Boiler Room: The Official Stock Market Discussion

[Futuristic Eskimo]

Cats would have to be beginners if they didn't know the power of options. Before Google started going down my cousin made about 20k on a 552 strike and the crazy thing is that was in about 2 days. Obviously it don't always happen like that but the potential from just learning and getting better at this is crazy. That's why when in other discussions and cats still talking that broke shyt and or the "man" holding them back I gotta hit them with the X. Money out here and people getting it why not us?

Im not sure that expecting real investors without formal training to start making money en masse by leveraging up their bets is realistic. People have trouble doing it with simple stock trades, so doing it with more complex instruments will prove to be even more difficult. On a risk adjusted basis, I doubt you're better off on average, but I can see why it appeals to the gambling nature of some people.

 

[philmonroe]

Im not sure that expecting real investors without formal training to start making money en masse by leveraging up their bets is realistic. People have trouble doing it with simple stock trades, so doing it with more complex instruments will prove to be even more difficult. On a risk adjusted basis, I doubt you're better off on average, but I can see why it appeals to the gambling nature of some people.

You must have just wanted to respond because all you are typing regarding the first part I addressed in the post you quoted. I didn't say it was going to be the norm and also said you have to learn how to do it to make it even possible. Honestly a lot of people have trouble doing it because they don't have self control but you just see the numbers of failure and don't dig deeper into to find out why. Blowing up their accounts thinking they about to get buggati money of one trade and don't get out when its a losing proposition hoping it goes up. That's what happens to a lot (not all) people.

If its gambling all of it is or none at all.

 

[Domingo Halliburton]

Credit Suisse says sell gold. Wow, which analyst getting paid a million a year came up with that amazing analysis.

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

You must have just wanted to respond because all you are typing regarding the first part I addressed in the post you quoted. I didn't say it was going to be the norm and also said you have to learn how to do it to make it even possible. Honestly a lot of people have trouble doing it because they don't have self control but you just see the numbers of failure and don't dig deeper into to find out why. Blowing up their accounts thinking they about to get buggati money of one trade and don't get out when its a losing proposition hoping it goes up. That's what happens to a lot (not all) people.

If its gambling all of it is or none at all.

I didn't think you really addressed my point, but fair enough.

The bolded isn't true, as you don't need to be involved in zero-sum games within the markets to make money. Buying and holding stocks provide real returns in the long-run. Options, futures, FX, etc do not.

 

[Domingo Halliburton]

CRM (Salesforce) looks like they should just meet expectations on their earnings after the bell.

although historically they usually go up after they report.

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

Saudis increased crude exports last month.

They'll have to crack soon.

 

[philmonroe]

I didn't think you really addressed my point, but fair enough.

The bolded isn't true, as you don't need to be involved in zero-sum games within the markets to make money. Buying and holding stocks provide real returns in the long-run. Options, futures, FX, etc do not.

I think I did because I never said do this and you'll be necessarily rolling in the dough. I said this has the potential to make money and even said that what I posted wasn't common or are you trying to say I didn't say that. How didn't I speak on what you asked in the first post you quoted?

The bolded is true because even in holding stocks are you guaranteed to win just by holding them? No so you taking an educated guess based on certain strategies no different than options. Just because you hold it longer (you personally just feel more comfortable) don't mean it isn't the same thing but you think whatever you want.

 

[Domingo Halliburton]

Saudis increased crude exports last month.

They'll have to crack soon.

you still long oil/oil stocks?

The bolded is true because even in holding stocks are you guaranteed to win just by holding them? No so you taking an educated guess based on certain strategies no different than options. Just because you hold it longer (you personally just feel more comfortable) don't mean it isn't the same thing but you think whatever you want.

I think it's a pretty proven strategy to capture the global stock market gains and hold for years.

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

I think I did because I never said do this and you'll be necessarily rolling in the dough. I said this has the potential to make money and even said that what I posted wasn't common or are you trying to say I didn't say that. How didn't I speak on what you asked in the first post you quoted?

The bolded is true because even in holding stocks are you guaranteed to win just by holding them? No so you taking an educated guess based on certain strategies no different than options. Just because you hold it longer (you personally just feel more comfortable) don't mean it isn't the same thing but you think whatever you want.

