General Elon Musk Fukkery Thread

FabTrey

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All of those examples require individual human operators, and those companies force their operators to take the risk. In many cases, you hear that working for Uber/Doordash isn't actually worth the negatives that the company forces you to taken on.

But your Tesla robotaxi fleet? You're claiming the profits are basically guaranteed for every car, and that Tesla will take on the risks for every operator. So what benefit would they get from the middleman at all?

Also, the analysis you linked claims that robotaxi will comprise the majority of Tesla revenue by 2027. When is Tesla going to build all the cars and batteries necessary to form such a huge robotaxi fleet by 2027, especially considering that it's already mid-2024 and they're currently laying off workers and slowing production? Even if they only used current cars (I'm not sure there's enough people who have Teslas sitting idle and wish to use them this way to generate that sort of revenue), where would they get the battery production to keep replacing batteries while putting the sort of miles you're talking about putting on those cars?

Imagine being gullible enough to believe that there is a market for 6 million taxis with millions more on the way if Tesla FSD can be achieved(which it won’t).

Who’s going to be riding these taxis when most people already own a car or use cheaper public transportation option.

Ride share companies are barely making a profit as it is.

You really haven’t thought this through.

:dead:


You continue to highlight significant risks, despite my repeated assertions that AI will surpass human capabilities. I've also emphasized Tesla's deep pockets for insurance coverage in case of major incidents.

With ONLY 6 million cars globally, Tesla's fleet is a small fraction of the world's 1.5 billion vehicles. China alone has 420 million cars, making it a crucial market for Tesla's robotaxi network. i never said all 6milion will generate profits. that's not possible. However, imagine Tesla leading the charge in China, where the network could render traditional taxi drivers obsolete. Also tesla can easily double the production with a successful launch. demand will be crazy. in 3 years there's gonna be way more than 6 million teslas.

Elon Musk's strategic moves in China indicate the importance of this market. Your perspective seems limited when considering car ownership versus the need for rides. Very narrow American viewpoint if you ask me.

A successful robotaxi network will pressure other rideshare companies to adopt FSD or face obsolescence. People inherently distrust humans; if they recognize AI's superiority, why would they pay more for human-driven services? For example, imagine a scenario where a drunk chick needs a ride at 4 am. Would she trust a human driver or opt for a safer AI-driven option?

There's gonna be so much profit potential whenever Tesla solves autonomy. my bull scenario is just 1 example. their new business model could be very different. but in the end, i'm banking on Tesla to become an AI giant. we've entered the AI era. just look around. throw away your flip phones and join the party. you can safely invest in NVDA, MSFT, META, APPL, etc, etc. they will ALL EAT. tesla right now is beaten down by the negative press, bad earnings, and doubters like yall. it's perfect time to invest in a company with huge potential.
 

nyknick

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I remember back when Space X was literally just starting with that massive funding and huge hype and was such a hot ticket. I had friends who ended up working for Boeing, NASA, etc. who didn't get past their first Space X interview.

Now? Who the fukk would want to work with him after all the idiotic moves he's pulled and the ways he keeps dikking over his own employees?
After the whole Twitter fiasco you have to be a complete Musk sycophant to go out of your way to work for him. And even the people who have the same worldview as him get treated like shyt, fired even after sleeping at work. He's like a Trump on the spectrum, if he was able to speak properly he would be a complete menace but luckily he's relegated to just spewing garbage on Twitter.

Name a single subject that you believe you have enough expertise on to label Elon Musk a genius, then quote him speaking genius on that subject.

Anyone who spends time in the Musk threads has seen numerous examples on him speaking total nonsense. He's no more knowledgeable than any random engineer in his company, and likely less knowledgeable than plenty. He's just really good at spouting bullshyt and has just enough CS and physics background to make his bullshyt sound realistic to people who don't know better.
Musk's whole 'hardcore coding' spiel was comical. His style is to take a couple of technical sounding phrases and hammer them home in every interview. He also does the Apple thing where he takes an industry wide standard and tries to make it special to Tesla: giga-casting, gigafactory, autopilot, dojo, bio-weapon defense mode (for a HEPA filter :dead: ).
i believe in the power of AI.


Just two years ago, could you have imagined having a casual conversation with AI?
Musk promised full self driving in 2016, there was no word of AGI at that point. The furthest he went was hyping up computing capabilities and machine learning which was obviously not ready in 2016. Tesla was still using Mobileye at that point but he was promising full self driving. How is that promise in 2016 any different from this new promise in 2024 with a shiny new 'AI' buzzword?

AI is the new 'quantum' for grifters.
 

