perfectblack999
All Star
Illmatic, It Was Written, Lost Tapes
Stillmatic almost...Untitled Almost
Stillmatic almost...Untitled Almost
Classics Discussion: Nas
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Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
Apparently, I thought what the majority thinks.
Yes on Illmatic. But I had to step outside of my personal thoughts and realize that most people do think it's a classic.
The deep tracks cannot be denied.
Yes on It Was Written. Better than Illmatic in my opinion...but this was my first hearing of Nas.
We know the deep tracks well.
No on I Am...though as I mentioned in the Mobb Deep thread, this has the same fate as Murda Musik.
It gets graded unfairly.
Nastradamus? Hell no.
Stillmatic? Hell yes. Masterpiece. Even "Smokin". Although my copy doesn't have "Braveheart Party". LMAO
No on God's Son. It's one of these rare albums that's a "masterpiece", but not a "classic".
No on Streets Disciple. What a mess.
Yes on Illmatic. But I had to step outside of my personal thoughts and realize that most people do think it's a classic.
The deep tracks cannot be denied.
Yes on It Was Written. Better than Illmatic in my opinion...but this was my first hearing of Nas.
We know the deep tracks well.
No on I Am...though as I mentioned in the Mobb Deep thread, this has the same fate as Murda Musik.
It gets graded unfairly.
Nastradamus? Hell no.
Stillmatic? Hell yes. Masterpiece. Even "Smokin". Although my copy doesn't have "Braveheart Party". LMAO
No on God's Son. It's one of these rare albums that's a "masterpiece", but not a "classic".
No on Streets Disciple. What a mess.
Taadow
The StarchBishop™️
WHOOOOOA cuzz - you are wildin' the fucc out here...Nas verse on "In Between Us" ain't
better than "Sellout" or "Keep Me Down" about the same topic...
big_controversy
Pro
Illmatic
IWW
Stillmatic
Stillmatic still has crazy replay value 14+ yrs later
IWW is Nas best album, lyrically
Illmatic is his most cohesive album
IWW
Stillmatic
Stillmatic still has crazy replay value 14+ yrs later
IWW is Nas best album, lyrically
Illmatic is his most cohesive album
UpAndComing
Veteran
It Was Written >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Anything Jay-Z ever put out
LOL @ unsure
ok so basically op is a jigga warrior
i supported the classics movement but there's NO way you can put the Dyansty which is clearly a compilation album in the jigga thread when he's not even featured on some of the songs and leave out the lost tapes from esco's thread. but i know why you did it because nas would end up with 4 classics (ill,iww,still & lt) which would have crowned him goat even in this case beating pac and his 3.
anyway voted illmatic, stillmatic and gods son. i know gods son ain't a classic and i voted for it knowing it wouldnt get the votes for it but hey it's a personal classic to me so fukk it
did not vote for iww because i simply never liked the album THAT much
system is rigged though so im out
i supported the classics movement but there's NO way you can put the Dyansty which is clearly a compilation album in the jigga thread when he's not even featured on some of the songs and leave out the lost tapes from esco's thread. but i know why you did it because nas would end up with 4 classics (ill,iww,still & lt) which would have crowned him goat even in this case beating pac and his 3.
anyway voted illmatic, stillmatic and gods son. i know gods son ain't a classic and i voted for it knowing it wouldnt get the votes for it but hey it's a personal classic to me so fukk it
did not vote for iww because i simply never liked the album THAT much
system is rigged though so im out
Illmatic, IWW, Stillmatic are classics
Lost Tapes is a classic but given it was a compilation I understand why it's not on here
Lost Tapes is a classic but given it was a compilation I understand why it's not on here
Illmatic is the gold standard by which we define classic. Basically, you compare every other album to it to see if it's close to Illmatic.
There's not a single second of dull or even "that was coo" moment on Illmatic. Every moment is brilliant. Just depends on what type of brilliance you're into for that day. Some months you'll be playing Represent and Memory Lane nonstop. Other months it's Halftime and One Time 4 Your Mind. and so on.
exactly
Nas's best album after Illmatic is Lost Tapes imo. That's why nikkas are straight up foaming at the mouth for Lost Tapes 2.
There's not a single second of dull or even "that was coo" moment on Illmatic. Every moment is brilliant. Just depends on what type of brilliance you're into for that day. Some months you'll be playing Represent and Memory Lane nonstop. Other months it's Halftime and One Time 4 Your Mind. and so on.
exactly
Nas's best album after Illmatic is Lost Tapes imo. That's why nikkas are straight up foaming at the mouth for Lost Tapes 2.
