Let's take a look back at all the sneak dissing Biggie did aimed at Pac on LAD

[GetInTheTruck]

He was a flawed character as I would expect a young black man in his early 20s from a dysfunctional family, a by product of dysfunctional society, to be

A charlatan? I dont see how the record supports that. How can a person who was the most genuine rapper, who spoke the most freely, put his life on the line, poured emotions over beats be involved in trickery?

I can appreciate hes not everyones cup of tea. Especially for a kid who grew up in NY in the 90s. Yall had your own shyt. I was a west coast head through and through so I have my own biases

I grew up in the 90s, I was raised in that era, the Nas, Bigs, Wu Tang, Lost Boys, Mobb, BCC etc. It never appealed to me musically, lyrically etc
So I can appreciate diversity in tastes.

And I definitely dig what youre sayin about his fans. Being from Toronto, I cant speak on what the Black American experience was with regards to Pac, but from everything Ive heard and read and understand Pac was loved. Maybe not in the tri state area as much but pac was loved. My cousins from the Bay, they love him out there. I been out there. I know Pac was loved.

Over here though, yeah it was white boys and immigrants. The white boys for their own reasons, I cant speak on the white boys. But us immigrants, fukk yeah we fukked with Pac, Pac was a soldier, Pac spit real shyt, all my boys, Africans, Afghans, Arabs, Russians etc. Hence his global appeal to this day,.




Again, I dont see how you can say Pac wasnt comfortable in his own skin. Are we talking about the same rapper? Hows the man who made Shed So Many Tears, If I Die Tonight, Death Around the Corner, Hail Mary, etc not comfortable in his own skin? Hell yes, he had a larger than life personality, hell yes he was a character, hell yes he had a battery in his back to some degree. I dont dispute all that, I just understand why he was that way

Hmm, I feel like you are kind of stereotyping young black males here, and it demonstrates my point that Tupac was a media manufactured phenomenon...he's a big reason why most of America outside the hood, regardless of race, view young black males as bandana wearing, tattoo covered thugs.

Big's take on the street life wasn't as profound as pacs, but it was way more authentic and honest.

 

[Techniec]

And I'd take Big's quality music over Pac's quantity. Pac had a crazy work ethic but his quality was hit & miss a lot of times. When Big was in the studio he created classics & some of the best songs of all time from his classic albums.

bruh, I can fully respect that. Again, to me Biggie is a rap God. I will never speak down on him. I can appreciate and respect anybody who considers Big not just their personal favourite MC of all time but the best.

But to clarify, when we talk about Pacs quantity, were not considering anything post Makaveli right?

 

[Techniec]

Hmm, I feel like you are kind of stereotyping young black males here, and it demonstrates my point that Tupac was a media manufactured phenomenon...he's a big reason why most of America outside the hood, regardless of race, view young black males as bandana wearing, tattoo covered thugs.

Big's take on the street life wasn't as profound as pacs, but it was way more authentic and honest.

I dont think so I respectfully disagree. I dont think its stereotyping to say a young black man from a broken home, caught between different upbringings, son of black panthers, caught up in bullshyt street shyt, thrown millions of dollars at , at a young age will display some dysfunctionality. I think its an honest assessment.

The issue isnt was Pac a fukk up in a lot of ways or did he or not make mistakes in judgement. The issue is, would anyone else in that similar situation with that same upbringing be any different?

 

[Nomad1]

Like I said logic is an alien concept to biggie stans. I got a good memory and you equate that to stan logic. Posting that Pac clone like it means something.

 

[Nomad1]

Hmm, I feel like you are kind of stereotyping young black males here, and it demonstrates my point that Tupac was a media manufactured phenomenon...he's a big reason why most of America outside the hood, regardless of race, view young black males as bandana wearing, tattoo covered thugs.

Big's take on the street life wasn't as profound as pacs, but it was way more authentic and honest.

How was pac not comfortable in his own skin? In his ressurection doc he explained everything in his life (including doing ballet and other artistic shyt). But when I hear Biggie vids he doesn't seem as humanly as Pac. It's always about hood nikka shyt, getting money, ans fukking bytches. His own mom exposed his image as some fake persona. So whose a more media-manufactured? And Pac did promote some negativity but to dismiss the fact that biggies music is filled with violence and misogyny from start to finish is pretty laughable. At least Pac had positive music and was community oriented. In a doc Biggie said he doesn't care about people in Brooklyn he onl wanted to help his "homeboys".

 

[Starman]

I was a pretty big Big fan, and love both his albums but I found that shyt bytchmade and distasteful.

 

[Knicksman20]

bruh, I can fully respect that. Again, to me Biggie is a rap God. I will never speak down on him. I can appreciate and respect anybody who considers Big not just their personal favourite MC of all time but the best.

But to clarify, when we talk about Pacs quantity, were not considering anything post Makaveli right?

I'm talking his whole catalogue Fam. I like Pac & feel a lot of his music but I know he was hit or miss with his albums as a whole.

 

[Techniec]

I'm talking his whole catalogue Fam. I like Pac & feel a lot of his music but I know he was hit or miss with his albums as a whole.

