Fetishzation & Exotization of US Creoles, Louisiana history & People

[Supper]

I'm making this thread because I think it's time we tackle this phenomenon of misinformed people and people with clear agendas using my own creole heritage to cause confusion, misinformation, and sow division amongst the greater AfrAmDOS people.

Creole exoticist/fetishist are basically people who play into a marketing campaign by an economically desolate city and/or state desperate to bring in tourist revenue by exoticizing the culture and people of louisiana to be unique and exotic beyond that of which would be normal regional differences to draw vacationers from all over the country to come and spend their money there. Various historical inaccuracies, misnomers and misconceptions have been propagated by this campaign, such as:

- Creole being equated with mulatto or mixed race

- Jazz being linked to Congo Square in New Orleans or Cuba

- Southern Louisiana having a "strong" connection to the Caribbean

- Zydeco music having origins in New Orleans when it was really birthed in Houston TX and has nothing to due with New Orleans

- "Creole" being a different ethnic group from African-Americans/DOS.​

And other historical falsities that in some way involve attempting to divorce cultural aspects that are associated with black louisiana from African-Americans and often putting some international twist to it to "spice it up". On top of basically cutting out all of the other parts of the gulf coast much of which who's creole heritage is just as old if not older than Louisiana's/New Orleans is, because places like Alabama and Mississippi don't suit their fetish.


These people tend to be ignorant black or mulatto louisianians themselves who often are jumping at the opportunity to feel special and exotic and don't see the backhandness of these "praises" they receive, white people trying to "mulattize" AA culture, and non-AADOS people like Latinos and especially Caribbeans who are anti-AADOS and looking to appropriate and/or deny aspects of African-American culture from African-Americans themselves. These creole exoticist/fetishist feign the innocence of what they're doing by stating that they're not "racalizing creoles" and just acknowledging the "historical nuances" of non-anglo colonial north america, when colonial louisiana itself was very much a racialized society itself(see louisiana code noir 1724). But, they're actually misrepresenting creole people and history much more by EXOTICIZING them when they romanticize creoles out ot be something so unique & special that they're foreign to the African-American community because of colonial heritage when they're not, as the genesis African-Americans as an ethnicity had little to nothing to do with colonial North America..


But, to answer the obvious- Yes, creole in the African-American context simply means heritage in colonial louisiana. No, it's not a separate culture or ethnicity from the greater African-American community, in the same way that AAs in TX, FL, NY, or NJ aren't separate or distinct from other AAs because of the colonial spanish or dutch history in those states.


The following post will be mostly an aggregation of various post I've made on here and other places on the web debunking the notions that have arisen from creole exotization and fetishzation.

 

[Bawon Samedi]

This thread gonna be an instant classic for the Root.

Agreed 100%.

 

[Bawon Samedi]

@IllmaticDelta you may wanna check this out.

 

[xoxodede]

I'm present. I have a lot to learn. I know I have made mistakes trying to explain what I THINK I know.

Excited!

 

[K.O.N.Y]

Dap
REP
5 *

 

[Supper]

But, to answer the obvious- Yes, creole in African-American context simply means heritage in colonial louisiana. No, it's not a separate culture or ethnicity from the greater African-American community, in the same way that AA in TX, FL, NY, or NJ aren't separate or distinct from AAs because of the colonial spanish or dutch history in those states.

Just off top let me further explain this.

When I speak of creoles I'm talking about people with Afro-Louisianaian colonial heritage. As that was the original meaning. White Louisianians didn't adopt the term creole until AFTER the louisiana purchase to differentiate themselves from the white anglophone settlers from the "old US". Before that white louisianians simply referred to themselves as Acadian/Cajun, French, or Spanish/islenos. But, traditionally creole always referred to the people and culture of Afro-Louisianians to differentiate them from African born slaves. Hence why the language "louisiana creole" is the name given to that which developed by the black slaves in colonial louisiana, "plantation french" is the language of white french louisianians, and cajun is the language of cajuns. White french louisianians have historically refered to the louisiana creole language as "nyggur french", showing that there is a massive disconnect between them and louisiana (afro)creoles. For more info you should read Gwendolyn Midlo Hall's book "Africans in Colonial Louisiana". So, if we're making colonial louisiana the cut off point for creole heritage, then you can't refer to white louisianians as creole as that is a POST LA purchase phenomenon.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

You know I got those receipts on this topic For starters

NS: France basically abandoned the colony after 1731, right?

GMH: Well, “abandoned” in the sense that most of the French colonists left, and very few came, so that there was a majority of Africans in all of the French settlements in colonial Louisiana, so that French Louisiana was heavily African. And it remained heavily African during the Spanish period, although there were more European-type colonizers who were brought in during the Spanish period, but there was still a slight majority of Africans and their descendants – a slight majority of slaves, in fact. There were also some Native American slaves.