FabTrey

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After the whole Twitter fiasco you have to be a complete Musk sycophant to go out of your way to work for him. And even the people who have the same worldview as him get treated like shyt, fired even after sleeping at work. He's like a Trump on the spectrum, if he was able to speak properly he would be a complete menace but luckily he's relegated to just spewing garbage on Twitter.


Musk's whole 'hardcore coding' spiel was comical. His style is to take a couple of technical sounding phrases and hammer them home in every interview. He also does the Apple thing where he takes an industry wide standard and tries to make it special to Tesla: giga-casting, gigafactory, autopilot, dojo, bio-weapon defense mode (for a HEPA filter :dead: ).

Musk promised full self driving in 2016, there was no word of AGI at that point. The furthest he went was hyping up computing capabilities and machine learning which was obviously not ready in 2016. Tesla was still using Mobileye at that point but he was promising full self driving. How is that promise in 2016 any different from this new promise in 2024 with a shiny new 'AI' buzzword?

AI is the new 'quantum' for grifters.

It's time for you to move on with Elon not keeping his promises. Who gives a shyt.

Instead you should shift your focus on the current state of FSD which is vastly improved compared to previous versions. It's not there yet, but it will get there. What happens when tesla solves autonomy? Are you still gonna cry about Elon and his broken promises?
 

nyknick

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It's time for you to move on with Elon not keeping his promises. Who gives a shyt.

Instead you should shift your focus on the current state of FSD which is vastly improved compared to previous versions. It's not there yet, but it will get there. What happens when tesla solves autonomy? Are you still gonna cry about Elon and his broken promises?
If somebody lies for 8 years straight why believe him in year 9?

Current FSD is still just Level 2 automation (still just a driver assist) while Waymo is level 4. Waymo has lidar, radar, cameras, hd mapping, geo-fencing and thousands of remote drivers ready to step in and they still have issues (probe was just announced into unexpected behavior). And once again Google has way more money invested in AI than Tesla.



Only people that should be crying are those that paid $10,000 for FSD last 8 years :manny:
 

that guy

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It's time for you to move on with Elon not keeping his promises. Who gives a shyt.

Instead you should shift your focus on the current state of FSD which is vastly improved compared to previous versions. It's not there yet, but it will get there. What happens when tesla solves autonomy? Are you still gonna cry about Elon and his broken promises?
:dead:
 

bnew

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The inside story of Elon Musk’s mass firings of Tesla Supercharger staff​

By Chris Kirkham, Hyunjoo Jin and Abhirup Roy

May 15, 20246:26 AM EDTUpdated 7 hours ago

Tesla electric vehicle chargers are seen during the winter in Hofn

Item 1 of 2 Tesla electric vehicle chargers are seen during the winter in Hofn, Iceland, February 16, 2022. REUTERS/Nacho Doce/File Photo

[1/2]Tesla electric vehicle chargers are seen during the winter in Hofn, Iceland, February 16, 2022. REUTERS/Nacho Doce/File Photo Purchase Licensing Rights, opens new tab

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May 15 (Reuters) - The day before Elon Musk fired virtually all of Tesla’s electric-vehicle charging division last month, they had high hopes as charging chief Rebecca Tinucci went to meet with Musk about the network’s future, four former charging-network staffers told Reuters.

After Tinucci had cut between 15% and 20% of staffers two weeks earlier, part of much wider layoffs, they believed Musk would affirm plans for a massive charging-network expansion.

The meeting could not have gone worse. Musk, the employees said, was not pleased with Tinucci’s presentation and wanted more layoffs. When she balked, saying deeper cuts would undermine charging-business fundamentals, he responded by firing her and her entire 500-member team.

The departures have upended a network widely viewed as a signature Tesla achievement and a key driver of its EV sales. Tesla Superchargers account for more than 60% of U.S. high-speed charging ports, federal statistics show, and the company has been the biggest winner so far of $5 billion in federal funding for new chargers.

This account, the most detailed to date on the Supercharger firings and the fallout, is based on interviews with eight former charging-division employees, one contractor and a Tesla email sent to outside vendors. Only Musk and Tinucci were in the meeting described to Reuters; the four sources with knowledge of the meeting are relaying what they heard about it from Supercharger department managers.

Tesla, Musk and Tinucci did not respond to requests for comment from Reuters.

Despite the mass firings, Musk has since posted on social media promising to continue expanding the network. But three former charging-team employees told Reuters they have been fielding calls from vendors, contractors and electric utilities, some of which had spent millions of dollars on equipment and infrastructure to help build out Tesla’s network.

A letter sent earlier this month by a Tesla global-supply manager to Supercharger contractors and suppliers instructed them to “please hold on breaking ground on any newly awarded construction projects” and halt materials purchases, according to a copy reviewed by Reuters. “I understand that this period of change may be challenging, and that patience is not easy when expecting to be paid!”