I voted for Illmatic and Stillmatic
And those of you saying that Stillmatic ain't a classic
even with the inclusion of Braveheart party shyt is still better than almost every album since 2001 , the only one that i kinda put on its level is OBFCL2 and don't even mention that GKMC when no song is better than second childhood.
I even put it as a better album than Blueprint and i have my reasons even though the worst track on Blueprint>the worst track on Stillmatic .
An album is better when
1)Better intro
2)Better diss
3)Best song
4)Better lyrics
5)Better Creativity
6)Better hip hop quotable
7)Better storytelling track
vs
Things i think Blueprint had over Stillmatic
1)Better production
2)Better collaboration
3)Better sales
Judging from that assessment anybody that says Stillmatic is not a classic is lying to their soul
I'll let yall cook
And those of you saying that Stillmatic ain't a classic
even with the inclusion of Braveheart party shyt is still better than almost every album since 2001 , the only one that i kinda put on its level is OBFCL2 and don't even mention that GKMC when no song is better than second childhood.I even put it as a better album than Blueprint and i have my reasons even though the worst track on Blueprint>the worst track on Stillmatic .
An album is better when
1)Better intro
2)Better diss
3)Best song
4)Better lyrics
5)Better Creativity
6)Better hip hop quotable
7)Better storytelling track
vs
Things i think Blueprint had over Stillmatic
1)Better production
2)Better collaboration
3)Better sales
Judging from that assessment anybody that says Stillmatic is not a classic is lying to their soul
I'll let yall cook
There is no such thing as a Top 5 Nas tracks
Which fukkboy voted no on Illmatic? "whoever?" is that an alt?
too late
it was too commercial. So while Nas did up his 'lyricism', he dumbed down the meaningful observations and emotion. Which is something a lot of new school cats don't understand because they only look at lyricism as mechanical meaningless shyt.
"Atlanta and braver, I pull a number like a pager" is not as 'lyrically' impressive as "I rock a vest prestigious, Cuban link flooded Jesus/in a Lex watching Kathie Lee and Regis", but the former is more relatable to the everyday and Nas said it slicker. While the line from Take It In Blood is more 'forced'.
In fact, IWW is the definition of 'forced'.
And the biggest problem with IWW was the spotty production. It's not nearly as good as Illmatic. Cuban Linx is the mecca of all those mafioso albums and the production is way better. Consistently.
We got over that?
exactly. Production makes or breaks ALL rappers.
His unreleased stuff has way better beats than a lot of his albums
Which is the confusing part.
If you add up all the incredible Nas tracks from albums and unreleased, it's more incredible tracks than any other rapper in history.
It isn't, and neither is Stillmatic
exactly.
Pac stans.... to be expected
I see why you're in the red.
Which fukkboy voted no on Illmatic? "whoever?" is that an alt?
too late
I read that alot of people in 90's didn't like It Was Written because it was supposedly too commercial. I thought it was a masterpiece the first time I heard it, Nas' storytelling was
it was too commercial. So while Nas did up his 'lyricism', he dumbed down the meaningful observations and emotion. Which is something a lot of new school cats don't understand because they only look at lyricism as mechanical meaningless shyt.
"Atlanta and braver, I pull a number like a pager" is not as 'lyrically' impressive as "I rock a vest prestigious, Cuban link flooded Jesus/in a Lex watching Kathie Lee and Regis", but the former is more relatable to the everyday and Nas said it slicker. While the line from Take It In Blood is more 'forced'.
In fact, IWW is the definition of 'forced'.
And the biggest problem with IWW was the spotty production. It's not nearly as good as Illmatic. Cuban Linx is the mecca of all those mafioso albums and the production is way better. Consistently.
People were expecting another Illmatic with Primo, Pete Rock and Extra P all over it
Instead we got the Trackmasters
Once we got over that tho we realized it was a classic. Lyrically it was right on point with Illmatic
We got over that?
exactly. Production makes or breaks ALL rappers.
His unreleased stuff has way better beats than a lot of his albums
Which is the confusing part.If you add up all the incredible Nas tracks from albums and unreleased, it's more incredible tracks than any other rapper in history.
How is the Fix a classic, but not Stillmatic?
It isn't, and neither is Stillmatic
exactly.
Pac stans.... to be expected
I see why you're in the red.
you speak the real shyt
prophecypro
Hollywood North
It depends on your perspective of what a classic is, does it have to be 5 mics perfect or is it a classic in the traditional sense of memorable and impactful?
I tend to look at 5 mic albums as masterpieces and there's honestly perhaps less than 15 in the genres history. But then I also think other 4 or 4.5 mic albums throughout the culture's history are classic in the traditional sense of they had really good songs. people enjoyed them, they are memorable for the time and we go back to them to appreciate eras. They are FAR more of those and I think Nas has that.
