Irv Gotti/Funk Flex interview from last yr; 1 topic: Illmatic vs. Reasonable Doubt

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

Not just lyrical style. The focus he had and he had a street sense mixed with a poetic resonance. nikka basically took u on a trip to NYC and into the minds of the youth but did it with such a lyrical flair and at such a high level that the game around him shifted. If u ask alot of emcees in the industry about when they heard that album. They will tell u how internally that shifted the way alotta nikkas started writing they rhymes. Alot of that silly emcee shyt that was going on in the game took a back seat as well. That whole "cat jump over the moon", "sam I am" rhyming without a reason type shyt took a complete hault. shyt even Wu Tang was doin some of that shyt on their debut. Specifically Method Man off the top of my head.

buckshot did that before nas too. he didn't have quite the lyrical flair of a nas tho.

but okay, nas was the first. how was that a detriment to his success?

 

[spliz]

buckshot did that before nas too. he didn't have quite the lyrical flair of a nas tho.

but okay, nas was the first. how was that a detriment to his success?

Buckshot wouldn't even compare himself to the likes of Nas on Illmatic bro. I've met Buckshot and I'm one of the biggest Black Moon fans u can come across. My boy did business wit them for a few years. I didnt say it was a detriment.

 

[kingofnyc]

how many 5 mic albums went platinum in real-time up to that point?

only one I can think of is amerikkka's most wanted.

the last 5 albums before nas got his 5mic

1. tribe - low end theory : plat
2. de la - de la soul is dead : gold
3. brand nubian - one for all : n/a
4. cube - amerikka most wanted : plat
5. eric b & rakim - let the rhyme hit em : gold

this was from ‘92 to earlier
so i’ll say that 5mic rating indeed pushed artist sales

 

[JuvenileHell]

This. I know Jay stans are about to lose their minds but nobody in my peer group gave a fukk about "RD" in 1996. I'm just being real. One friend of my copped the album....I browsed it, liked a couple songs....then went on with listening to everything else that was out at the time.

The fact that people compare the two albums is puzzling as fukk. I mean....I get it, because of the Nas/Jay rivalry....but the albums were never on the same level in real time.

Fred.

yeah, Illmatic pretty much made Nas the chosen one the year it came out, meanwhile Reasonable Doubt, while a classic, came out in probably the best year in Rap. Pac, Mobb, Wu and other artists dropped superior projects.

 

[kingofnyc]

both are dope albums but from what i recall Illmatic was hailed as a classic instantly and ppl didn't really start appreciating RD hard until the late 90s (outside of Aint No nikka and Can't knock the hustle)

respectfully disagree

dead president single went gold & can i live : D evils : Brooklyn finest were hood hardcore street classic

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

I didnt say it was a detriment.

bringing up all these other people that came AFTER Nas makes no sense and only works as a hindsight argument is what I'm saying.

 

[kingofnyc]

One Love, Lifes a bytch and Represent had hooks as well. And One Time For Your Mind.

thats why i didn't understand dude post

 

[Da King]

old heads don't even consider RD a classic, Jay's repeatedly calling it a classic for years had cacs convinced it was then the c00ns followed

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

the last 5 albums before nas got his 5mic

1. tribe - low end theory : plat
2. de la - de la soul is dead : gold
3. brand nubian - one for all : n/a
4. cube - amerikka most wanted : plat
5. eric b & rakim - let the rhyme hit em : gold

this was from ‘92 to earlier
so i’ll say that 5mic rating indeed pushed artist sales

"low end theory" took nearly 4 years to go platinum.
that's why I said real-time.

even if you add up all the albums. not just the 5 previous. throw in BDP, the other tribe, etc. all you got is 1 platinum album.

yeah, Illmatic pretty much made Nas the chosen one the year it came out, meanwhile Reasonable Doubt, while a classic, came out in probably the best year in Rap. Pac, Mobb, Wu and other artists dropped superior projects.

reasonable doubt is better than 'hell on earth' & ironman.

and jay sold more than them too.​

old heads don't even consider RD a classic, Jay's repeatedly calling it a classic for years had cacs convinced it was then the c00ns followed

this is FALSE.

and I despise jay-z.​

 

[kingofnyc]

old heads don't even consider RD a classic, Jay's repeatedly calling it a classic for years had cacs convinced it was then the c00ns followed

 

[kingofnyc]

"low end theory" took nearly 4 years to go platinum.
that's why I said real-time.

even if you add up all the albums. not just the 5 previous. throw in BDP, the other tribe, etc. all you got is 1 platinum album.

reasonable doubt is better than 'hell on earth' & ironman.

and jay sold more than them too.​

this is FALSE.

and I despise jay-z.​

fair enough
besides cube all them were east coast artist which we all knew couldnt push units in them dayz
especially, like we been covering nyc/east coast was heavy on bootlegging back in da day


with that said : i do remember alot of people introducing nas to their show & starting off with mentioning the 5 mic in the source magazine rating for illmatic

 

[JustCKing]

dat pete rock produced track ‘the world is yours’ is easily a top 10 choruses of all time

Repeating the title of the song is hardly what I'm getting at. Look at the hooks/choruses for "Juicy" or "Big Poppa" or a lot of the more popular songs out at the time. That is what I'm getting at. Nas's verses were more of a focus than having a catchy hook/chorus.

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

fair enough
besides cube all them were east coast artist which we all knew couldnt push units in them dayz
especially, like we been covering nyc/east coast was heavy on bootlegging back in da day


with that said : i do remember alot of people introducing nas to their show & starting off with mentioning the 5 mic in the source magazine rating for illmatic

shieet, east coast still heavy on the bootlegging.

those rappers back then, took a harder hit because outside of certain acts(ll cool j, naughty, the 1st onyx/das efx tapes, etc) the east coast was low on sheer entertainment value to the general public thru '90-94 until......wait for it...….your squad over at bad boy changed the landscape back to where it was in the '80s.

 

[ThreeSixMafia]

This. I know Jay stans are about to lose their minds but nobody in my peer group gave a fukk about "RD" in 1996. I'm just being real. One friend of my copped the album....I browsed it, liked a couple songs....then went on with listening to everything else that was out at the time.

The fact that people compare the two albums is puzzling as fukk. I mean....I get it, because of the Nas/Jay rivalry....but the albums were never on the same level in real time.

Fred.

Is it really blasphemous to think Rd is better though? I don't see how its puzzling.

 

[ig88]

Human reaction:

Statement: Flex is off as a mutha. Its kinda irritating to watch.

Illmatic/Rd : nas/jay .... im sorry but all because they are the most relevent today does not mean theyy “owned” or “defined” the 90s era.

The era they are speaking on, 94-96/97 , was a rotating top 3 that changed every 6 or so months. Both wutang and big were above nas and jay until if i ruled the world. Jay-Z did not even enter that picture until 98. The revisionist history frys my circuits with these guys trying to play favorites. Illmatic DID put nas in the running but RD?... na..

Ready to die
Only built 4 cuban linx
The infamous
36 chambers
Etc

Are all equal caliber albums , if not better.

Whole conversation based on a bum premise.

Never mind it was written dropped same day as reasonable doubt...