Tesla's energy team, which sells solar and battery-storage products for homes and businesses, was tasked with taking over Superchargers and calling some partners to close out ongoing charger-construction projects, said three of the former Tesla employees.

One construction contractor said Tesla staffers contacting his company since the layoffs “don’t know a thing.” The contractor said he had expected Supercharger projects to provide about 20% of his 2024 revenue but now plans to diversify to avoid relying on Tesla.

Tinucci was one of few high-ranking female Tesla executives. She recently started reporting directly to Musk, following the departure of battery-and-energy chief Drew Baglino, according to four former Supercharger-team staffers. They said Baglino had historically overseen the charging department without much involvement from Musk.

The charging-team layoffs mark the latest drama in a tumultuous year for Tesla as Musk has shut down or delayed several core efforts meant to drive the rapid EV sales growth that investors have expected. Instead, Musk now says Tesla will shift its main focus to self-driving cars, a fiercely competitive and riskier business that could take years to develop.

The company posted its first decline in auto sales since 2020 in the first quarter amid fierce competition from Chinese electric-vehicle makers and sagging worldwide EV demand. Reuters reported in April that Tesla had scrapped plans for a long-awaited affordable car known as the Model 2. That has thrown into doubt Tesla’s plans for new factories in Mexico and India, where Musk had been expected to travel last month to meet Prime Minister Narendra Modi, before canceling at the last minute. And a host of executives have departed amid deep companywide layoffs.


SCALED-BACK CHARGING EXPANSION​

The energy team that was assigned to take over charging-network management has some similar design and construction roles, two of the former Tesla employees said. But charging projects are fundamentally different because they are located in public places and require extensive negotiations with utilities, local governments and landowners, they said.

The energy team was already struggling to keep pace with its current workload, said two of the former charging-network staffers. Yet when the layoffs came down on April 30, Musk posted that the company “still plans to grow the Supercharger network, just at a slower pace.” On Friday, Musk posted that “Tesla will spend well over $500M expanding our Supercharger network to create thousands of NEW chargers this year.”

Two former Supercharger staffers called the $500 million expansion budget a significant reduction from what the team had planned for 2024 - but nonetheless a challenge requiring hundreds of employees. In an analysis provided to Reuters, San Francisco research firm EVAdoption estimated a $500 million investment this year would translate to Tesla building 77% fewer charging ports per month in the United States compared with the automaker’s pace through April.


‘HOLDING THE BAG’​

Tesla unveiled its first Supercharger stations throughout California in 2012, with Musk calling the network a “game changer” for EVs that would enable long-distance travel and convenience “equivalent to gasoline cars.”

The EV-charging business requires substantial upfront investment, and analysts have often viewed it as unprofitable. But Tesla’s network had been profitable before the layoffs, according to four former Tesla employees familiar with the division’s financial performance.

That owed to Tesla’s cost-control and extensive analysis to choose locations that could draw business throughout the day rather than only during peak-demand times, when electricity costs spike. One former Supercharger staffer said Tesla’s costs per-charging-port were typically at least 50% lower than those of competitors.

As recently as last month, Tesla said in a securities filing that it needed to expand charging to “ensure adequate availability” for customers, particularly after automakers including Ford (F.N), opens new tab, General Motors (GM.N), opens new tab, Toyota (7203.T), opens new tab and Hyundai (005380.KS), opens new tab announced they would start making their cars compatible with Tesla’s charging plugs, giving their vehicles Supercharger access.

Another former employee said that rollout is “completely jeopardized” because there will not be enough new charging sites coming online, and the company was only starting to implement upgrades to allow more compatibility with other manufacturers’ vehicles.

Three of the former employees called the firings a major setback to U.S. charging expansion because of the relationships Tesla employees had built with suppliers and electric utilities. Tesla had grown into one of the larger customers for many major utilities around the country, and many had hired new staff and planned new infrastructure based on Tesla’s charging-network expansion plans, the former employees said.

Other companies may be able to fill the gap, the former employees said, but the goodwill built over time with utilities and other contractors from Tesla’s large-scale charging investments will be difficult to replicate.

“It’s just unfortunate that now they’re stuck holding the bag on all these different projects,” one of the former employees said. “It’s really sad to see all these relationships burned and people be really angry - rightfully so."

Stay up to date with the latest news, trends and innovations that are driving the global automotive industry with the Reuters Auto File newsletter. Sign up here.