Calm down.

Anything has the potential to make money. My only point was you're glossing over the very high degree of risk involved. When you adjust for that risk, you aren't necessarily better of trading options, even if the potential for high returns is there. It is also very different from investing in the overall stock market, as you will get a return in the long-run with a passive strategy. It has nothing to do with personal comfort. If you can beat the risk-adjusted return of the market in the long-run trading options, then more power to you breh. On average, people can't do this though.

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

you still long oil/oil stocks?

Got back in recently. I was extremely fortunate to miss the recent crash as I pretty much went went all cash when the s&p first started flirting with 2000. I think I mentioned my only position was TRN a while back. Thought a market correction was going to happen, but I was wrong. Ended up working out.

 

[Domingo Halliburton]

CRM (Salesforce) looks like they should just meet expectations on their earnings after the bell.

although historically they usually go up after they report.

guess they hit 14 cents a share instead of the consensus 13 when you account for stock expense/amortization. when you don't use those accounting tricks they lost money.

 

[philmonroe]

I think it's a pretty proven strategy to capture the global stock market gains and hold for years.

That's cool and I agree but its also proven you can profit of options too and that's all I was saying.

Calm down.

Anything has the potential to make money. My only point was you're glossing over the very high degree of risk involved. When you adjust for that risk, you aren't necessarily better of trading options, even if the potential for high returns is there. It is also very different from investing in the overall stock market, as you will get a return in the long-run with a passive strategy. It has nothing to do with personal comfort. If you can beat the risk-adjusted return of the market in the long-run trading options, then more power to you breh. On average, people can't do this though.

Please don't tell me to calm down because nobody is hype in the first place. I'm replying to what you posted nothing more nothing less. I didn't gloss over nothing (hence why I said in the first post this isn't the norm) and never said you were better off trading options over any strategy. I was agreeing with dude that there is good money to potentially be made off of it. How that became glossing over something when I included it takes skills and this result isn't common doesn't sound like glossing over anything. I don't think its high degree of risk at all you lose your premium at worse whats the big deal in that? You can lose that same money on regular stocks. Its not life or death or anything major and your going to take L's anyway so its no biggie IMO.

 

[Domingo Halliburton]

Nomura calls Brazil, "an unraveling basket case".....have you looked at the country you're based in?

 

[Futuristic Eskimo]

Please don't tell me to calm down because nobody is hype in the first place. I'm replying to what you posted nothing more nothing less. I didn't gloss over nothing (hence why I said in the first post this isn't the norm) and never said you were better off trading options over any strategy. I was agreeing with dude that there is good money to potentially be made off of it. How that became glossing over something when I included it takes skills and this result isn't common doesn't sound like glossing over anything. I don't think its high degree of risk at all you lose your premium at worse whats the big deal in that? You can lose that same money on regular stocks. Its not life or death or anything major and your going to take L's anyway so its no biggie IMO.

Im telling you to calm down because you sound quite agitated for no reason. All I was doing was adding to the discussion. Not interested in arguing with you because I dont really care how you trade and if you don't want to learn anything here, this will be the last time I get back to you.

I said you're glossing over it because you are. A trade where you are very likely to lose your entire investment is the definition of a risky play. You can very well lose 100% of your investment in a stock, but it is a much much less likely outcome.

Do you breh

 

[philmonroe]

Im telling you to calm down because you sound quite agitated for no reason. All I was doing was adding to the discussion. Not interested in arguing with you because I dont really care how you trade and if you don't want to learn anything here, this will be the last time I get back to you.

I said you're glossing over it because you are. A trade where you are very likely to lose your entire investment is the definition of a risky play. You can very well lose 100% of your investment in a stock, but it is a much much less likely outcome.

Do you breh

Dude its a messageboard you can't sound agitated. You gotta stop thinking somebody agitated to make yourself feel important. You can assume that I'm glossing over something but that don't make it true. Also hell are you talking about learning anything here? I'm not glossing over nothing but we are not going to agree cause you on some stupid stuff regarding this so yeah it would be better if you don't reply. You clearly don't know what your talking about on this.