NS: One of the major points I get from reading Africans in Colonial Louisiana was that there was an Afro-Louisianan identity firmly established early on.

GMH: Yes, it was established through language and culture. And the language, of course, was Louisiana Creole, which arose in the first generation. And that’s normal; Creole languages do that, they are established very early, and then newcomers have to pretty much learn that language, although of course, all languages evolve. But Louisiana Creole had been established for a long time before there was any substantial immigration from Haiti. So that Haitian Kreyol and Louisiana Creole are fairly distinct languages. And you cannot attribute Louisiana Creole to Haitian Kreyol, which is often done.

NS: If an Afro-Louisianan culture was well-established from an early date, that also would necessarily have included music.

GMH: Yes. Now, unfortunately, at least from what I’ve seen, I’ve seen much less about music than what we would want. Just a few descriptions of dances and instruments and stuff like that in the documents, but not a lot.

.
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NS: There’s a certain amount of lore that suggests that from that point we start to see – though there was already, as you pointed out, a Dahomeyan population in Louisiana. At that point we start to see voodoo appear in New Orleans culture. And I notice that in Louisiana they have “voodoo queens,” something unknown in Haiti…

GMH: Exactly. It’s distinctive. And Marie Laveau – you know, there’s this tendency to have everybody be Haitian. And they weren’t! Including Marie Laveau. She had no Haitian ancestors. She was Louisiana Creole. Charles Lalond, who was the leader of the 1811 slave revolt on the German Coast – Charles Gayarré passed the misinformation that he was a free man of color from Haiti. He was no such thing. He was a mulatto Creole slave of Louisiana. And I have not found any Haitians involved in any revolt or conspiracy against slavery in Louisiana. And I’ve looked through lots and lots of documents. And you can look yourself in my database. None of them were Haitians.

Gwendolyn Midlo Hall

Most Black people from Louisiana were taken there during the Slave trade from other Southern States. They were sold down the Mississippi River from places like North Carolina, Virginia and Tennessee to plantations in Louisiana and Mississippi. Which is where we get the "phrase sold down the river" from.

The conditions in Mississippi and Louisiana were much harsher and the slave owners were much poorer and much more ignorant than in the other States; that the slaves were taken from which is why the slaves dreaded being sold down river and going into those States.

Btw, not all the Black people in New Orleans were from Haiti. France lay claim to New Orleans since it's founding in 1718. Most of the slaves belonged to the French that had plantations in and around New Orleans; rather than Haitians that were bought there by other French slave owners during the Haitian Revolution.

read...

GMH: For the U.S., but it was earlier in Louisiana. Because they were afraid, you know. I think there was a lot of fear of new Africans. The greatest fear of all was for Caribbeans. But new Africans were also feared.

NS: Then there was also a commercial motive, given the power of Virginia, to sell Americanized slaves from Virginia and Maryland down South.

GMH: Oh, that became tremendous business in the 19 th century.

NS: The slave-breeding industry…

GMH: Yes. That’s something else that needs to be databased, because there are shipping records giving great detail about slaves who were shipped from the east coast ports, all the way through 1860. Especially into New Orleans, but you can track them, you know, where they went from there, a few other ports, these were customs-house records of the United States, and they’re on microfilm. And so somebody needs to database that too.

Gwendolyn Midlo Hall

 

[kayslay]

I’ve always said Louisiana culture mirrors Mississippi culture.
With the exception of the French, Louisiana creole language (which most people don’t even speak) there isn’t much difference between Louisiana culturally and the rest of the American South.

 

[Supper]

These creole exoticist/fetishist feign innocence and morality of what they're doing by stating that they're not "racalizing creoles" and just acknowledging the "historical nuances" of non-anglo colonial north america, when colonial louisiana itself was very much a racialized society itself(see louisiana code noir 1724). But, they're actually misrepresenting creole people and history much more by EXOTICIZING them when they romanticize creoles out ot be something so unique & special that they're foreign to the African-American community because of colonial heritage when they're not, as the genesis African-Americans as an ethnicity had little to nothing to do with colonial North America..

Here's a good place to start.

If you include Creoles as African-American, then you have to include Afro-Puerto Ricans and Virgin Islanders!

Heard it a million times, and it's still as ridiculous then and doesn't seem to be losing it's appeal as a talking point by creole exoticist/fetishist.

People of African descent in the contiguous US have for the greater part of their history have CONVERGED culturally, politically, and ancestrally into a single ethnic community for almost 250 years. This cultural convergence of African-Americans as a people occured in many stages, most notably being:

- the domestic slave trade

- underground railroad

- reconstruction era black carpetbaggers in the south

- the great migrations of blacks from the south to the north, going back to the earliest exodusters in 1879

- legal and unwritten racial segregation in the US
​

Nothing to do with colonial heritage, "13 colonies", or any other bs. You can not truly understand African-American culture and identity without a thorough understanding these events, and guess what- PEOPLE FROM LOUISIANA WERE HEAVILY INVOLVED WITH ALL OF THEM!

