Greece financial crisis | Latest : Deal reached with even tougher conditions for Greece.

The Fukin Prophecy

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@Domingo Halliburton If Greece says fukk the EU and bails, how cheap will it be to go visit Greece? Their currency will tank right? I've always wanted to check out Santoori...if I can do it for pennies on the dollar, even better :heh:
The islands as far as hotel and food won't be less expensive (especially Santorini) but a two week stay on the mainland will be substantially cheaper...
 
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The Fukin Prophecy

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My personal opinion...

This was always a game of who 'blinks first'...Tsipras never had plans for a 'Grexit' he just wanted to put enough pressure on his counterparts to get a better deal...

Tsipras will accept a deal this week because the game has run its course...Whether his people are happy about it is another story...
 

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The esteemed, all knowing, above the radicals on either equally extreme side, balanced, reasonable centrist has spoken. All ya'll left wingers take notes, okay?
 

Liu Kang

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My personal opinion...

This was always a game of who 'blinks first'...Tsipras never had plans for a 'Grexit' he just wanted to put enough pressure on his counterparts to get a better deal...

Tsipras will accept a deal this week because the game has run its course...Whether his people are happy about it is another story...
IMO, Tsipras knew there was no way he would get a favorable deal even with the referendum. I even think that this referendum pissed of the troika more than anything else but to me, it's Tsipras saving face because there's nothing he can really do. He just inherited the situation more than anything else and at least he was putting the beats on tax evaders.

Another note is that Eastern European countries seem to be hard on Greece and pushing for a Grexit. I don't know what is "ekathimerini" but the article is pointing a point of view we don't really here from

Eurozone's poorer nations take hard line on Greece
http://www.ekathimerini.com/199040/...zones-poorer-nations-take-hard-line-on-greece

The eurozone's poorer former communist nations, having themselves endured painful market reforms and austerity programs, are taking a hard line on Greece after its people voted to reject bailout terms. Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and Slovakia have long insisted they are too poor to pay for the mistakes made by wealthier Greece and that it should have stuck to the reforms and austerity measures laid out in its massive 240 billion euro ($273 billion) bailout.

"I hear some Greeks have pensions over 1,000 euros ($1,100) a month. That's outrageous. I refuse to pay for their debt while they are making fortunes compared to my salary," Bratislava waitress Martina Lelovicova told AFP on Monday in a country where the average monthly salary is 880 euros.
"It's good news for the eurozone. Greeks should leave it, this will only make it healthier," a Bratislava entrepreneur in his thirties who wished to remain anonymous told AFP of Sunday's Greek referendum result.

Slovak Finance Minister Peter Kazimir – the first Eurogroup minister to warn that the Greek 'No raises the specter of a "Grexit" or exit from the euro – told reporters: "With the result of the referendum, a possible crisis scenario, the gradual withdrawal of Greece from the eurozone, is unfolding." Slovakia, an ex-communist nation of 5.4 million people that joined the eurozone in 2009, has suffered stubbornly high joblessness despite brisk economic growth in recent years.

Its leftist Prime Minister Robert Fico insists "Slovakia will not be harmed as a result of Greece and its decision to stay or leave the single currency union," as Bratislava "did not give any cash, only our guarantees" as part of previous Greek bailouts.

But not all poorer eurozone members have nothing to lose: Estonian President Toomas Hendrick Ilve tweeted Monday that "Greece's creditors (are) not just banks." "Eurozone countries poorer than Greece stand to lose up to 4.2 percent GDP," he wrote.

Prime Minister Taavi Roivas for his part said Greece "now only has bad and worse choices left" and reforms "are unavoidable." "We expect the Greek government to understand the situation and show decisiveness and action within hours," he added.

Having broken free from the crumbling Soviet Union in 1990-91, tiny Estonia and Latvia joined the eurozone in 2011 and 2014 respectively, followed by neighbor Lithuania in January this year. All three Baltic states implemented drastic austerity measures to recover from deep recessions triggered by the 2008-09 global financial crisis, paving the way to eurozone entry and stable economic growth, now around three percent in the region.

Estonia, the eurozone's smallest member since 2011, approved an initial Greek bailout but has since said 'No and insists that all eurozone members adopt its strict fiscal discipline.

