SETTLED IN EUROPE POST EXILE

ONLY A RETARD ARGUES FACTS

GOTA SHUT MY PHONE OFF

SHABBAT SHALOM

 

[merklman]

Oh so you are a QURAN ONLY type of Muslim?

Ducking and dodging what’s written by your most trustworthy scholars and “chain of transmission”?

You just buried yourself you know that….Right?

Now I see why you don’t talk about Islam

You’re a HALF MUSLIM

Do you understand what the hadiths are? Do you know how many different books there are? And how many years after the prophets lifetime they were wriiten? The particular you and the paedophile sccit are jumping on, is generally considered to have a good chain of custody - however it is a single source which is not seen as highly as a multiple source account (ie. i told you something directly, vs i told the 1000 folks in conference, so 1000 people can attest to the same account, same source). For this reason it's contested, especially as other quotes around the topic even in Bukhari contradict the timeline, as well as the other hadith books . The hadith are essentially the New Testament, they are known to have some weak transmissions and definitely contradictions . That cannot be said of the Quran

 

[2 Up 2 Down]

And Daniel 9 is a literal countdown to when the “anointed one” would be cut off and that countdown lands right at Jesus crucifixion.

Daniel 9 - A True Biblical Interpretation

An explanation of Daniel 9 (Daniel Chapter 9). The book of Daniel is filled with Messianic illusions and calculations that Daniel pondering.

jewsforjudaism.org

Spoiler

It is essential to a correct understanding of Daniel 9, to point out that it is incorrect to read this passage as if it were speaking about the Messiah.

This may appear obvious to Christians since their translations have the word “Messiah” mentioned twice in this chapter; however, this is the result of a blatant and intentional mistranslation of the Hebrew word (משיח ~ Moshiach”).

This word literally means “anointed” and is an adjective as in the 1 Samuel 10:1-2 where the word clearly means an act of consecration. It is not a personal pronoun that refers to a particular individual called “The Messiah.” The word (משיח ~ Moshiach”) is used throughout Jewish scriptures no less than 100 times and refers to a variety of individuals and objects. For example:

Priests: Leviticus 4:3

Kings: 1 Kings 1:39

Prophets: Isaiah 61:1

Temple Alter: Exodus 40:9-11

Matzot ~ Unleavened Bread: Numbers 6:15

Cyrus ~ a non-Jewish Persian King: Isaiah 45:1

Even in Christian translations, the word Moshiach is translated 99% of the time as “anointed.” The only exception is twice in Daniel 9 verses 25 and 26. This inconsistency is even more blatant since Christian translators translate the word (משיח ~ Moshiach) as “anointed” one verse earlier when it is used in Daniel 9:24. In this instance, it is referring to anointing the innermost chamber of the Holy Temple is known as the “Holy of Holies,” (קדשים קדש ~ Kodesh Kedoshim). It is incorrect to translate this, as some missionaries do, to mean the “most holy one” in an attempt to have this refer to the Messiah rather than a place.

Therefore, in Daniel the passages should be correctly translated as:

Daniel 9:24 “Until an anointed prince” and not as “Until Messiah he prince.”

Daniel 9:25. “an anointed one will be cut off” and not as “the Messiah will be cut off.”

Additionally, in verse 25 there is no definite article (Hey ~ ה) before the word (משיח ~ Moshiach) and it is incorrect to translate this as “the Messiah” or “the anointed one” as if it were speaking about one exclusive individual. When translating correctly as an “anointed individual” the passages could be referring any one of several different individuals or objects that were anointed and not necessarily “the Messiah.”

A careful examination of Daniel 9 will lead to a clear understanding of exactly to whom and what this chapter is referring.

An additional mistake made by Christians is the translation of 7 and 62 weeks as one undivided unity of 69 weeks. The Christian version makes it sound as if the arrival and “cutting off” of the “Messiah” will take place sixty-nine weeks (483 years) after a decree to restore Jerusalem. They add the 7 and 62 weeks together and have one person (the Messiah) and two events occurring towards the end of the 69th week.

Actually, according to the Hebrew, the 7 and 62 weeks are two separate and distinct periods. One event happens after 7 weeks and another event after an additional 62 weeks.

Simply put, if you wanted to say 69 in Hebrew you would say “sixty and nine.” You would not say “seven and sixty-two.”

Furthermore, in Daniel, it is written: “7 weeks and 62 weeks rather than “7 and 62 weeks.” The use of the word “weeks” after each number also shows that they are separate events. The use of the definite article (ה ~ Hey) that means “the” in verse 26, “and after the 62 weeks shall an anointed one be cut off,” is sometimes deleted in Christian translations, but it's presence in the Hebrew original clearly indicates that the 62 weeks is to be treated as a separate period of time from the original 7 weeks.

The correct translation should be:

“ until an anointed prince shall be 7 weeks (49 years),” “then for 62 weeks (434 years) it (Jerusalem) will be built again but in troubled times.” Then after (those) the 62 weeks shall an anointed one will be cut off.” Daniel 9:24-25

Two separate events and anointed ones, 62 weeks (434 years) apart.

Christians also incorrectly translated the Hebrew (v'ayn Lo ~ לו ואין), at the end of Daniel 9:26. They translate it that he will be cut off “but not for himself,” as if it refers to someone being cut off not for himself but cut off for us and indicating a form of vicarious attainment.

However, nowhere in the Jewish bible are these words translated as “not for himself.” The Hebrew means “and he will be no more” literally “and no more of him” and indicates the finality of his demise. A similar usage of (v'ayn Lo ~ לו ואין), can be found in Jeremiah 50:32 where it is translated “no one”.

