So I'm looking at the WWE Roster

[Straw Hat Luffy]

HHH can still go . The part timers are still the most over ppl on the roster. HHH is a legend

Of course they are the most over they are always involved in the biggest storylines year in and year out.

Check out mania.

Roman vs part timer in main event
undertaker vs
HHH vs
Cena vs
shane vs

half the roster in either a ic ladder match or andre battle royal

check out the last royal rumble winners
besides roman
it was orton, hhh, batista, cena.


why would anyone else be over?

 

[ÆTHER]

what's the difference between the modern day rock and Jericho and Finn Balor? Not saying he is a good promo Because he isn't but he can't write write his own ticket like Jericho and the rock. And the wrestling is most certainly held back by the ratings and the writers and the old guard.. Meltzer and Alveraz says the shyt every week.

So we both agree that Balor isn't a good promo with and without WWE writers so would him writing his own promos make a difference? Is it better for a guy to cut bad promos if he wrote them himself? I already said the WWE don't have the capacity to book everyone well into an entertaining, coherent product. That includes the writers. Did you watch WWE programming between 2006-2008 (the immediate years before they went PG) they were still TV-14 back then and except for the Shawn Michaels v Chris Jericho feud they were laying rotten eggs on a weekly basis. Everything was sacrificed at the altars of DX and John Cena on RAW during that period. It was so bad they turned TNA babyface. The same people who were in charge then are in charge now. So I'm supposed to believe that the people who have proved that they can't book a consistently entertaining product whether under TV-14 or PG conditions will suddenly magically improve because they've taken a break from using vulgarity and now they can get back in the saddle? Do you want to see 72 year old Vince McMahon re-open the kiss my ass club? Also why should I care that Meltzer and his buddy say that every week?

 

[Straw Hat Luffy]

So we both agree that Balor isn't a good promo with and without WWE writers so would him writing his own promos make a difference? Is it better for a guy to cut bad promos if he wrote them himself? I already said the WWE don't have the capacity to book everyone well into an entertaining, coherent product. That includes the writers. Did you watch WWE programming between 2006-2008 (the immediate years before they went PG) they were still TV-14 back then and except for the Shawn Michaels v Chris Jericho feud they were laying rotten eggs on a weekly basis. Everything was sacrificed at the altars of DX and John Cena on RAW during that period. It was so bad they turned TNA babyface. The same people who were in charge then are in charge now. So I'm supposed to believe that the people who have proved that they can't book a consistently entertaining product whether under TV-14 or PG conditions will suddenly magically improve because they've taken a break from using vulgarity and now they can get back in the saddle? Do you want to see 72 year old Vince McMahon re-open the kiss my ass club? Also why should I care that Meltzer and his buddy say that every week?

Balor is nothing special on the mic. However he is over and was a lot more over before but of course he got hurt and Vince punishes people who get hurt unless they are Roman so since his return Finn was off a ppv or 2 for no reason and ended up in feuds with Bray and Elias when he was the most over debuting because they made him seem important.

You already pointed it out. this is the same creative team that was trash ten years ago.


Rock did have promos back in the day but the difference between now in then. Promos or not, these guys are micromanaged and walking on egg shells during these promos because they can't be themselves and they aren't allowed to go a little off the script to be themselves as they were in the attitude era. Don't you remember Mick Foley told that story of Vince getting into braun face disrespecting the shyt out of him because he said title instead of championship? That's the type of shyt they deal with. Vince has a certain plan for you, its trash and doesn't fit you, it doesn't work, now hes pissed at you because his idea failed. Then if he just doesn't like you then you're fukked.

The guys with the most freedom are the part timers the jerichos because those guys been around forever and Vince has a closer relationship to those guys. Whatever jimmy jacobs wrote I'm pretty sure either if it was written for anyone else than Jericho he would have been like this shyt is stupid and since it is jericho he can give input and they will allow him to do it. I remember dean telling the story about how with jericho help convince vince to allowed the tacts in that asylum match. And jericho told the story of how him and aj showed Vince how good the styles clash was and should be considered one of his big moves. Or how the rumor of Jericho and LEsnar got into it and nobody got in trouble.But titus got suspended for that thing after Bryans retirement.

Yeah some of these flippy nikkas suck at promos but a majority of them are young and have enough time to learn.

 

[ÆTHER]

Balor is nothing special on the mic. However he is over and was a lot more over before but of course he got hurt and Vince punishes people who get hurt unless they are Roman so since his return Finn was off a ppv or 2 for no reason and ended up in feuds with Bray and Elias when he was the most over debuting because they made him seem important.

