Game changing albums

[JustCKing]

What we are talking about now has nothing to do with that.
At the end of the day. Lauryn is the prototype. The iPhone if you will.

Ok. If you say Missy did that first (even though Erick Sermon used to do that on occasion) then fine. Missy was the iPhone 4 to the iPhone 4s then.


What was their first placement?

It didn't sound like anything else out at the time.

Because that was the first song after the deal. The first song that was released to a nationwide audience. Outside of the South they were unknown up to that point. But in the South they were damn near going gold.

True.

Timeline wise yes, but Timb was not the reason that Neptunes and the others blew. There is no causation.

They were big, but Boom Bap was still big as well. No Limit was doing serious numbers. Death Row was dominant the prior year.

He was a part of it sure.

Nope.
That suggests that Neptunes, Swizz and Mannie all fashioned there sound after Tim. That's not true, but maybe that's not what you're claiming.

Lauryn Hill was not the prototype. Her debut came a full year after Supa Dupa Fly. Before Missy, it wasn't done at that level.

The Neptunes first placement ad The Neptunes was on Total's debut.

"Ha" was not the first single after the Universal deal. Big Tymers released before Juve with nowhere near the impact.

Timbaland and The Neptunes (well, Pharrell at least) were once in a group. At the time, Tim did the beats. Later, Pharrell and Chad became under studies of Teddy Riley. Long story short, Timbaland blew up first.

And no I'm not claiming that Tim was a direct influence on their sound, but Mannie cites Timbaland as an influence. Timbaland was the first of those guys to break through and opened up the lane for them to do what they did.

All of the sounds you mentioned were phased out. No Limit, Bad Boy, and ultimately boom bap were rendered obsolete as the dominant sound due to Timbaland, The Neptunes, Swizz, and Rocwilder blowing up. Tim was the first to kick in the door with Supa Dupa Fly. After that, Hip Hop production went beyond loops, chopped samples, and boom bap drums. It became more bouncy, spacey, syncopated, and producers took more risks with what they sampled and how they sampled.

 

[BmoreGorilla]

Not just sales,when he did what he did. He took hiphop to a new height,facts

Just becuz he had huge success doesn’t mean anything. Not when you had groups like PE who were very popular with white fans and still maintained their credibility within the hip hop community

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Just becuz he had huge success doesn’t mean anything. Not when you had groups like PE who were very popular with white fans and still maintained their credibility within the hip hop community

Hammer having his moment doesnt negate P.E. or anyone else whom had legit moments.
You're not making a good point. You're just hating and it's very very corny

 

[BmoreGorilla]

Hammer having his moment doesnt negate P.E. or anyone else whom had legit moments.
You're not making a good point. You're just hating and it's very very corny

How am I hating? I actually owned that album as a kid. That album sold mad copies but the only new heights he took hip hop to was that parent's felt comfortable with their kids listening to it

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

How am I hating? I actually owned that album as a kid. That album sold mad copies but the only new heights he took hip hop to was that parent's felt comfortable with their kids listening to it

 

[mobbinfms]

Lauryn Hill was not the prototype. Her debut came a full year after Supa Dupa Fly. Before Missy, it wasn't done at that level.

I guess we'll just have to disagree on this

"Ha" was not the first single after the Universal deal. Big Tymers released before Juve with nowhere near the impact.

I had to look it up. The album that you are referencing was a reissue of their album from 97?
As someone who was cognizant back then...I can guarantee you that album was just thrown out there with no promotion at all. Also, Ha was getting video play in the summer of 98. I know because I remember seeing the video and thinking it was the worst shyt I'd ever heard in my life
I had recorded Rap City and I remember taking the tape to show my brehs b/c it was that awful and I assumed I'd never hear anything from him again

And no I'm not claiming that Tim was a direct influence on their sound

Ok.

Timbaland was the first of those guys to break through and opened up the lane for them to do what they did.

Nah. Neputnes and Swizz were gonna blow regardless of Timb. That's just hip hop - the sounds change with time.

producers took more risks with what they sampled and how they sampled.

I'm not sure about that
Timb was doing some unique stuff for sure though...

 

[DatNkkaCutty]

Paid In Full
Straight Outta Compton
The Chronic
Doggystyle
It Was Written
All Eyez On Me
Life After Death
No Way Out
It's Dark and Hell is Hot
Hard Knock Life Vol. II
Pain is Love
Get Rich Or Die Tryin
Lil Jon & The Eastside Boyz: Kings of Crunk
The Carter II
Trap Musik
Thug Motivation: 101
College Dropout

 

[mobbinfms]

I don't think No Way Out changed the game. That was LAD.
Same with Harlem World. They both followed the blueprint set by LAD.

 

[mobbinfms]

Hard Knock Life Vol. II

That was Jay just following the LAD blueprint.

 

[mobbinfms]

The Carter II

How?

