Let’s say Mase Doesn’t retire, how much longer do you think his run would have lasted?

[Billy Ocean]

Mase would have ran rap. A lot of revisionist history in here. He was the second coming of LL Cool J. His career would have been as long as he wanted it to be. He could make songs for the girls and the thugs. Let's not pretend he wasn't about to put his foot on Jay-Z's neck with the little beef they had.

Y'all saying that Mase would've fizzled out because of Double Up but I you guys forget that he has already checked out by the time it got released. He wasn't even doing promotions for it. Everyone he ran with is still here doing it and fabulous who completely jacked his lane is still here


Jay was not going to smash Mase. Mase could out rap Jay then and he still can now. Imaginary Player sounds ridiculous if it's about Mase who was way more successful than Jay at the time. The biggest line is about Mase being able to add more diamonds to a watch that has diamonds. Wow, such ether. He dropped a solo album that he didn't want to drop and didn't promote because he didn't want to be there. The shiny suits didn't make Mase a cornball. Stop it. He was still dropping Murda Mase type verses here and there and his Ma$e very were still lyrically fire. If you're going to shyt on him for wearing the shiny suits then you shytting on Biggie and the Lox too. Shiny suits got all those dudes rich. L's on the street? Pre internet? Ok. Harlem World was a money grab to get the homies paid. Cam and Mase writing all the raps for a 5 man group. No one was holding that against Mase. Mase took his foot off the gas for whatever personal reasons but we're not going to pretend like Mase got kicked out the game and didn't walk away from it at the highest level. That's revisionist history. Let's not do that

Son, Mase run was over. Get over it. Double Up flopped and got bad reviews across the board. That Harlem World group album flopped, got bad reviews and was corny as fukk. Mase was the face of that. By '99 the DMX, Jay, Murder Inc, Pun shift already took place and Mase was considered campy and soft in comparison. Also he took Ls on the street (Baby Maine and Wu) and you're out of your mind if you think he was fukking with Jay if it went there. Jay's a superior MC (then and now) and I actually KNOW nikkas that know Mase and he definitely had some fake jewelry. Imaginary Player is just a small dose of what Jay woulda served him.

And I'm saying this as a big Mase fan. Look at my search history...I've said numerous times on here that I think he's the nicest Harlem MC ever. But reality is reality. His trajectory already made a sharp decline before he retired. Any talk of " he woulda did this" or "he woulda did that" if he didn't retire is pure conjecture without anything tangible that would back it up. He had a nice couple years run and that's it. And nothing's wrong with that. The VAST majority of rappers have only a 3 or 4 year run where they are poppin. He's not an anomaly.

 

[get these nets]

Jay did 5 Mil in 98. NOTHING was stopping Jay-Z except perhaps Biggie living. And even then it wouldn’t have “stopped” him he just wouldn’t have been able to claim KONY

Jay Z was superstar by 98 when Mase was actually active

Dapped these posts, but hear me out.
Just like Jay's talent was shining and moving units because he was plugged into the Def Jam's system.
The Bad Boy machine and momentum was still rolling post-Biggie's death. Funded in large part by Mase's first album success. And Puffy and team were still making hit songs in that era.
And Mase was fully in the high profile/radio friendly rap feature lane after his album came out.

I might have the dates wrong, but he occupied that lane ahead of Jay's success of Volume 2. Mase feature for an R&B song almost guaranteed that it would get spins.

You are right that Jay peaked commercially, before Mase retired, so "slows momentum/vie for airplay and chart space" would be more like it, rather than" block the rise."

 

[Ziggiy]

Dapped these posts, but hear me out.
Just like Jay's talent was shining and moving units because he was plugged into the Def Jam's system.
The Bad Boy machine and momentum was still rolling post-Biggie's death. Funded in large part by Mase's first album success. And Puffy and team were still making hit songs in that era.
And Mase was fully in the high profile/radio friendly rap feature lane after his album came out.

I might have the dates wrong, but he occupied that lane ahead of Jay's success of Volume 2. Mase feature for an R&B song almost guaranteed that it would get spins.

You are right that Jay peaked commercially, before Mase retired, so "slows momentum/vie for airplay and chart space" would be more like it, rather than" block the rise."

