MischievousMonkey
Gor bu dëgër
What do you do about the rules that structure the physical world? They clearly exist and are outside of the physical realm, no?
Physicalists get in there...
- Thread starter MischievousMonkey
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010101
C L O N E*0690//////
what now¿*
MischievousMonkey
Gor bu dëgër
Physicalists believe that everything is physical. That there's only one realm in existence, the realm of physical things. So people who speaks of things that are out of the physical world are just not knowledgeable enough to understand the physicality of what they describe. For example we don't know if ghosts exist or if paranormal activities are a thing, but if they were, physicalists would say that there is a material, physical explanation for this that science just isn't aware of yet.
My claim is that clearly the physical world is bound to strict rules that are located outside of it. Plato style. The reaction between carbon, O2 and fire creating CO2 is a rule that never changes and presumably never changed. That rule is not physical. It's not written anywhere, we can't change it, we can't toy with, we can't delete it. We cannot create new rules. They are preset. We just discover some.
So I'm asking what they think about that and how can they think that everything is physical given these elements.
Your just going to pretend alot of "physicalist" exist on this forum
?Heres a google for the confused people.
In philosophy, physicalism is the metaphysical thesis that "everything is physical", that there is "nothing over and above" the physical,[1] or that everything supervenes on the physical.[2] Physicalism is a form of ontological monism—a "one substance" view of the nature of reality as opposed to a "two-substance" (dualism) or "many-substance" (pluralism) view. Both the definition of "physical" and the meaning of physicalism have been debated.
Physicalism is closely related to materialism. Physicalism grew out of materialism with advancements of the physical sciences in explaining observed phenomena. The terms are often used interchangeably, although they are sometimes distinguished, for example on the basis of physics describing more than just matter (including energy and physical law). Common arguments against physicalism include both the philosophical zombie argument[3] and the multiple observers argument,[4] that the existence of a physical being may imply zero or more distinct conscious entities.
?Heres a google for the confused people.In philosophy, physicalism is the metaphysical thesis that "everything is physical", that there is "nothing over and above" the physical,[1] or that everything supervenes on the physical.[2] Physicalism is a form of ontological monism—a "one substance" view of the nature of reality as opposed to a "two-substance" (dualism) or "many-substance" (pluralism) view. Both the definition of "physical" and the meaning of physicalism have been debated.
Physicalism is closely related to materialism. Physicalism grew out of materialism with advancements of the physical sciences in explaining observed phenomena. The terms are often used interchangeably, although they are sometimes distinguished, for example on the basis of physics describing more than just matter (including energy and physical law). Common arguments against physicalism include both the philosophical zombie argument[3] and the multiple observers argument,[4] that the existence of a physical being may imply zero or more distinct conscious entities.
010101
C L O N E*0690//////
what makes you say the governing rules are located somewhere outside the physical¿
the rules are observed in the physical & shown to be consistent that's how they fall into the category of rules
rather be a physicalist than a spiritualist or whatever else ha i like to stand on something of substance
*
I dnt get why u say that "rule isnt physical"...
Since u can always duplicate that reaction and result, it's a physical rule...
The rules are written... but we can toy with them... that's what experimentation is....
This is why they think everything is physical...
I personally dont believe everything thing is physical... theres elements In different states of being that u wouldnt consider "physical"...
I always thought about this for example... semen....
Semen has cells in it that are alive and when combined with an egg can make a human.
Where does the energy come from to put life into that cell in the 1st place.
Which is a similar question to what would cause a "big bang"...
This is where the proof of things being beyond physical lay...
But since science only deals with certain tangible aspects of our reality, we'll never go beyond that
MischievousMonkey
Gor bu dëgër
I say this for several reasons.
What makes me say that is that these rules exist independently from the material world but still manage it. Why?
They structure the physical world and describe all its potentialities. Potentialities aren't physical things. If it hasn't happened yet in the physical world, the rules establishing it could happen already exist. For example, before Edison or Tesla discovered electricity, the properties of electricity and how it could work already existed, as a potential. Brehs just didn't know about it.
Another reason is that the rules structure the physical world but are not submitted to that same structure. The physical world is subject to the rules of space and time, but not rules. Rules are like the code of a videogame. You cannot interact with the rules of a perfectly coded videogame from the videogame itself. They are outside of the game world.
I doubt you can be a spiritualist in the same sense that one is a physicalist.
MischievousMonkey
Gor bu dëgër
What is that rule made of then?This is literally the definition of a physical rule
It describes a physical phenomenon, so that is a physical rule in that sense... But that's not what's discussed here breh. We are wondering if it is a physical object, as in pertaining to the physical world, the world of material, substantial, palpable, objects.
MischievousMonkey
Gor bu dëgër
Its essence is not physical. It describes a physical phenomenon, but it is not a physical object. So it cannot be in the physical world. Can you touch that rule? Can you interact with it? Can you locate it?
You can only work with the results of that rules and that's how we discover its limits or new rules altogether.
When I said toy I meant change it.
There is no such thing as physicality
That's according to science
Atoms are 99.9999997% "empty space". That empty space is an energy field.
The tiny part that isn't empty space is just a more condensed form of energy.
Reality appears "physical" because of how the brain deciphers it.
That's according to science
Atoms are 99.9999997% "empty space". That empty space is an energy field.
The tiny part that isn't empty space is just a more condensed form of energy.
Reality appears "physical" because of how the brain deciphers it.
010101
C L O N E*0690//////
the rules are already established we observe how the physical reality is then acknowledge it.........the rules are not separate from the physical matter of reality*
Hold up... I think this is 2 different conversations here bro....
I get what ur saying now... like u cant touch the rule...
What that is, is called "Theory" most of science is theory ... the process of fire creating CO2 is theory.
U cant touch gravity... but it exist. That's theory..
U can test it and recreate it... just like u can with ur C02 example...
But the question u were seeming to ask originally... was things beyond the physical.
Telepathy, telekinesis, spirit, ghost, souls... certain forms of unexplained energy, life, yada yada yada.
My conclusion is still the same... known science, commercial science, institutional science will never exam these topics.... but I'm sure theres scientist somewhere that know alot about the matter
Reading this reply.... I understand what ur talkin about more.. and me bringing up Theory fits right in...
Real science... the type to really try to figure out what's going on... extensive, honest testing and experimentation... looking for actual results, not just trying to confirm what they already want to believe...
Should get to a point where they push our knowledge of theory (rules)...
Then we can see the beyond physical nature life (the code)...
And start to better understand the programmer (God/creator)
Again, This wont happen or already has happened but that knowledge will be kept from us
