Russia's Invasion of Ukraine (Official Thread)

Orbital-Fetus

Orbital-Fetus

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Neo The Resurrected ONE said:
Putin still has a lot of options before he gets to the point that you're talking about, breh.

And one could argue, that any action short of actually putting a nuke in the air still gives him an offramp.

That's the only action he can't come back from.
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he will never be seen as an honest broker again.
he is a proven liar that has been holding the rest of Europe hostage with gas and now everyone is coming out and saying it.
and now plans are finally being put into play to sever Russia in potentially permanent ways from the West.

i really don't see what an off ramp for Putin looks like at this point.
the longer the negotiations go on the more it looks like Ukraine is the one using that time to stall and power up rather than Russia.

USSR ran into a wall in 1991.
Russia gonna pour all the jelly on itself in 2022.
 
hashmander

hashmander

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ADevilYouKhow said:
:wow:
1280px-Seal_of_the_United_States_Department_of_Commerce.svg.png
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damn a pirate ship and a middle finger with a gold ring we straight robbing you and showing it off (or another thing that could be interpreted as we're fukking you).
 
NZA

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Neo The Resurrected ONE said:
I have to agree. The more I think about what brehs said earlier (NATO countries are willing to sacrifice Ukraine to get Russia out of the paint), the less likely it seems.

One thing brehs have to keep in mind is that all NATO leaders are having to deal with the Ukraine question domestically.

We are already hearing loud voices in the general public call for NATO to institute an NFZ.

And no, I'm not saying they should. But I am saying that there will be forces domestically who seek to take advantage of it and want to appear "more hawkish" on Ukraine.

We see it right now with Republicans. They haven't quite perfected their message yet, but they're trying to.

My point being, NATO can't just sit back and watch Ukraine burn and Russia's demise in a vacuum. Whatever happens there has the potential of blowing back domestically.

And if Putin or even Zelenskyy intimate that Russia is willing to withdraw if NATO promises to ease sanctions, and NATO is refusing to agree, there's no NATO leader that can withstand the fallout from that domestically.

I have to maintain my earlier stance. I believe that if Russia is willing to withdraw and make concessions (and I believe one of those concessions may be a removal of Putin as Russia's president, either that or a repeal of the measure that was passed allowing him to be president for life - they're going to try to limit his power in some capacity, they may even make a play for the release of Navalny, I dunno), then NATO will be willing to ease sanctions sooner rather than later.

I'm looking at it through the domestic political prism and I think that has to be considered when looking at it from the geopolitical stance.
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sending jets through poland might be enough to satisfy calls for NFZ. either that or make everybody watch this movie:

i dont see how anybody removes putin without a bullet - and nobody in russia or outside it has the will or guts to do it.
 
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