You already pointed it out. this is the same creative team that was trash ten years ago.


Rock did have promos back in the day but the difference between now in then. Promos or not, these guys are micromanaged and walking on egg shells during these promos because they can't be themselves and they aren't allowed to go a little off the script to be themselves as they were in the attitude era. Don't you remember Mick Foley told that story of Vince getting into braun face disrespecting the shyt out of him because he said title instead of championship? That's the type of shyt they deal with. Vince has a certain plan for you, its trash and doesn't fit you, it doesn't work, now hes pissed at you because his idea failed. Then if he just doesn't like you then you're fukked.

The guys with the most freedom are the part timers the jerichos because those guys been around forever and Vince has a closer relationship to those guys. Whatever jimmy jacobs wrote I'm pretty sure either if it was written for anyone else than Jericho he would have been like this shyt is stupid and since it is jericho he can give input and they will allow him to do it. I remember dean telling the story about how with jericho help convince vince to allowed the tacts in that asylum match. And jericho told the story of how him and aj showed Vince how good the styles clash was and should be considered one of his big moves. Or how the rumor of Jericho and LEsnar got into it and nobody got in trouble.But titus got suspended for that thing after Bryans retirement.

Yeah some of these flippy nikkas suck at promos but a majority of them are young and have enough time to learn.

Your post is proving my point. Nothing is going to change until Vince and co are gone. TV-14 or PG it's all the same. Scripted promos or unscripted promos (in an era where most of these dudes just suck regardless) it's all the same. As long as the people in power stay in power it's all going to be the same. The fish rots from its head.

 

[Slystallion]

We already established wrestling is also performance art and talent improves with age, wrestling has always trended older for the most part

As long as people can still physically look the part and they have endurance to do the moves and have full length matches

 

[Straw Hat Luffy]

Your post is proving my point. Nothing is going to change until Vince and co are gone. TV-14 or PG it's all the same. Scripted promos or unscripted promos (in an era where most of these dudes just suck regardless) it's all the same. As long as the people in power stay in power it's all going to be the same. The fish rots from its head.

I mean I don't think Vince gonna be running this for another 10 years. I mean its possible but that was my point of this thread because everyone is so young there is still room for everyone to grow in every area.

This might be a hot take but I feel like HHH will turn this around. HHH downside is he has a ego so huge where he has to be the credit of everything and needs to be in the hotest angles ever or taking pictures with talent succeeding. Vince is out of touch, stubborn, refuse to part ways from old mentalities and people, and just does what he wants anyways for ribs or anything related to that because why the hell not right its what he started to begin with.

 

[mrken12]

Too many goddam wrestlers man

And yet we're bombarded with rematches every week.

then what the fukk is it then since you know? Horrible worker/ great promo like Miz? Horrible worker/horrible promo like baron and Mahal? Horrible wrestler/ decent promo like braun only over because he is big AF? Tell me what it is you Jim cornette ass nikka.

Braun is far from a bad wrestler. He's definitely above average with promos too. However I agree that Corbin and Mahal both aren't good and have flopped in the main event scene.

 

[JerseyBoy23]

God damn, Charlotte is only 31

She looks like shes in her 40s

When you’re pops is an alcoholic and your brother dies at like 21, it has to age you. I gained respect for her after the Flair documentary.

 

[ÆTHER]

I mean I don't think Vince gonna be running this for another 10 years. I mean its possible but that was my point of this thread because everyone is so young there is still room for everyone to grow in every area.

This might be a hot take but I feel like HHH will turn this around. HHH downside is he has a ego so huge where he has to be the credit of everything and needs to be in the hotest angles ever or taking pictures with talent succeeding. Vince is out of touch, stubborn, refuse to part ways from old mentalities and people, and just does what he wants anyways for ribs or anything related to that because why the hell not right its what he started to begin with.

I'm weary of the idea that HHH could be some sort of saviour for WWE and not just because of the aforementioned ego. I'm weary because the only experience he has of running anything is NXT and there are a lot of factors to NXT's success that simply cannot be translated to the rest of the WWE. There's a difference in logistics and audience that make me think that one can't just transplant one product into the other. That's why I've always thought people thinking that NXT is a microcosm of how WWE would look like with HHH in charge need to be careful.