To me he made a masterpiece in Illmatic and while none of his other albums were up to that level, they didnt need to be for him to have a memorable discography. When I look at other rappers and the classic albums they have in their cataglogues its usually landmark albums that added to their storied career
In that respect I do think at least It Was Written and Stillmatic were classics as well. They were memorable and impactful for the time (An underground MC crossover while still maintaining street raps and a comeback album that put things in proper perspective)
To me It Was Written (and to a far greater extent Reasonable Doubt) grew in their classic status because the backpacker mentality softened from what people first thought of them and saw that it still had great street records and was a good snapshot of a certain of rap (QB golden age, mafioso rap). I also think it had impact, Just Blaze always cites the fact that this and Stakes is High (another album I consider classic even others dont) dropping the same day created the NY civil war of backpackers vs big willie style glossy street rap (which wasn't really settled until Blueprint united both sides)
Stillmatic, is a flawed album but so are other albums we call classic, there was still enough quality material and lyrical perspective for the streets that made it impact. Ether, One Mic, You're the Man, 2nd Childhood, Destroy and Rebuild, Poison are songs that stood out so strong I think they outweigh the negatives which honestly aren't that bad. More over, the symbolism of the album as a modern day comeback album in Hip Hop is just too strong to ignore. And even for missteps like braveheart party, the dudes overall demeanor and confidence on the album is just too strong to ignore
Also, dont forget, I think both albums earned him new generations of fans and made him more than just "The Illmatic guy" and that's gotta count for something, because if a guy is strongly considered top 5-10 and its not always his best album that people say are their favorite that's more a tribute to him having a more solid discography than people.
Because both albums had impact on the scene when they came out and are fondly remembered, those albums should definitely.
I would put God Son and Life is Good as just below classics but just below under very good/excellent albums as well. Because while I dont think they may have had a greater impact on the game at the time like Stillmatic and It Was Written did, best believe they were key chapters in Nas career. Life is Good has quietly become the blueprint for a grown man album. When people how a rapper can age gracefully and what to rap about when you hit your 40s, that album comes up a lot when critiquing other albums. God Son is probably his most personable album and for a guy who always had this perceived
Also one tier below in good but not classic are Hip Hop is Dead and Untitled which SHOULD have been impactful albums but while decent to listen were muddled by production inconsistencies through the album to really be the impact albums they should have. I dont think Untitled was so bad and neither was HHID but HHID was like an actual trending topic album and the music and theme should have been consistent which would have made it a classic. Much I Am its a blown opportunity. The rest of his stuff is kinda slept on not bad. I liked Streets Disciple for what it was but I think obviously weight and oversaturation of the double LP hurt it even though I think its got some classic Nas records on it (Theif's Theme. War, Streets Disciple, Just a a Moment etc)
I get that there's a mentality with a certain generation of fans that if you cant match your debut album, everything else you make is trash and their expectations are only a product of what you gave them... But he's had way too much of a storied and long career and even the most harshest Nas critic probably finds themselves listen to a long mix of different cuts from him to say that he doesn't have any other classic beyond Illmatic.
When people discuss rappers with great discographies, his is the most strongly discussed for if he is or isnt and doesn't it say something that even your wack shyt is memorable because where always having a discussion on the varied range of what they drop? And if more people were honest, a lot of dudes who we say do have multiple classic albums also have the same inconsistencies in their albums but because they best isnt Illmatic or the worse aint Nastradamus we dont seem to argue it out more
So to me he's definetly got 3 classics in terms landmark Hip Hop albums and a the rest of his stuff is a range of albums that go from great to average to frustrating for his standard. But even at his worse I dont think he's never had an outright doo-doo album like Encore or some of Snoop's stuff or Electric Circus or maaaaybe BP 2 (this could be debated because much like Nas I think even Jay's worse is pretty good). So I think he still has one of the best discographies in the game.
Or if you've got a more stricter perspective and think everything should be up to par with Illmatic and he's got only one good album....that's fine too but then I hope you're not saying all these other dudes who never made an album as good have got like 5 or 6 classics either. All depends on your perspective.
Bit of a ramble I knowbut yeah...he's got 3 classics to me and the rest is good
I tend to look at 5 mic albums as masterpieces and there's honestly perhaps less than 15 in the genres history. But then I also think other 4 or 4.5 mic albums throughout the culture's history are classic in the traditional sense of they had really good songs. people enjoyed them, they are memorable for the time and we go back to them to appreciate eras. They are FAR more of those and I think Nas has that.