I firmly believe that the combination of Jay/Dame/Biggs weren’t going to be denied. They had a vision and a mission and they were hell bent on accomplishing it. I maintain that Jay was always going to be a star. With Biggie’s passing he went on to become a SUPERSTAR and I don’t see Mase stopping that. Jay is a better (for lack of a better word) wave rider than Mase turned out to be. Plus Jay was co-Ceo of Roc-A-Fella while Mase was just an artist under Puffy. Jay was going to make SURE he stayed top dog on his own label. Meaning the best beats, features, and opportunities were going to HIM. Puffy was still going to be in charge of Mase’s ultimate fate as an artist, which as history proves isn’t the best position to be in long term.

Jay was better set up to flourish. More talented. More ambitious. And had the uncanny ability to hop on the most poppin trends and reinvent himself.

 

[Ghostface Trillah]

Son, Mase run was over. Get over it. Double Up flopped and got bad reviews across the board. That Harlem World group album flopped, got bad reviews and was corny as fukk. Mase was the face of that. By '99 the DMX, Jay, Murder Inc, Pun shift already took place and Mase was considered campy and soft in comparison. Also he took Ls on the street (Baby Maine and Wu) and you're out of your mind if you think he was fukking with Jay if it went there. Jay's a superior MC (then and now) and I actually KNOW nikkas that know Mase and he definitely had some fake jewelry. Imaginary Player is just a small dose of what Jay woulda served him.

And I'm saying this as a big Mase fan. Look at my search history...I've said numerous times on here that I think he's the nicest Harlem MC ever. But reality is reality. His trajectory already made a sharp decline before he retired. Any talk of " he woulda did this" or "he woulda did that" if he didn't retire is pure conjecture without anything tangible that would back it up. He had a nice couple years run and that's it. And nothing's wrong with that. The VAST majority of rappers have only a 3 or 4 year run where they are poppin. He's not an anomaly.

How was his run over when he just became the number one rapper on the number one rap label in NY? I knew of Baby Maine,most people had never heard that name until Jimmy said it on Hot97 arguing with Mase and most people still don't even know about the Wu shyt until Ghostface rapped about so you bringing up these "street L's" and saying that they lowered his stock in the industry not true. Jay took L's on the streets, I know legendary rappers who took L's on the streets but that's not what this is about.

See this is what I'm talking about with revisionist history. You bring up Murder Inc and Ja Rule and this great shift. Mase and Ja albums came out the same month. Guess whose album went #1 with next to no promotion because he already had a foot out of the game? Every rapper you named in the shift knew and respected Mase as a dope rapper. Did they respect the bad boy formula and shiny suits? No. Mase still had 99% of female rap fans checking for him. None of those dudes you named had that. That crown was his to lose and he left it. It ain't no shoulda coulda woulda, you guys like using how it turned out to control the narrative on how it used to be. Mase had a weird career but we're not going to act like he was never at the top of the mountain and didn't leave at the top.

And like I told the other dude regarding Mase vs Jay-Z. Feel free to post Mase's last verse against Jay's or post I'm no Killa against Imaginary players. I'll wait.

 

[nieman]

His sophomore album was not going to be big regardless. I still think he bounces back with a third album in maybe 2001/2002. Mase somehow had an ear for what was next. He was the first rapper to have a Neptunes beat and that was one of his biggest songs ("Lookin At Me"). He was also one of the first to give Just Blaze and Kanye placements. He was also one of the first to work with Southern MC's.

Mase drops an album 2001-2002 with production by The Neptunes, Just Blaze, and Kanye then he's easily platinum.

But on what label, because he damn sure would've no longer been on Bad Boy?

 

[boogers]

Mase would have ran rap. A lot of revisionist history in here. He was the second coming of LL Cool J. His career would have been as long as he wanted it to be. He could make songs for the girls and the thugs. Let's not pretend he wasn't about to put his foot on Jay-Z's neck with the little beef they had.

Y'all saying that Mase would've fizzled out because of Double Up but I you guys forget that he has already checked out by the time it got released. He wasn't even doing promotions for it. Everyone he ran with is still here doing it and fabulous who completely jacked his lane when he left is still here doing it.

 

[nieman]

How was his run over when he just became the number one rapper on the number one rap label in NY? I knew of Baby Maine,most people had never heard that name until Jimmy said it on Hot97 arguing with Mase and most people still don't even know about the Wu shyt until Ghostface rapped about so you bringing up these "street L's" and saying that they lowered his stock in the industry not true. Jay took L's on the streets, I know legendary rappers who took L's on the streets but that's not what this is about.