Firstly in terms of logistics one has to look at how the shows are produced. RAW is 3 hours long, Smackdown is 2 hours long plus an hour of 205 Live. That's 6 hours of content a week that needs to be filled on the main roster as opposed to the one hour of NXT. That's obviously a lot more work and it requires more people participating in the process to keep things running and that leads to things getting muddled up, too many cooks and all that. With NXT the team only have 1 hour to book and that's it. The workload is much lighter, it's easier to come up with ideas because you have a smaller sample size of people to work with. It's also easier to commit to booking decisions in NXT because everything is taped in bulk. Even if you second guess a decision that's been made or the direction a character takes there's nothing you can do it's been taped and you have to let it play out. On the main roster there's 6 hours of LIVE TV shot every week. They're living week by week, moment by moment, if Vince sees a change he wants to make he can make it there and then instead of riding it out. Which is why a lot of things are stop-start and inconsistent because Vince is calling audibles all over the place. Can HHH handle that?

Secondly in terms of the audience NXT is straight up nothing more than an Indy with a big budget. Even visually in terms of the ring mat, the guardrails, where and how it's taped. It's designed to look like ROH. Look at the roster throughout its time and it's filled with guys who are from ROH and other Indy promotions. NXT is designed to cater for the hardcore fans. WWE as a whole isn't designed to cater for the hardcore fans, what's the point? they already watch the product anyway (that's why they complain about it on the internet). WWE for the sake of its own survival (seeing as it's profit margins are paper thin despite the fact that they make more money than they've made before) need to keep growing their fan base. As the Attitude Era showed the best way to do that is to tap into the societal zeitgeist. Vince jacked Heyman's ideas and talent but Heyman was able to tap into the spirit of the times with grunge inspired gimmicks, nu-metal, Jerry Springer type storylines and just straight up trash TV. WWE was a product of its time and WWE was a product representative of the people at the time. HHH has tapped into the pro wrestling zeitgeist at the moment in terms of who he signs but the fact of the matter is that wrestling has never been as far from society as it is now, wrestling has never been as niche a product as it is now. It exists in a bubble. It's a hot bubble right now but a bubble nonetheless. Whenever WWE try to refer to something in contemporary pop culture it's always done in a clumsy and unsophisticated way. Having been in the wrestling and WWE bubble for so long are HHH and WWE even capable of stepping out of the bubble and moulding a product that is representative of the spirit of these times and the people in it? Straight up does anyone even want them to? Knowing WWE they'd probably book Tamina as a trans man and have her win the WWE Championship.

 

[Mr. Jack Napier]

Some of the talent looks good for their age. I keep forgetting me & Lana are the same age.

 

[Silkk]

That's a positive... even though wwe doesn't use it as a positive.
but with how deep this roster is... Taker and HHH guys don't need to be wrestling anymore.
I give guys like Jericho passes since his runs been fire and he wrestles full time so hes not undercutting anyone.

fukk That Noise

Long as Taker can walk he should be wrestling

 

[Straw Hat Luffy]

fukk That Noise

Long as Taker can walk he should be wrestling

Dog even after last mania?

 

[Silkk]

Dog even after last mania?

Just give him a 15 minute entrance and a Rock vs Eric Rowan match

 

[Green Ranger]

If that was the case he wouldn't be this over with the fans and he wouldn't be a champion.

And we care because as a wrestling fan we want these wrestling events to be better than what they are??

There always quick to call someone a mark or smark they freaking forget this shyt is wrestling and most people want to watch a good match with good wrestling and a good backstory that is compelling and keeps you on the edge of your seat interested.

Look at the work AJ did with Roman you think AJ is getting the push he is now without making Roman look like a million bucks. You are a fool if you didn’t think that impress Vince.

Being able to work a good to great match and be a good/great worker freaking matter yet there always trying to discredit/downplay it.

The problem nowadays is the work is great but the backstory character development is lacking.

 

[Amor fati]

"the only guys over 35 are...."

*Proceeds to list thirty names*

The reason why guys like Hunter still wrestle is because people still remember him. He has charisma. Ask Bret Hart and he'll tell you Hunter is trash in the ring. Hes right. But here we are 20 something years later and hes still relevant. And speaking of old guys, imagine the power Batista would have if he returned now that he is a movie star. Its not about how good your matches are, its all about your star power. Theres a reason why there's a 30 for 30 on Ric Flair on ESPN and not on the Dynamite Kid.

From that entire jumbo list of guys under 35 theres only a handful that I think are entertaining or have personality.

There probably would have been a documentary on Dynamite kid but he burnt all the bridges for being a major dikkhead towards people. Also dude didn't really have the mentality of a star.