Evangelical Christians are beginning to complain that Jesus is too weak, woke, and liberal.

MMS

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At this point I’m neither. I’ve read quite a bit of the Bible, word for word, and I’m not one for making excuses for what’s within. It’s horrible what YHWH has done to both non Israelites and Israelites. Reading the Bible makes me question why anyone would want to follow YHWH at all, is it out of fear or an actual desire?

Christianity is an attempt at softening how violent, and unforgiving YHWH has acted in the past. His actions are inexcusable, if he wants to be seen as a kind and just god.
put it like this...maybe an analogy will help you understand

would you trade places with your food (and experience the full digestion through your own body)?



Utterance 274

It is Pharaoh who eats their magic and gulps down their Akhs.
Their big ones are for his morning meal,
their middle-sized ones are for his evening meal,
their little ones are for his night meal,
their old men and their old women are for his incense-burning.
It is the Great Ones in the North of the sky (7) who light the fire for him
to the cauldrons containing them,
with the thighs of their eldest (as fuel).

Those who are in the sky serve Pharaoh,
And the butcher's blocks are wiped over for him,
with the feet of their women.

He has revolved around the whole of the two skies.
He has circled the two banks (8).
For Pharaoh is the great power that overpowers the powers.
Pharaoh is a sacred image, the most sacred image
of the sacred images of the Great One.
Whom he finds in his way, him he devours bit by bit (9).

Pharaoh's place is at the head of all the noble ones (10) who are in the horizon.
For Pharaoh is a god, older than the oldest.
Thousands revolve around him, hundreds offer to him.
There is given to him a warrant as a great power by Orion (11),
the father of the gods.

Pharaoh has risen again in the sky.
He is crowned as Lord of the Horizon.
He has smashed the back-bones,
and has seized the hearts of the gods.
He has eaten the Red Crown (12).
He has swallowed the Green One (13).
Pharaoh feeds on the lungs of the wise.
And likes to live on hearts and their magic.

Pharaoh abhors against licking the coils of the Red Crown.
But delights to have their magic in his belly.
Pharaoh's dignities will not be taken away from him.
For he has swallowed the knowledge of every god.
Pharaoh's lifetime is eternal repetition.
His limit is everlastingness.
In this his dignity of :
'If-he-likes-he-does. If-he-dislikes-he-does-not.'
He who is at the limits of the horizon,
for ever and ever.

Lo, their Ba is in Pharaoh's belly.
Their Akhs are in Pharaoh's possession,
as the surplus of his meal out of the gods.
Which is cooked for Pharaoh from their bones.

Lo, their Ba is in Pharaoh's possession.
Their shadows are removed from their owners,
while Pharaoh is this one who ever rises and lasting lasts.

The doers of ill deeds have no power to destroy,
the chosen seat of Pharaoh,
among the living in this land.
For ever and ever.
 
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put it like this...maybe an analogy will help you understand

would you trade places with your food (and experience the full digestion through your own body)?





Speak plainly breh.
 
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you have said: I have read the bible word for word

but have you truly digested it? you say its horrible what YHWH has done to your enemies

but have you ever imagined what if he allowed them to stay? :leon:

I appreciate it. I do enjoy these discussions.
Yes, I've carefully read every single word in the four gospels and have gotten through the books of the Torah, up until Joshua (and I'm still reading further). I've taken the time to deeply understand the text, delving into its true meanings, referring to the footnotes, and often using a concordance for clarification.

From what I've gathered, it seems that YHWH has taken actions against those he would consider as my enemies. However, I'm troubled by the instances where everyone, including men, women, and children, were killed. Specifically, in my current reading of Joshua, it appears to be a clear case of genocide. Despite their pleas for peace and forgiveness, only a few were spared.

Even prior to this, the entire narrative of Moses and the way YHWH dealt with his own people is deeply troubling. Consider this: YHWH brings them out of Egypt and leads them into the wilderness. Instead of a journey that should have taken around two months, they remain in the wilderness for years. Their primary sustenance was manna. When they expressed a desire for something else, they were met with death. Understandably, this led to questioning YHWH's intentions and Moses' leadership capabilities. In response, YHWH wanted to wipe them all out.

I encourage you to read the Torah and approach it with a modern perspective. Try to place yourself in the shoes of those Israelites and foreigners in what was considered the promised land. Would humans today allow such behavior? Imagine the cartels entering California, slaughtering everyone, due to a god you’ve never heard of said the land belongs to them. Just imagine.
 
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MMS

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I appreciate it. I do enjoy these discussions.
Yes, I've carefully read every single word in the four gospels and have gotten through the books of the Torah, up until Joshua (and I'm still reading further). I've taken the time to deeply understand the text, delving into its true meanings, referring to the footnotes, and often using a concordance for clarification.

From what I've gathered, it seems that YHWH has taken actions against those he would consider as my enemies. However, I'm troubled by the instances where everyone, including men, women, and children, were killed. Specifically, in my current reading of Joshua, it appears to be a clear case of genocide. Despite their pleas for peace and forgiveness, only a few were spared.

Even prior to this, the entire narrative of Moses and the way YHWH dealt with his own people is deeply troubling. Consider this: YHWH brings them out of Egypt and leads them into the wilderness. Instead of a journey that should have taken around two months, they remain in the wilderness for years. Their primary sustenance was manna. When they expressed a desire for something else, they were met with death. Understandably, this led to questioning YHWH's intentions and Moses' leadership capabilities. In response, YHWH wanted to wipe them all out.