Tallinn boasts the eurozone's lowest debt-to-GDP ratio of 10.6 percent. "Estonians don't really understand the Greek attitude. We are used to saving and living frugally," Merit Kopli, editor in chief of Estonia's leading Postimees daily, told AFP. Maie Mets, a 72-year-old pensioner, said: "As I understand it, the Greek standard of living is higher than ours here in Estonia. It is only normal that people pay their debts."

Latvia was hit hard by the global financial crisis, suffering the world's deepest recession when GDP shrank by nearly a quarter over two years. Yet the nation of some two million bounced back after implementing austerity cuts under the terms of a 7.5 billion euro international bailout it secured to avert bankruptcy.

"When we went through the international bailout, did anyone come to rescue us?" asked Zenija Lace, a 61-year-old Riga office worker. "I have no sympathy for the Greeks. They should have started paying taxes long ago. If they want money from Europe, they should have started saving!" added 59-year-old Riga businesswoman Brigita Petersone.

"How is it that we could endure all of it and they can't?"[AFP]
 

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cliffs, the 'too big to fail' crew is in the mix

How Greece was robbed by the bankers

http://www.hangthebankers.com/how-greece-was-robbed-by-the-bankers/

Wonder if the article or has anyone in this thread mentioned term "odious debt". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odious_debt





Basically what Iceland did, which is why you don't here about Iceland much anymore. They actually jailed bankers. It refused to pay debt that was just attached to them by derivatives and such. Greece and a lot of countries are in the same situation.
 
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King Kreole

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Wonder if the article or has anyone in this thread mentioned term "odious debt". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odious_debt





Basically what Iceland did, which is why you don't here about Iceland much anymore. They actually jailed bankers. It refused to pay debt that was just attached to them by derivatives and such. Greece and a lot of countries are in the same situation.

:patrice:
I'm not sure if Greece's situation would count. This wasn't a totalitarian regime that was kicked out, it was a democratically elected government that mismanaged Greek resources. What kind of precedent would that set? If the Democrats take both the house and senate next election, could they claim that any debt incurred under the Republican majority years is odious? It would seem like there would have to be extenuating circumstances (war debt, revolutionary debt, etc) to classify Greece's debt as odious, and the situation in which Greece accepted the bailout money was more or less the same as any other country that accepted the bailout money. The government was democratically elected, so I don't think it can be legitimately claimed that they weren't acting in the interest of the people.
 

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Wonder if the article or has anyone in this thread mentioned term "odious debt". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odious_debt





Basically what Iceland did, which is why you don't here about Iceland much anymore. They actually jailed bankers. It refused to pay debt that was just attached to them by derivatives and such. Greece and a lot of countries are in the same situation.


More countries should follow the Iceland template and get out of crushing debt slavery.
 

The Fukin Prophecy

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Wonder if the article or has anyone in this thread mentioned term "odious debt". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odious_debt





Basically what Iceland did, which is why you don't here about Iceland much anymore. They actually jailed bankers. It refused to pay debt that was just attached to them by derivatives and such. Greece and a lot of countries are in the same situation.

I've been saying it for 5 years...

The model the Greeks need to follow is Iceland not Ireland...Even the IMF basically agreed by saying austerity will not work for Greece...

90% of the previous bailout package went to the bankers...All the Greeks actually paid off was the interest...

Unfortunately I believe the Greek government is spineless they are giving into the banker fear mongering...
 

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An article on a site called hangthebankers put the blame squarely on the shoulders of the bankers?

:ohhh:

the content rather than the source, and name of the website is the reason for the post. not all pertinent info comes from most of the corporate owned major media that missed the 2008 crash.

as i recall fortune and cfo magazines were the only ones warning of the impending doom in 2006/07. everyone in the media including cnbc and fox business was kissing the ring former fed chairman alan greenspan.

and the bankers have become more powerful than elected officials these days. i posted this last night as evidence of my point.

London is now the global money-laundering centre for the drug trade, says crime expert
 
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the content rather than the source, and name of the website is the reason for the post. not all pertinent info comes from most of the corporate owned major media that missed the 2008 crash.

as i recall fortune and cfo magazines were the only ones warning of the impending doom in 2006/07. everyone in the media including cnbc and fox business was kissing the ring former fed chairman alan greenspan.

and the bankers have become more powerful than elected officials these days. i posted this last night as evidence of my point.

London is now the global money-laundering centre for the drug trade, says crime expert
The content of any article or publication reflects the biases of the source. If you applied the same scrutiny to your sources as you do with the corporate media, you wouldn't have such a black and white view of the situation.
 
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