Well catalogue, I dont consider anything post Makaveli. He has six albums to me, including Thug Life, and the first two were definitely hit and miss. His last four to me was either classic or near classic. But hey, music is subjective.

To me Thug Life, MATW, AEOM and Makaveli, is the greatest run by a rapper ever. We're talking like 67 songs of which over 60 are great songs at the least. And thats in 2-3 years.

 

[Nomad1]

And it's so fukking obvious to see who was born in the 90s.
The classic revisionist history that's filled in biggies legacy is astounding. He was very talanted and is easily a top 10 rapper (even top 5) but nikkas are being stupid in this thread.
Biggie almst got dpg and snoop klled when he said "why is snoop and tupac shooting a video in our city?" keep in mind tupac wasn't even there. So a song that was going to be a tribute got turnd into a beef song and biggie put fire into the east west war (because of that mobb deep responded and it added a lot of rappers into the mix) and tupac and dpg made ny 87 as a response and that was tupacs first diss toward any east coas rapper. Essntially Pac responded to what biggie started.
And people are still blaming Pac for biggies death? Biggie went to LA with pressure of Puffy and he went to soon. I was living in LA at the time and nikkas really wanted his head. It was puffys fault for puting his star rapper at risk.
90s babies make me laugh

 

[sporticus]

Youre mad, how did pac influence Biggie?? I keep hearing pac stans say this but it isnt true.

pac is the one that came looking for Biggie, hes the one who was pushing for them to be friends, hes the one that was all over an unsigned rappers dikk that didnt know that this guy wanted from him, hes the one that was trying to get Big and his crew roles in Above the Rim..Biggie's music from his demos to Party and Bullshyt to RTD was pretty much the same hardcore Ny talk. Pac didnt influence, flow, lyrics or shyt. Big by all accounts didnt seem bothered or remotely interested in Pac, from the time they met to when Pac was mad Big had denied him the attention he wanted.
Everybody at the time was on Bigs dikk, including Pac. Infact Pac is the first true Stan.
I dont think Big cared for Pac cause he just didnt care for him as a rapper. Big was aware of his own strengths as an MC, and saw Pac as a successful but weaker Mc than himself. If youre Biggie with all that talent, you might respect the likes of Jay, Nas and Camron. He never respected Pacs skills and I think this is what tipped Pacs mental. Big never cared for dude and people blow up their friendship when it was non existant.

In the narrative that's been created since the Pac/Big era, people have needed to have a cohesive storyline.

It doesn't make for a very interesting story to say Pac was a regular dude instead of a superthug or a revolutionary. It more boring to say that Pac just lashed out at the wrong dude.

They need a villain for their hero. So they create one. Everything from Big knowing about Pac's "robbery" to Puffy and Big having him killed. It'll never end because they need that to make the story complete.

 

[Bboystyle]

whats this? another biggie/Pac thread nearly 20 years later after their death? stans still going at each other's throats?

GOATS

 

[vaudevillevillain]

Them abc rhymes and verses about suckin dikk aint beatin Pac, fukk is you on?

abc rhymes

and yea that dikk sucking line was questionable, but that was ONE LINE and we all know big was a goon

pac was living a lie and you know it

the mic skills displayed on RTD & LAD is second to none breh

 

[Billy Ocean]

abc rhymes

and yea that dikk sucking line was questionable, but that was ONE LINE and we all know big was a goon

pac was living a lie and you know it

the mic skills displayed on RTD & LAD is second to none breh

Pac was one of the most incredible MC's ever but Biggie was just on another level. Biggie rhymed like he was put on this Earth by God JUST to rhyme. It just seemed so natural from him.

 

[Mike Ock]

Hmm, I feel like you are kind of stereotyping young black males here, and it demonstrates my point that Tupac was a media manufactured phenomenon...he's a big reason why most of America outside the hood, regardless of race, view young black males as bandana wearing, tattoo covered thugs.

Big's take on the street life wasn't as profound as pacs, but it was way more authentic and honest.

It seems more as dude was just presenting the dis-advantages in tupac's childhood in his post. He was one person, other rappers chose to emulate. There's a reason why people felt he was relatable. Big was incredibly dope. But pac made his lyrics more personal which makes people value it beyond just entertainment and transitions into real life situations. I think Big's "Victory" verses are the most well crafted and executed verses I've ever heard in hiphop. But when I listen to a song like "White Man's World" and hear bars like:

" My homeboy's doing time, his baby's mama be stressing/
Sheddin' tears, when her son finally asks that question/
'Where my daddy at? Mama, why we live so poor?
Why you crying?
Heard you late night, thru my bedroom door/
Well do you love me mama, why the keep on callin' me ******?/
Get my weight up with my hate, AND PAY 'EM BACK WHEN I'M BIGGER!"

Simple but relatable shyt supersedes the most smoothest of lyrical flows.

 

[Crucial]

The worst thing about these two GOATS is that if they were never beefing, misguided or obsessive fans wouldn't be fooled into thinking that their works should be compared at all!

I understand the "Who was the best at....." arguments, but hip hop is broad enough for all styles to be appreciated. This back and forth arguing is continuing to push hip hop into the decline that the original (unnecessary) beef started.

Just my 2 cents.