I encourage you to read the Torah and approach it with a modern perspective. Try to place yourself in the shoes of those Israelites and foreigners in what was considered the promised land. Would humans today allow such behavior? Imagine the cartels entering California, slaughtering everyone, due to a god you’ve never heard of said the land belongs to them. Just imagine.
Oh I can, but you are thinking modern humans are hebrews and furthermore that modern humans are "Sons of Israel"

Do you know Jacob? Have you surnamed yourself Israel? Have you contemplated yet why you'd do such a thing. If you have no need of God don't call on him

but when you have need you will consider what I'm saying. And in truth if you don't fast and really contemplate with sincerity what you are reading wont make sense(because it's clear you do not fully understand what you are reading to fully take it in)

ask yourself this...how would you even know if you were in captivity of Egypt? :jbhmm:
forever is a long time breh :hubie::picard:
for you it is

but the lord is forever, his face is against you and you just dont perceive it.
 
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Oh I can, but you are thinking modern humans are hebrews and furthermore that modern humans are "Sons of Israel"

Do you know Jacob? Have you surnamed yourself Israel? Have you contemplated yet why you'd do such a thing. If you have no need of God don't call on him

but when you have need you will consider what I'm saying. And in truth if you don't fast and really contemplate with sincerity what you are reading wont make sense(because it's clear you do not fully understand what you are reading to fully take it in)

ask yourself this...how would you even know if you were in captivity of Egypt? :jbhmm:

for you it is

but the lord is forever, his face is against you and you just dont perceive it.

I’m reading the same thing that you are but you seem to pull more from it than what is actually there. Back up what you say with scripture, and we can continue our discourse. I’m enjoying it but you have to be direct in what you’re getting at.
 

MMS

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I’m reading the same thing that you are but you seem to pull more from it than what is actually there. Back up what you say with scripture, and we can continue our discourse. I’m enjoying it but you have to be direct in what you’re getting at.
its ok, dont worry if there seems to be a gap because i too didnt understand what I was reading

I also read it with the "historical" frame of mind which will corrupt the way you perceive it

time doesnt exist in the bible for one, and two the purpose of the bible is as a seed

thirdly the entire exodus narrative hinges on a "Pharaoh" who does not know Joseph.

Genesis 41:44-45
44 And Pharaoh said unto Joseph, I am Pharaoh, and without thee shall no man lift up his hand or foot in all the land of Egypt.

45 And Pharaoh called Joseph's name Zaphnathpaaneah; and he gave him to wife Asenath the daughter of Potipherah priest of On. And Joseph went out over all the land of Egypt.

now with those in mind, read the scripture with purpose rather than as a historical document. Read with it the context that who wrote it meant it for you and that what is written therein isnt dead but alive.
 
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its ok, dont worry if there seems to be a gap because i too didnt understand what I was reading

I also read it with the "historical" frame of mind which will corrupt the way you perceive it

time doesnt exist in the bible for one, and two the purpose of the bible is as a seed

thirdly the entire exodus narrative hinges on a "Pharaoh" who does not know Joseph.

Genesis 41:44-45


now with those in mind, read the scripture with purpose rather than as a historical document. Read with it the context that who wrote it meant it for you and that what is written therein isnt dead but alive.
I will do this. Thank you. I always attempt to keep an open mind.
 
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MMS

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I will do this. Thank you. I always attempt to keep an open mind.
that is good, you will get a greater appreciation for the great God and you will also better understand the gospels

its important to understand that everything after Genesis...is spiritual bread (remember how god "fed them with bread like manna")

in judaism the books of moses are considered like concentric circles (spiritually speaking)

everything emanating from Gods great decrees on the first page. Thats why I say to other believers the last thing you should be doing is worrying
 

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that is good, you will get a greater appreciation for the great God and you will also better understand the gospels

its important to understand that everything after Genesis...is spiritual bread (remember how god "fed them with bread like manna")

in judaism the books of moses are considered like concentric circles (spiritually speaking)

everything emanating from Gods great decrees on the first page. Thats why I say to other believers the last thing you should be doing is worrying

My issue with your breakdowns @MMS is that you make grand assertions, but the evidence provided is lacking and/or can be disproven within the Bible. When I show you the inconsistencies you say it's because you arent sola scriptura.

Am I to believe for 3,000+ years every Rabbi/Sage/Priest got it wrong but MMS arrived at the one true interpretation?
 

MMS

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My issue with your breakdowns @MMS is that you make grand assertions, but the evidence provided is lacking and/or can be disproven within the Bible. When I show you the inconsistencies you say it's because you arent sola scriptura.

Am I to believe for 3,000+ years every Rabbi/Sage/Priest got it wrong but MMS arrived at the one true interpretation?
well either God created the world, and it was finished and he rested....or you can believe your own narrative or the narrative of gentiles looking to escape a simple message

Genesis 2:1-3
1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.

2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.

3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

exactly what is there to get wrong here?
 

JoelB

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well either God created the world, and it was finished and he rested....or you can believe your own narrative or the narrative of gentiles looking to escape a simple message

Genesis 2:1-3


exactly what is there to get wrong here?

Let me ask my question another way.

Is there a school of thought or teacher that can be found in history that shares your biblical breakdown or did it originate with you in the 21st century?
 
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