See this is what I'm talking about with revisionist history. You bring up Murder Inc and Ja Rule and this great shift. Mase and Ja albums came out the same month. Guess whose album went #1 with next to no promotion because he already had a foot out of the game? Every rapper you named in the shift knew and respected Mase as a dope rapper. Did they respect the bad boy formula and shiny suits? No. Mase still had 99% of female rap fans checking for him. None of those dudes you named had that. That crown was his to lose and he left it. It ain't no shoulda coulda woulda, you guys like using how it turned out to control the narrative on how it used to be. Mase had a weird career but we're not going to act like he was never at the top of the mountain and didn't leave at the top.

And like I told the other dude regarding Mase vs Jay-Z. Feel free to post Mase's last verse against Jay's or post I'm no Killa against Imaginary players. I'll wait.

We knew about the broke jaw in '97. Him & Cam beefin, hell, as soon as it happened...Cam went on tour trashing him for the 357 video. Mase's shine was diminishing in the streets. Not to mention Fabolous Sport stealing his lane.

His run would've definitely been over, but I think he would've had a few minor resurgences, bigger than his failed comeback attempt. IF Diddy lets him go.

 

[Doctor Wily]

The better question would be if Mase didn't retire would Fabolous be working at a cab stand in Brooklyn.

Fab slid right into Mase's lane but never got Mase's #'s & sales.

 

[JustCKing]

But on what label, because he damn sure would've no longer been on Bad Boy?

It would've been on Bad Boy. If I'm not mistaken, he still owed the label another album. Welcome Back was a Bad Boy album.

 

[Billy Ocean]

How was his run over when he just became the number one rapper on the number one rap label in NY? I knew of Baby Maine,most people had never heard that name until Jimmy said it on Hot97 arguing with Mase and most people still don't even know about the Wu shyt until Ghostface rapped about so you bringing up these "street L's" and saying that they lowered his stock in the industry not true. Jay took L's on the streets, I know legendary rappers who took L's on the streets but that's not what this is about.

See this is what I'm talking about with revisionist history. You bring up Murder Inc and Ja Rule and this great shift. Mase and Ja albums came out the same month. Guess whose album went #1 with next to no promotion because he already had a foot out of the game? Every rapper you named in the shift knew and respected Mase as a dope rapper. Did they respect the bad boy formula and shiny suits? No. Mase still had 99% of female rap fans checking for him. None of those dudes you named had that. That crown was his to lose and he left it. It ain't no shoulda coulda woulda, you guys like using how it turned out to control the narrative on how it used to be. Mase had a weird career but we're not going to act like he was never at the top of the mountain and didn't leave at the top.

And like I told the other dude regarding Mase vs Jay-Z. Feel free to post Mase's last verse against Jay's or post I'm no Killa against Imaginary players. I'll wait.

Smh...

His run was over because of what I, and several other posters in here, have pointed out already. He had dropped two critically maligned duds and the industry had moved past the brand of rap he was doing.

And whether you, or anybody else, knew about his street losses by the team he retired or not aren't you the one saying he woulda been popping going into the early and mid 2000s? Them losses woulda eventually got exposed to everybody and we would've looked even more funnier cause early to mid 90s was the era of mixtape thugged out, street rap (G-Unit, D-Block, Dipset...).

 

[Metal Face]

His 2nd album was trash

he already done by then

 

[Ghostface Trillah]

Smh...

His run was over because of what I, and several other posters in here, have pointed out already. He had dropped two critically maligned duds and the industry had moved past the brand of rap he was doing.

And whether you, or anybody else, knew about his street losses by the team he retired or not aren't you the one saying he woulda been popping going into the early and mid 2000s? Them losses woulda eventually got exposed to everybody and we would've looked even more funnier cause early to mid 90s was the era of mixtape thugged out, street rap (G-Unit, D-Block, Dipset...).

His run was over with a #1 album in the era where people had to go out and PHYSICALLY purchase albums. Think about how ridiculous that sounds. Just say that you yourself moved on from what Mase was doing because once again, he had a #1 album in the same era that every rapper you named in "the shift" had an album out.