To me he made a masterpiece in Illmatic and while none of his other albums were up to that level, they didnt need to be for him to have a memorable discography. When I look at other rappers and the classic albums they have in their cataglogues its usually landmark albums that added to their storied career
In that respect I do think at least It Was Written and Stillmatic were classics as well. They were memorable and impactful for the time (An underground MC crossover while still maintaining street raps and a comeback album that put things in proper perspective)
To me It Was Written (and to a far greater extent Reasonable Doubt) grew in their classic status because the backpacker mentality softened from what people first thought of them and saw that it still had great street records and was a good snapshot of a certain of rap (QB golden age, mafioso rap). I also think it had impact, Just Blaze always cites the fact that this and Stakes is High (another album I consider classic even others dont) dropping the same day created the NY civil war of backpackers vs big willie style glossy street rap (which wasn't really settled until Blueprint united both sides)
Stillmatic, is a flawed album but so are other albums we call classic, there was still enough quality material and lyrical perspective for the streets that made it impact. Ether, One Mic, You're the Man, 2nd Childhood, Destroy and Rebuild, Poison are songs that stood out so strong I think they outweigh the negatives which honestly aren't that bad. More over, the symbolism of the album as a modern day comeback album in Hip Hop is just too strong to ignore. And even for missteps like braveheart party, the dudes overall demeanor and confidence on the album is just too strong to ignore
Also, dont forget, I think both albums earned him new generations of fans and made him more than just "The Illmatic guy" and that's gotta count for something, because if a guy is strongly considered top 5-10 and its not always his best album that people say are their favorite that's more a tribute to him having a more solid discography than people.
Because both albums had impact on the scene when they came out and are fondly remembered, those albums should definitely.
I would put God Son and Life is Good as just below classics but just below under very good/excellent albums as well. Because while I dont think they may have had a greater impact on the game at the time like Stillmatic and It Was Written did, best believe they were key chapters in Nas career. Life is Good has quietly become the blueprint for a grown man album. When people how a rapper can age gracefully and what to rap about when you hit your 40s, that album comes up a lot when critiquing other albums. God Son is probably his most personable album and for a guy who always had this perceived
Also one tier below in good but not classic are Hip Hop is Dead and Untitled which SHOULD have been impactful albums but while decent to listen were muddled by production inconsistencies through the album to really be the impact albums they should have. I dont think Untitled was so bad and neither was HHID but HHID was like an actual trending topic album and the music and theme should have been consistent which would have made it a classic. Much I Am its a blown opportunity. The rest of his stuff is kinda slept on not bad. I liked Streets Disciple for what it was but I think obviously weight and oversaturation of the double LP hurt it even though I think its got some classic Nas records on it (Theif's Theme. War, Streets Disciple, Just a a Moment etc)
I get that there's a mentality with a certain generation of fans that if you cant match your debut album, everything else you make is trash and their expectations are only a product of what you gave them... But he's had way too much of a storied and long career and even the most harshest Nas critic probably finds themselves listen to a long mix of different cuts from him to say that he doesn't have any other classic beyond Illmatic.
When people discuss rappers with great discographies, his is the most strongly discussed for if he is or isnt and doesn't it say something that even your wack shyt is memorable because where always having a discussion on the varied range of what they drop? And if more people were honest, a lot of dudes who we say do have multiple classic albums also have the same inconsistencies in their albums but because they best isnt Illmatic or the worse aint Nastradamus we dont seem to argue it out more
So to me he's definetly got 3 classics in terms landmark Hip Hop albums and a the rest of his stuff is a range of albums that go from great to average to frustrating for his standard. But even at his worse I dont think he's never had an outright doo-doo album like Encore or some of Snoop's stuff or Electric Circus or maaaaybe BP 2 (this could be debated because much like Nas I think even Jay's worse is pretty good). So I think he still has one of the best discographies in the game.
Or if you've got a more stricter perspective and think everything should be up to par with Illmatic and he's got only one good album....that's fine too but then I hope you're not saying all these other dudes who never made an album as good have got like 5 or 6 classics either. All depends on your perspective.
Bit of a ramble I know
but yeah...he's got 3 classics to me and the rest is good
prophecypro
Hollywood North
Both of them are two of the most beloved MC's in history by heads so while I get they dont have consistent sonically groundbreaking like The Chornic, Ready to Die or Kanye's stuff, I dont think they need to still have albums considered classic
MrWestGrand
The Negotiator
It Was Written and Gods Son for me.
illmatic was ok, but Im a Cali nikka so it doesnt him me like my East Coast bruthas.
illmatic was ok, but Im a Cali nikka so it doesnt him me like my East Coast bruthas.