Batman vs superman or iron man vs cap/bucky
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Hopeofmypeople
Veteran
That's just fukking stupid, Superman wasn't on some kryptonians are better. Batman is meant to be a genius and the worlds greatest detective yet this movie had him acting like a grade A idiot. It was unearned because both these individuals life philosophy and ethic code had not been set up. Hell we hardly know the characters but because MOS under performed they gave the next film the Batman stimulus package thinking the issue was Superman in why MOS didn't make what they thought.
Norrin Radd
To me, my board!
I knew it'd boil down to what's "realistic" and what isn't 
Hopeofmypeople
Veteran
If we're going off of feats just in the MCU, Ironman should've dusted both of those nikkas in seconds. Cats will bring up Cap holding onto a helicopterfollowing fall from spaceHe's shown reflexes quick enough to dodge missiles from close range. So even in the universe they've created, independent of the comic books (where Cap beating Stark is even more ludicrous), that fight was still silly. Black Panther is a realistic match for Tony. Reed Richards is a realistic match. Cap and Bucky are jobber status without the writers making it otherwise. At least with Superman vs. Batman they made a point of showing Batman get his ass kicked and more importantly made a point of Superman vocalizing I could kill you if I wanted. Bats using a weakness that even Clark didn't know he had is the culmination of that prep time that the whole movie was leading up to. Before nikkas try to say Tony was enraged and not being his usual genius self, in Ironman 3 the nikka saw the woman he loved presumably fall to her death. Minutes later he was cracking one liners while battling the guy who seemingly killed her
Great break down but the same can be done for the BVS fight on an even worst scale. Superman throws Batman about and yet he manages to land at the exact spot where he had prepped all that gear to get at Superman. The man can see into the future I mean gawd dam how did he know that? Also what was the point of Superman throwing him around when all he had to do was explain to Bruce the current predicament he was in. In no way was any of the things Bruce had set up a threat to Superman, then you have Batman dropping a smoke grenade and seemingly dissapering from a guy that can see miles away and through walls. Not to mention if you have a heart beat you are not hiding from Superman. Overall a poorly executed film and poorly executed fight scene.
Batman clearly states his motivations for wanting superman gone. Explicitly. You cant trust an alien, and he saw how good men become corrupt over time in.gotham. in fact, HE HIMSELF saw his morals degrade with his tactics becoming more severe. If superman ever turned, hed destroy all mankind, not too mention all the lives lost from him fighting zod. Killing him was a deterrent.
Hopeofmypeople
Veteran
Again that doesn't wash because then it would be complete bullshyt for him to still have a rogues gallery. He was going to kill Superman on the basis of oh he might turn bad and the only thing that stopped him was because he heard the name Martha.
Why would we assume how he would act when we dont see any of his rogue gallery? We dont know how he would react, especially after robins death at this point.
He stopped because of lois explaining it. Martha humanized supes to him. It was the first time he viewed him as something more than an alien, since he wanted to do what bruce wishes he could have. Everything here makes sense logically, and emotionally.
Now lets compare to civil war
where zemo HAD NO IDEA iron man would show up to siberia, let alone all the coincidences that had to take place in order to get that far.And that doesnt even mention why would there be a random surveillance camera in a rural road in 1991, or why a super secret org like hydra would keep the only piece of evidence that shows the assassination when the whole point was to make it look like an accident.
Hopeofmypeople
Veteran
Why would we assume how he would act when we dont see any of his rogue gallery? We dont know how he would react, especially after robins death at this point.
He stopped because of lois explaining it. Martha humanized supes to him. It was the first time he viewed him as something more than an alien, since he wanted to do what bruce wishes he could have. Everything here makes sense logically, and emotionally.
Now lets compare to civil war
And that doesnt even mention why would there be a random surveillance camera in a rural road in 1991, or why a super secret org like hydra would keep the only piece of evidence that shows the assassination when the whole point was to make it look like an accident.
How is it assuming when we outright saw him killing people. Or is it only henchmen that get the death treatment and others get out in Arkham? He stops because both their mums names are Martha nothing to do with humanising Superman considering minutes ago he refers to Supermans parents telling him his special hinting his aware of his background despite it being poorly executed. You can shyt on Civil War all you want but BVS is a mess from start to finish and full of plot holes.
AnonymityX1000
Veteran
*looks at poll results*I knew it'd boil down to what's "realistic" and what isn't
You clearly didn't understand that scene or bvs.
Hopeofmypeople
Veteran
By all means please clarify on my misunderstanding of that scene. I know what was intended but it was poorly executed and contradictory to occurances in the film.
It's very clear you don't understand what was intended or executed.
But I will humour you. This will be a long post.
The entire point of the dceu is built upon one question.
How would the world react if superman was actually real?
This theme is explored in the first 3 films. Man Of Steel,BVS and SS. And it looks to continue in Justice League unless whedon completely hacks the film away to a brain dead blockbuster loaded with a quip every 30 seconds so nobody has to worry about thinking too much.
Superman himself as a man if you will,is torn between two fathers words. One,telling him to be the leader and saviour. One is also an "alien" himself,who doesn't understand humanity. The other is a simple farmer who loves his son. But he is weary about how the world will react to a god like presence. He's afraid for his son,but also the world because he fears the real world impact he will have.
This dichotomy of two different fathers teachings is what creates this version of Superman,and sets his character arc. Does superman hide his identity in the shadows or when the time comes will he stand up to the world,expose who he is and save humanity?
Jor El sacrifices his own life to save his son, to save his world.