Reporting by Chris Kirkham in Los Angeles, and Hyunjoo Jin and Abhirup Roy in San Francisco Edited by Brian Thevenot and Matthew Lewis
 

nyknick

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Are they really that good a car company though? Their build quality is viewed poorly, their prices are being undercut by all of their competitors, and they're led by a megalomaniac who is making increasingly frequent poor decisions and has killed their brand. Their stock is incredibly overpriced considering their sales volume, and their sales volume is falling. What is keeping them from a long-term future as a niche car company with a more realistic stock price falling to 1/5 of its current level to match their actual revenue?
It's almost criminal how they completely fumbled their early lead in EVs and engineering. There were so many paths they could've taken to become a stronger car company but they let a man-child make decisions instead.

They could've been first to the market with electric: three-row SUVs, commercial delivery vans, mini-vans, hatchbacks for European market. Instead they made a Cybertruck, took $50,000 deposits for the Roadster in 2017 and abandoned Model S and X.

Tesla's number in Germany for 2024. S and X numbers are tragic.
ad654dbcbdee0dc266b40ecfd04092235709737555c3556caddd0051be8685b9.jpg
 

FabTrey

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If somebody lies for 8 years straight why believe him in year 9?

Current FSD is still just Level 2 automation (still just a driver assist) while Waymo is level 4. Waymo has lidar, radar, cameras, hd mapping, geo-fencing and thousands of remote drivers ready to step in and they still have issues (probe was just announced into unexpected behavior). And once again Google has way more money invested in AI than Tesla.



Only people that should be crying are those that paid $10,000 for FSD last 8 years :manny:



Waymo costs around 150k, not including the car itself. Good luck trying to scale that.

The article is misleading because it doesn't account for those who already have FSD capability.


not sure who to believe. honestly i don't care. i wouldn't buy FSD either. at least not yet. :manny:



$8000 for FSD is too much. that's a lot of money, so you can text while drive. and then $100 for the subscription. FSD only works if there's a robotaxi network and it can MAKE YOU money.

I predict, when the robotaxi network launches, the adoption rate will increase drastically.

Let's face it. There's a reason why the needle isn't moving on Wall Street yet. They just can't see as far ahead as I can. They are like you, skeptical and cynical. they look at the earnings. slow sales. They fail to understand that Tesla is sitting on a gold mine.
And when the bull train starts running at full steam, they will be like, "Oh damn, what did I just miss?" that's when FOMO starts. instead of 10X they will be happy with 2X gained and collectively say 'i should've gotten in below $200'.

if you don't believe in Tesla's future with an AI then you should definitely short Tesla.
 
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FabTrey

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It's almost criminal how they completely fumbled their early lead in EVs and engineering. There were so many paths they could've taken to become a stronger car company but they let a man-child make decisions instead.

They could've been first to the market with electric: three-row SUVs, commercial delivery vans, mini-vans, hatchbacks for European market. Instead they made a Cybertruck, took $50,000 deposits for the Roadster in 2017 and abandoned Model S and X.

Tesla's number in Germany for 2024. S and X numbers are tragic.
ad654dbcbdee0dc266b40ecfd04092235709737555c3556caddd0051be8685b9.jpg


Germany stopped their EV incentives and therefore sales went down and German plant got shutdown due to arson attack. /thread.



Stronger car company? Tesla doesn't want to be a car company. Keep thinking cars when you should be thinking AI. It's AI or bust for tesla.
 

Robbie3000

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Waymo costs around 150k, not including the car itself. Good luck trying to scale that.

The article is misleading because it doesn't account for those who already have FSD capability.


not sure who to believe. honestly i don't care. i wouldn't buy FSD either. at least not yet. :manny:



$8000 for FSD is too much. that's a lot of money, so you can text while drive. and then $100 for the subscription. FSD only works if there's a robotaxi network and it can MAKE YOU money.

I predict, when the robotaxi network launches, the adoption rate will increase drastically.

Let's face it. There's a reason why the needle isn't moving on Wall Street yet. They just can't see as far ahead as I can. They are like you, skeptical and cynical. they look at the earnings. slow sales. They fail to understand that Tesla is sitting on a gold mine.
And when the bull train starts running at full steam, they will be like, "Oh damn, what did I just miss?" that's when FOMO starts. instead of 10X they will be happy with 2X gained and collectively say 'i should've gotten in below $200'.

if you don't believe in Tesla's future with an AI then you should definitely short Tesla.

So let me get this straight
1. Tesla is going to make Robotaxi’s that cost $27K a year to produce.

2. These Robotaxis will be sold for $30K netting Tesla $3K per vehicle

3. However, these vehicles can generate $30K in passive income each year.

4. So Tesla will choose to make $3K selling the vehicles instead of the $30K the vehicle will generate?

This is what the Boer is proposing right? You don’t see the holes in this logic?

Edit: forgot to add that he will make $200 a month selling FSD subscription.
 
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