 

[JustCKing]

I guess we'll just have to disagree on this


I had to look it up. The album that you are referencing was a reissue of their album from 97?
As someone who was cognizant back then...I can guarantee you that album was just thrown out there with no promotion at all. Also, Ha was getting video play in the summer of 98. I know because I remember seeing the video and thinking it was the worst shyt I'd ever heard in my life
I had recorded Rap City and I remember taking the tape to show my brehs b/c it was that awful and I assumed I'd never hear anything from him again

Ok.

Nah. Neputnes and Swizz were gonna blow regardless of Timb. That's just hip hop - the sounds change with time.

I'm not sure about that
Timb was doing some unique stuff for sure though...

Nah, the Big Tymers album I'm talking about wasn't a re-release. They had a Vol. 1 (this got a re-release) and a Vol. 2 (this had the single "Big Ballin") which came out in '98 before Juve dropped "Ha", which didn't take off until later that year.

Of course sounds in Hip Hop change. Those changes don't occur without someone being the catalyst.

There's really no way to gauge the trajectory of the careers of The Neptunes or Swizz. What I'm saying is Timbaland tested the waters and him having success with Missy's debut opened up doors for them to walk through in terms of producers moving away from what was the norm.

When I say Timbaland was taking risks with sampling, I'm referring to sounds he was incorporating into his beats that were not being heard in the mainstream i.e. the crickets on "The Rain".

 

[mobbinfms]

Nah, the Big Tymers album I'm talking about wasn't a re-release. They had a Vol. 1 (this got a re-release) and a Vol. 2 (this had the single "Big Ballin") which came out in '98 before Juve dropped "Ha", which didn't take off until later that year.

Check the tracklisting. It's mostly the same songs. They threw it out there again once they signed with Universal and made some changes. This happened a lot with Bay Area artists after they would sign to majors.

What I'm saying is Timbaland tested the waters and him having success with Missy's debut opened up doors for them to walk through in terms of producers moving away from what was the norm.

Neptunes were already through those doors at about the same time.
Mannie was already there negotiating the deal with Universal.
Swizz was doing something completely different from Timb with X getting his foot in the door...Swizz and Ruff Ryders got their foot in the door.
97-98 was a transition period. Timb gets his props for what he did, but you are way over-exaggerating his impact.

 

[JustCKing]

Check the tracklisting. It's mostly the same songs. They threw it out there again once they signed with Universal and made some changes. This happened a lot with Bay Area artists after they would sign to majors.

Neptunes were already through those doors at about the same time.
Mannie was already there negotiating the deal with Universal.
Swizz was doing something completely different from Timb with X getting his foot in the door...Swizz and Ruff Ryders got their foot in the door.
97-98 was a transition period. Timb gets his props for what he did, but you are way over-exaggerating his impact.

Those were two different releases though. The '97 album got re-released and they made a Vol. 2 with new songs added.

The Neptunes were not ON until '98. Same goes for Swizz and Mannie. Timbaland had already had success with Missy and actually took his album with Magoo to platinum status by the time The Neptunes scored their first hit with Mase's "Lookin At Me", Swizz hit with "Ruff Ryders Anthem" and Mannie had "Ha". By that time, Tim was already sought after. Timbaland was already becoming a dominant force in Urban music before the others started to impact.

Mannie wasn't negotiating deals because he wasn't really on the business side of CMR.

 

[mobbinfms]

Those were two different releases though. The '97 album got re-released and they made a Vol. 2 with new songs added.

The Neptunes were not ON until '98. Same goes for Swizz and Mannie. Timbaland had already had success with Missy and actually took his album with Magoo to platinum status by the time The Neptunes scored their first hit with Mase's "Lookin At Me", Swizz hit with "Ruff Ryders Anthem" and Mannie had "Ha". By that time, Tim was already sought after. Timbaland was already becoming a dominant force in Urban music before the others started to impact.

Mannie wasn't negotiating deals because he wasn't really on the business side of CMR.

Yep. Two different releases. With largely the same songs.
Either way. I never saw a video or heard a song from that album on the radio.
It wasn't pushed.

Looking at Me was on the album in 97 though.
But either way, unless you got some receipts that Timbaland factored into the other producers getting on, then we will have to disagree on this one.

I know (or assumed) Mannie wasn't negotiating. It was a little poetic license
Wendy Day helped out with the negotiating as I recall. Bird man didn't pay her
So she had Freddie Foxxx pull a gun on him in NY

 

[PaperEnterprise]

I cant really agree with Doggystyle. While its definitely a classic that album isn't possible without the Chronic. I feel like Cuban Linx was a much bigger game changer than 36 but I see why you put it

Country Grammar tho?

Without 36 there is no OB4CL. The RZA changed the direction of hip hop with a 9 man group. Im thankful to live in NYC during the 90s