Jonathan Kent sacrifices his life to protect his son's identity and allow Clark to answer the question on his own time,when he is ready to make his choice. To become superman or stay Clark Kent hiding in the shadows.
In Man Of Steel,he makes the decision to become superman. He saves the world and exposes who he is.
This is facilitated by zod. Who presents a 3rd option. Restart the krypton race,destroy humanity. Build krypton again on the bones of humanity.
He makes his choice. He doesn't do it begrudgingly,he chooses to expose himself and save humanity. He chooses to become superman and follow Jor el's path.
Now,BVS explores the effects of this decision, jonathan Kent's path,how it effects the world and the people within it.
It does so in 3 aspects,batman,lex and the world at large.
The world reacts as expected. Many see him as a god and saviour,but he is also seen as a threat. Seeing someone like that,battle others like him causing untold damage and loss of life is enough to give anyone pause.
To just touch on it quickly,suicide squad explores this by having the government form them in response to superman out of fear and a need for power. There was something interesting to be explored there but Ayer stumbled with the script and enchantress.
Back on point, BVS begins with 2 key scenes that set up batman's arc and set up the rest of the film. The scene of bruce's parents being killed,his father's last words heard being Martha. This is obviously the most important thing to happen to bruce in his life. It creates batman,and sets him on his path. It's a life changing moment.
The 2nd scene is Bruce racing through the city,seeing the destruction,the loss of life and even hugging a recently orphaned girl who's parents were just killed by superman and zod fighting. This is important because Bruce sees himself in that little girl. He sees God's fighting and the loss of life. You can see the anger in his face. This is another life changing moment for Bruce and who he is as Batman. This sets up his arc for the film.
In this aspect Bruce himself in many ways represents some audiences reaction to man of steel. He sees all this, but misses the context. A lot of people die,but this isn't Supermans fault. Bruce misses this completely.
With all that said,people saying this isn't batman,batman wouldn't do that etc are missing the forest for the trees. The entire point of the film is to show that he is acting out of character. He is acting like a villain in the film.
This information is given to us throughout the film by his actions but also by Alfred,the fever speech,telling him he isn't the enemy and so on.
On the other side of this is Superman himself. He has show himself to the world and is struggling to find his place and acceptance in the world. Seen as both a god and devil at the same time with a man in the middle torn between two fathers teachings just trying to do what is right.
Snyder repeats the skull imagery to further illustrate his choice. Instead of being swallowed up by the skulls he is being worshipped as a saviour by those same people he could have let die with more skull imagery. It's a well placed juxtaposition missed by the vast majority,MOS,BVS and almost all of snyder's films have things like this. He's very much a visual story teller,every shot is framed a certain way for a reason and it's easy to miss when you aren't looking.
Now interwoven into all this is the heavy religious themes. Superman obviously representing a Jesus Christ like figure. This where is lex comes into play.
Lex is portrayed as a guy with daddy issues and a god complex. Like the film being about how batman reacts to the presence of Superman it's about how lex reacts as well. His stuttering speech at his party is him cracking up. Superman has pushed him over the edge,now obsessed with proving god isn't real because god never saved him from his fathers abuse. If god is all good he cant be all powerful,and if god is all powerful he cannot be all good. Throughout the film lex tries to repeatedly set superman up so that he can be seen as a threat. He's doing this so he can use the government's fear to allow him to create a weapon to kill him. Lex is also aware of batman being pushed to the edge. Like his attempt at using the governments fear,he manipulates batman fear into helping him become a villain himself to kill superman. Lex might be a powerful man,he literally has a senator eating out of the palm of his hand, but what is the lost powerful man to a God? He's nothing. This is lex drive to kill superman. Batman is just a pawn in this game.
Lex represents man itself. Man's hubris. Instead of accepting superman (Jesus Christ) he sets out to prove him to be a false prophet and kill him much like Jesus was killed.
Ultimately lex sets the senate hearing explosion into fruition.
This all culminates in the batman and superman fight. Lex kidnaps Clarks mother, and manipulates batmam enough to facilitate this showdown.
Superman tried to explain the situation but batman driven over the edge by this latest loss of life wants to hear none of it. Now,this all leads to the Martha scene. The film once again uses imagery to juxtapose this event. This isn't about some gross over simplification of a shared name. This is Bruce,hearing the same thing his father said right before he died at the hands of a villain. In that moment batman snapped out of his rage. He realized he had become the villain. The film uses this moment as a life changing moment for him. The point of the entire arc was showing him act like a villain,almost on the same side of the coin as lex and later Amanda waller. And then him realizing what had happened, snapping out of it and once again changing. Thus his arc is complete. Three scenes,all shown as the ultimate turning points of his life.
Now,to continue and finish my point.
Lex,now plan failed turns to his last resort. Doomsday,an anti Christ like figure.
In yet another moment of Superman proving himself and being heroic is this
Superman makes the choices to save lex's life.
And to further the religious theme,superman,like Jesus, sacrifices his own life to kill doomsday,dying for man's sins.
If the final arc is completed,like Jesus, superman will be resurrected in Justice League.
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Youre arguing something that doesnt exist. We dont know what happened to the rogues after robin died, or how he would act. We dont see any of his villains
It isnt like batman is out plotting to murder either.
Superman says youre letting them kill martha, and batman yells why are you saying that name. He couldve viewed it as supes trying to fukk with him, but lois was there to save him. Batman still had his foot on the neck, and the spear in kill position. If lois doesnt show up batman probably kills him. Go watch it again. And batman is still batman, he wouldntt let a random person die if he can help
This post made me not even want to see that Justice League movie now.