Now I going to assume that you meant that he wouldn't of survived the early to mid 00's because it the era of thugged out.... MIXTAPES. You comparing a multi platinum artist to nikkas who was doing mixtapes to try and make a point. So Ja Rule and LL Cool J we're putting up numbers but Mase with the whole Bad boy/Arista machine behind him wasn't? Okay. LL in his prime survived the coming of Rakim,KRS,Big Daddy Kane,Kool G Rap and NWA but you telling me that Mase who was writing hits for him and Puff wasn't going to survive in an era where Ja Rule sold 9 million. Okay.

 

[FunkDoc1112]

Mase would have ran rap. A lot of revisionist history in here. He was the second coming of LL Cool J. His career would have been as long as he wanted it to be. He could make songs for the girls and the thugs. Let's not pretend he wasn't about to put his foot on Jay-Z's neck with the little beef they had.

Y'all saying that Mase would've fizzled out because of Double Up but I you guys forget that he has already checked out by the time it got released. He wasn't even doing promotions for it. Everyone he ran with is still here doing it and fabulous who completely jacked his lane is still here


Jay was not going to smash Mase. Mase could out rap Jay then and he still can now. Imaginary Player sounds ridiculous if it's about Mase who was way more successful than Jay at the time. The biggest line is about Mase being able to add more diamonds to a watch that has diamonds. Wow, such ether. He dropped a solo album that he didn't want to drop and didn't promote because he didn't want to be there. The shiny suits didn't make Mase a cornball. Stop it. He was still dropping Murda Mase type verses here and there and his Ma$e very were still lyrically fire. If you're going to shyt on him for wearing the shiny suits then you shytting on Biggie and the Lox too. Shiny suits got all those dudes rich. L's on the street? Pre internet? Ok. Harlem World was a money grab to get the homies paid. Cam and Mase writing all the raps for a 5 man group. No one was holding that against Mase. Mase took his foot off the gas for whatever personal reasons but we're not going to pretend like Mase got kicked out the game and didn't walk away from it at the highest level. That's revisionist history. Let's not do that

Breh Jay had already passed Mase by the end of '98 Vol. 2 was 5x Platinum while the Jiggy backlash was in full swing.

Jay slaughtered Mase on Ride or Die

I bruise wack rap nikkas severely punish them
Especially those that get fukked for they publishing, heh
Always gotta be the weakest nikka out the crew
I probably make more money off yo' album, than you
You see the respect I get every time I come through
Check your own videos, you'll always be number two

 

[Ghostface Trillah]

Breh Jay had already passed Mase by the end of '98 Vol. 2 was 5x Platinum while the Jiggy backlash was in full swing.

Jay slaughtered Mase on Ryde or Die

This isn't true at all. Jay dropped September, Mase dropped in June. Mase was already gone by the time Double Up dropped. That's why he wasn't on any promotional runs. Jay understood that certification came from units shipped not sold and Rocafella over shipped on a gamble. Why do you think that he kept pushing out singles from it? By this threads logic he fell off with Volume 3.

And Mase packed Jay-Z up on a R&B song with 112 harmonizing in the background with throwaway bars.

 

[C-Styles]

a bunch of yall are really mindless about this sh*t. Of course Mase would've had a longer run. For one "All I ever wanted" had HITTTT written all over for it for the summer time. The fact of the matter is, "Double up" would've probably sold double platinum by the end of the summer of 99 had he stayed and promoted it. Yall gotta realize he went Gold just off the joint for "Get ready" shot the video and dipped. "All i ever wanted" would've catapaulted the album to platinum status by then and he'd be doing a couple of other features. THE FORMULA HIM AND PUFFY LAID OUT as far as having singers on hooks and a clean sampled beat was in full EFFECT by 2000-03. He would've been eaten VERY WELL by album 3, the NEPTUNES COULD NOT F*CKIN MISS if they wanted to during that time and EVERYONE was benefitting from their beats. Mase would've very much benefitted from there. You're telling me that FAT JOE could have a hit in 2001 but not Mase??? That was MASE'S F*CKIN FORMULA! Then add to the fact that Mase was Kanye's favorite rapper. Kanye would've added LIFE to Mase's run. Nah brehs, i've noticed there is a lot of hate for Mase on this board and i can clearly see it. Even though he came with a mid album by 04 he still had HITS. "Breathe stretch shake" being one of them and that's him not even trying