^^^These are the defining factors in the development African-American culture and identity(which is a post-emancipation phenomenon not a colonial one), not "13 colonies" heritage or w/e ridiculous non sequitur creole fetishist/exoticist love to use. Puerto ricans and Virigin Islanders do not share that heritage with African-Americans, AA creoles very much do share that with other AAs like Sojournor Truth despite her being of colonial dutch NY/NJ heritage and speaking a dutch dialect as a first language.

In fact I'd say that African-Americans are more culturally unified than most ethnicities of our size because of these unique events. Although I'm not an expert, I doubt that Afro-Brazilians across different regions of Brazil cluster as closely with each other as African-Americans all across the US do.

 

[kayslay]

The fact that the USA largely moved towards slave breeding is why ADOS is such a unique ethnicity.

 

[GoAggieGo.]

Interesting read. As I’ve said before, I’ve got Mississippi roots and have lived on the coast, so the Mississippi tie in is

Great thread

 

[IllmaticDelta]

I’ve always said Louisiana culture mirrors Mississippi culture.
With the exception of the French, Louisiana creole language (which most people don’t even speak) there isn’t much difference between Louisiana culturally and the rest of the American South.

Louisiana is just segment of the overall gulf coast culture; therefore, it has major overlap with Mississippi, Texas and Alabama.

 

[AlainLocke]

I think the confusion lies in the many definitions of Creole.

In some cases, Creole is an entire ethnicity unto itself.

In some cases, Creole is just a language.

So it is confusing as hell.

I am here to learn more about this because I only ever heard Louisiana Creole to mean a mixed race person. Which is confusing because mixed race Blacks in Louisiana were called Free People of Color.

My maternal side is from Louisiana. Kinda thought about moving to New Orleans to chill.

 

[IllmaticDelta]

Here's a good place to start.

If you include Creoles as African-American, then you have to include Afro-Puerto Ricans and Virgin Islanders!

Heard it a million times, and it's still as ridiculous then and doesn't seem to be loosing it's appeal as a talking point by creole exoticist/fetishist.

People of African descent in the contiguous US have for the greater part of their history have CONVERGED culturally, politically, and ancestrally into a single ethnic community for almost 250 years. This cultural convergence of African-Americans as a people occured in many stages, most notably being:

- the domestic slave trade

- underground railroad

- reconstruction era black carpetbaggers in the south

- the great migrations of blacks from the south to the north, going back to the earliest exodusters in 1879

- legal and unwritten racial segregation in the US
​

Nothing to do with colonial heritage, "13 colonies", or any other bs. You can not truly understand African-American culture and identity without a thorough understanding these events, and guess what- PEOPLE FROM LOUISIANA WERE HEAVILY INVOLVED WITH ALL OF THEM!

^^^These are the defining factors of in the development African-American culture and identity(which is a post-emancipation phenomenon not a colonial one), not "13 colonies" heritage or w/e ridiculous non sequitur creole fetishist/exoticist love to use. Puerto ricans and Virigin Islanders do not share that heritage with African-Americans, AA creoles very much do share that with other AAs like Sojournor Truth despite her being of colonial dutch NY/NJ heritage and speaking a dutch dialect as a first language.

In fact I'd say that African-Americans are more culturally unified than most ethnicities of our size because of these unique events. Although I'm not an expert, I doubt that Afro-Brazilians across different regions of Brazil cluster as closely with each other than African-Americans all across the US do.

all facts


Origins of African-American Ethnicity or African-American Ethnic Traits


The newly formed Black Yankee ethnicity of the early 1800s differed from today’s African-American ethnicity. Modern African-American ethnic traits come from a post-bellum blending of three cultural streams: the Black Yankee ethnicity of 1830, the slave traditions of the antebellum South, and the free Creole or Mulatto elite traditions of the lower South. Each of the three sources provided elements of the religious, linguistic, and folkloric traditions found in today’s African-American ethnicity.30


http://essays.backintyme.biz/item/19

 

[IllmaticDelta]

I think the confusion lies in the many definitions of Creole.

In some cases, Creole is an entire ethnicity unto itself.

In some cases, Creole is just a language.

So it is confusing as hell.

I am here to learn more about this because I only ever heard Louisiana Creole to mean a mixed race person. Which is confusing because mixed race Blacks in Louisiana were called Free People of Color.

My maternal side is from Louisiana. Kinda thought about moving to New Orleans to chill.

Creole in the Louisiana sense of the word just means you have roots in the region dating back to the French/Spanish era.