“The proud one shall stumble and fall, with no one to raise him up ( מֵקִ֑ים לו ואין ).

Here it refers to the demise of Babylon and has the same connotation that after the identified individual’s demise there will be no one to continue his rule.

Interestingly the Hebrew word (kares ~ כרת) translated as “cut off” biblically refers to someone who has sinned so grievously that they are put to death by heavenly decree as a divine punishment for their own transgressions.

An awareness of these eight mistranslations is essential to understanding the ninth chapter of Daniel. To recap:

1. (קדשים קדש) mean “holy of holies” not the “most holy one”
2. (דבר ~ Devar) that means “word” not decree.
3. (משיח ~ Moshiach”) means “anointed” not “Messiah” verse 23
4. (משיח ~ Moshiach”) means “anointed” not “Messiah” verse 24
5. “seven weeks and sixty-two” means two events one at 7 weeks and the other 62 weeks later not one event after a cumulative 69 weeks
6. (Hey ~ ה) mean “the”
7. (V'ayn Lo ~ לו ואין) mean “will be no more” not “not for himself”
8. (kares ~ כרת) means death to a transgressor that cuts off their relationship to God.

To understand the context when which it was written under

Maccabean Revolt - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Antiochus IV Epiphanes - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Seleucid Empire - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Hov]

Psalm 22 16-18

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 22:16-18 - English Standard Version

For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; they have pierced my hands and feet— I can count all my bones— they stare and gloat over me; they divide my garments among them, and for my clothing they cast lots.

www.biblegateway.com

16 For dogs encompass me;
a company of evildoers encircles me;
they have pierced my hands and feet[a]—

17 I can count all my bones—
they stare and gloat over me;

18 they divide my garments among them,
and for my clothing they cast lots.

footnote reads:
Psalm 22:16 Some Hebrew manuscripts, Septuagint, Vulgate, Syriac; most Hebrew manuscripts like a lion [they are at] my hands and feet

so it should read

For dogs encompass me; a company of evildoers encircles me; like a lion they are at my hands and feet

IMO, that makes more sense.

Nah, you're wrong on this

Because scholars tried to say the Hebrew text said "like a lone are my hands and feet" and that sounds like the end all be all right?

but there's a divine problem

The Septuagint - that predates Christ existence and is verifiedn- uses the Greek word ōryxan which literally means "they pierced" nowhere close to "like a lion"...so that means 200 years before this happened, the Jews reading Septaugint read it as "they pierced his hands and feet". The Dead sea scrolls which predate everything confirm this.

The truth is stranger than fiction my G.

And do NOT believe what I say or type. Go look it up right now

 

[merklman]

ROFLMFAOOOOOOOOO

YOU ARE EXTREMELY STUPID IF U THINK I DONT KNOW WHAT SEPHARDIC JEWS ARE HOMIE.

I AM PART SEPHARDIC AND HAVE SPOKEN ON SEPHARDIC JEWS MANY MANY TIMES ON THIS FORUM

MIZRAHI CLASSIFIES UNDER SEPHARDIC BECAUSE THEY USE THE SAME RELIGIOUS CUSTOMS WHICH DIFFERS FROM ASHKENAZI CUSTOMS

IM THE TEACHER HERE, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND

DO BETTER U DUNCE

The so called expert having to run to CHAT GPT and Gemini

You are a special case, you literally had no idea that jews existed in Spain yesterday, and were saved by the MUSLIM MOORs when they were expelled from spain. Additionally, you didnt even know "Sephardi" literally translates to Spain in English. The levels of stupidity in you are actually off the chain. Do you even realise the above screenshot with the breakdown adds up to >100%? The Mizrahi number (50%) combines Mizrahi and Sephardic . . Ie. subtract 20%, would infer there's around 30% Mizrahi's. . . What is the % of Ashkenazis? Your friend CHAT GPT says 30-40% You dumb paedophile motherfukker

Like i said, you manage to make yourself look dumber with every subsequent post. I would advise you to take the L and walk away, but this is rather entertaining watching you make a fool of yourself - so please, carry on

 

[Hov]

Daniel 9 - A True Biblical Interpretation

An explanation of Daniel 9 (Daniel Chapter 9). The book of Daniel is filled with Messianic illusions and calculations that Daniel pondering.

jewsforjudaism.org

To understand the context when which it was written under

Maccabean Revolt - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Antiochus IV Epiphanes - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Seleucid Empire - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I didnt even dive deep yet but you are aware (or whoever wrote this) anointed and messiah are interchangeable in this language right lol?

 

[merklman]

YOU EMBARRASSED YOURSELF AND MAKE YOURSELF LOOK BAD DENOUNCING KEY ASPECTS OF YOUR OWN RELIGION

MUSLIMS HAVE FAR LESS HISTORY IN ISRAEL THAN JEWS. THATS AN INDISPUTABLE FACT.

DNA EVIDENCE 100% POINTS TO ALL
JEWS BEING FROM ISRAEL.. THAT EVEN INCLUDES THE MINORITY OF JEWS IN ISRAEL WHO SETTLED IN EUROPE POST EXILE

ONLY A RETARD ARGUES FACTS

GOTA SHUT MY PHONE OFF

SHABBAT SHALOM

I think you embarrassed yourself when you displayed that you didnt know there were jews in Spain, or why they were expelled, or why they followed the Moors to Morroco, and that you had no idea what "Sephardic" meant


DNA evidence . . . try getting a DNA test in Israel - it's largely illegal, and we know why .

Palestinians hold more authentic DNA to the levant than you pasty european fakkits


It's best you shut your phone down, you're furious and crashing out. . I dont blame you, taking L's left and right